# Sand and Gravel from Lake Ontario



## mauve (Apr 12, 2010)

Hi,
found a nice spot on a beach with dark sand and gravel in Etobicoke, near Humber College. I am wondering if anyone has used it for a planted tank.
There are lots of shell fragments mixed in, my concern is it may add to the hardness of water.......


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## ameekplec. (May 1, 2008)

I would be more concerned about the environmental pollutants that can be in the sand rather than the shells.


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## Hitch (Apr 26, 2009)

I use it for some of my tanks (only after days of rinsing, bleaching, boiling, rinsing). At the time, the pollutant is more of a concern to me, and the hardness and pH of my waters didnt change.


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## AquariAM (Jan 28, 2010)

Given that sand is like $10/50lbs... why risk it? Seriously?

Wood is $4.50/lb, gravel and sand are cheap. I don't think it's worth risking unless you know where the stuff has been. Nothing's 100% safe... I mean, it's not sterile, but why add risk by collecting in a place where you know there will be more pollutants in the materials then there necessarily need to be? Just my thoughts.

I use granite pieces that have been in my back yard decoratively for about seven years but even those I boil in brine for several hours.

Also, most of the gravel from lake ontario is sedimentary limestone isn't it?


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## arinsi (Mar 14, 2010)

you should always boil twice because of endospores


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## mauve (Apr 12, 2010)

AquariAM said:


> Given that sand is like $10/50lbs... why risk it? Seriously?
> 
> Wood is $4.50/lb, gravel and sand are cheap. I don't think it's worth risking unless you know where the stuff has been. Nothing's 100% safe... I mean, it's not sterile, but why add risk by collecting in a place where you know there will be more pollutants in the materials then there necessarily need to be? Just my thoughts.
> 
> ...


I don't mind boiling and washing it. It just looks more natural, unless I can buy cheep dark sand somewhere that's good for plants.


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## AquariAM (Jan 28, 2010)

arinsi said:


> you should always boil twice because of endospores


Please explain


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## Hitch (Apr 26, 2009)

what do you mean by this dark sand? The sand that I got are from from the south beaches...which is a light tan/brown colour. Are the sand particles black? or is it just black due to the fact that its wet and appear darker? 

I would just worry if the actual particles are tan colour and there are contaminants in there that cause the black colour.

and ya, there is something very appealing about natural sand....

and you can think of endospores as hibernating dormant bacteria that encapsulated it in a heat and UV resistant capsule. Able to stand high temps and a pain in the behind to kill without the right machines (autoclave). Hence its a good idea to boil with salt at high temps for hours.


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## BillD (Jun 5, 2006)

I have used and am using Lake Ontario sand and gravel. Whitby has a nice mix of grain sizes at the waters edge. The wave action sorts the grains by size. It is made up of the rocks in the area which run the gamut from limestone to granite, with lots of black slate bits. The grains are all smooth, again, due to wave action. I use a fairly strong bleach solution to burn off any organic material. I'm actually washing up some for reuse right now. I acquired it about 4 years ago, sifted for the size I wanted, and have been using it ever since, without issue. What I have is actually fine gravel more than sand. All my rocks originated at the lake shore. They too are all nice and smooth. I don't like sharp rocks in a tank; they can cause injury to fish and they look unnatural. For a natural look, sand/gravel and the stones should be from the same locale.
I used assorted strainers and such from the dollar store to get the grain size I wanted.


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## mauve (Apr 12, 2010)

Sounