# Where to buy pool filter sand?



## 3020

So I have been looking around multiple different forums for what the best substrate would be to use with plants and loaches and have come to the conclusion that pool filter sand would be ideal. Anyways I was wondering if there are any stores close to the Markham, Ontario area that sells PFS? Any suggestions on stores or substrate would greatly be appreciated.

P.S: I never knew this site existed until today, good to know there is a group of dedicated aquaria hobbyist in the GTA area.


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## AquariAM

Yes and no. Pool filter sand is coarse. It has sharp edges. There are some pieces that are paper thin and quite sharp. I have a pleco in one tank and several synodontis catfish in another. Both are on pool filter sand. I haven't encountered any issues. Having said that, I've also had those same synodontis on icing-sugar fine silica sand, and the fish absolutely loved the stuff. They were noticeably much happier on it and dug in it frequently. They do not dig in pool filter sand. Loaches love to dig. They will not find the kind of pool filter sand you get around here accomodating. Typically the pool filter sand around here is ground Nepheline Syenite, which is an intermediate igneous rock mainly made of silica, feldspar, and 'micacious ferrous segments' (ie, magnetized iron). This is a good cheap substrate for growing a lot of different plants. I don't know that it's the best for bottom dwellers. You can get away with it. I'm doing it. You could make much better choices if the main decision.

Cedarbrae pools on Kennedy @ Ellesmere sells enough for about 8 or 9 sq feet of substrate for 10 bucks.


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## 3020

Thanks for the lightning quick reply. I Guess i will keep looking around for something my loaches will enjoy more. If anyone has any suggestions on something the loaches will love and wont constantly be swirling around as a dust cloud in the water,please feel free to comment for it would be greatly appreciated.


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## Riceburner

I thought PFS was the small particles I've got here...









that's what I'd like to get more of.


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## mitboi

3020, if you wanna split a bit of your big bag of pool sand, please let me know. i believe they come in huge bag of 50-80lbs. I just need 10-15lbs for my 10g tank. thanks!


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## 3020

Ive been doing some more digging around and I think I have found something that might be better than PFS called Estes marine sand. Big Al's sells it so ill probably check it out sometime this week.


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## BillD

Riceburner said:


> I thought PFS was the small particles I've got here...
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> that's what I'd like to get more of.


That looks like gravel. That stuff is about $6.50 for 50lbs.


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## Riceburner

the big pieces are about 5mm, so the small translucent bits are pretty small gravel. The krib is only about 1"


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## Philip.Chan.92

I hear that pool filter sand isnt the greatest for bottom feeders, I personally get high quality white silica sand, selling $10 per bucket, sold out at the moment but I am getting some more since I am helping my uncle set up his multiple large tanks.


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## igor.kanshyn

*Decorative Sand in HomeDepot*

I'm not sure that this is what you are looking for, but I saw _Decorative Sand_ in HomeDepot.
It's completely white and its label says that it's 99% silica sand.

It costs $10 or $11 for a big 28kg bag.


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## BillD

Silica sand and pool filter sand are both sharp, both to do their job.


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## AquariAM

3020 said:


> Ive been doing some more digging around and I think I have found something that might be better than PFS called Estes marine sand. Big Al's sells it so ill probably check it out sometime this week.


http://www.estesco.com/contact.html

Email them to find out the composition. If it's calcium based you can use it in a Malawi tank. You CAN use it in a Tanganyikan tank but the fish will certainly be slightly less appreciative of the increase in hardness. It would be unwise to use in a community tank because it will increase your pH and TDS if it is calcium. If it is silica, quartz then you're good. It looks very nice I looked it up. Good little uniform beads.


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## AquariAM

BillD said:


> Silica sand and pool filter sand are both sharp, both to do their job.


Silica sand comes in a variety of grades and shapes. There are several that are softer than a jar of icing sugar and just as fine. I recently threw about 30 lbs of it in the garden because I got sick of it being sucked up into filters.


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## BillD

Regardless, of the type and grade, silica sand is quartz, and is ground to size so the particles are sharp. It needs to be sharp for blasting, and PFS (#20) needs to be sharp to work in a pool filter, whether it is silica or something else. Here is one that looks totally unlike silica http://www.redflint.com/filtration.htm. Their gravel is the same mix of colours, as i have about 200lbs of it.


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## 3020

well it seems like there are a lot more disadvantages to PFS than i originally thought... I guess ill try out that este black marine sand instead once I head out to Big Al's this weekend.


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## BillD

If you want to spend more money, by all means. Thousands use PFS without any problem. I am using #20 black blasting sand that is $10 for 88lbs with some Geophagus.


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## AquariAM

BillD said:


> Regardless, of the type and grade, silica sand is quartz


Silicates and quartz are not quite the same thing. For example, Nepheline Syenite is feldspar, mica, and silicate 'glues' but contains NO actual quartz. (Eyewitness Field Guides, Rocks, 1993). This is what PFS is made from.

Silica sand is NOT necessarily sharp. Period. No sand is. Also, something being ground down to size has NO effect on it's sharpness. If you rub several jagged small pieces of stone together in a bag eventually they become smooth and spherical.


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## mauve

I bought a bag of PFS at a pool store. My plants have never grown better. It is not the best looking sand, especially after a few months, but after being covered with plants it's hardly noticeable.


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## BillD

AquariAM said:


> Silicates and quartz are not quite the same thing. For example, Nepheline Syenite is feldspar, mica, and silicate 'glues' but contains NO actual quartz. (Eyewitness Field Guides, Rocks, 1993). This is what PFS is made from.
> 
> Silica sand is NOT necessarily sharp. Period. No sand is. Also, something being ground down to size has NO effect on it's sharpness. If you rub several jagged small pieces of stone together in a bag eventually they become smooth and spherical.


Not all PFS is NS.Most is silica sand. The sand I linked to is neither. If you check with NIOSH you will find that silica sand is a type of quartz. Sand will break down with interaction of neighboring particles but processed silica sands are meant to be sharp as are PFS. By sharp what is meant is that the particles have rough edges.When you break a piece of quartz, it will not be round and smooth.


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## Calmer

3020 said:


> Ive been doing some more digging around and I think I have found something that might be better than PFS called Estes marine sand. Big Al's sells it so ill probably check it out sometime this week.


You seem to have been looking at the US Big Al's site. On the Canadian site it's priced at $6.99CAD for a 5 lb bag of Estes Marine Sand. $4CAD more per bag. 
http://www.bigalsonline.ca/StoreCatalog/ctl3664/cp17368/si4645939/cl1/estes_marine_sand__black__5_lbs?&query=Estes+Marine+Sand&queryType=0&hits=12&offset=

Maybe check this out: http://gtaaquaria.com/forum/showthread.php?t=15159


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## 3020

Man every site seems to go back and forth between good and bad with pool filter sand. However most of what i'm hearing from PFS users is that it works well and is a nice cheap solution for substrate so I think I'll just put my foot down and just buy a bag and try it out to see how well the fish like it. If they don't ill just get something else and if they do well them problem solved. Thanks a ton for all the help everyone it is really appreciated.


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## Philip.Chan.92

There is nothing wrong with pool filter sand in my own experience, people say it's sharp, well it's kinda coarse in comparison to sand from old beaches and such but my fish LOVE it, my convicts dig in it and I wake up to a bunch of unrooted plants, I don't mind, my slight inconvenience for their happiness is a fair trade


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## coldmantis

AquariAM said:


> Yes and no. Pool filter sand is coarse. It has sharp edges. There are some pieces that are paper thin and quite sharp. I have a pleco in one tank and several synodontis catfish in another. Both are on pool filter sand. I haven't encountered any issues. Having said that, I've also had those same synodontis on icing-sugar fine silica sand, and the fish absolutely loved the stuff. They were noticeably much happier on it and dug in it frequently. They do not dig in pool filter sand. Loaches love to dig. They will not find the kind of pool filter sand you get around here accomodating. Typically the pool filter sand around here is ground Nepheline Syenite, which is an intermediate igneous rock mainly made of silica, feldspar, and 'micacious ferrous segments' (ie, magnetized iron). This is a good cheap substrate for growing a lot of different plants. I don't know that it's the best for bottom dwellers. You can get away with it. I'm doing it. You could make much better choices if the main decision.
> 
> Cedarbrae pools on Kennedy @ Ellesmere sells enough for about 8 or 9 sq feet of substrate for 10 bucks.


How big is your syno? I bought mines like 6+ months ago when it was around 1.5-2" now it's like 5-6"!! and I never seen it eat...


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## AquariAM

coldmantis said:


> How big is your syno? I bought mines like 6+ months ago when it was around 1.5-2" now it's like 5-6"!! and I never seen it eat...


Who's this Mine and how did you get his syno?

I've got 9 petricolas plan to sell 3 they're 2"


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## Cory

Pool filter sand that I have is very very small and I've yet to see a fish cut itself on the stuff. It is fairly heavy stuff which means you can siphon into it and if your suction isn't too strong you can actually go right in and vacuum it like gravel. It doesn't tend to clog with dirt as much as gravel does but the top layer will look dirty after a while so I always vacuum it when I do h20 changes. My cichlids love picking at the stuff for food and my south american pair digs into it with relish. I've kept BN plecos with it happily as well. Some of my Africans even seem to spawn more when it is around. It's really cheap, you can get it at most pool supply stores and many hardware stores and most of them are a nice white colour. Just make sure you vacuum it regularly to keep it that colour!


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## BettaBeats

cool temperatures and silica sand might cause brown algae. Im actually looking for some silica sand myself.


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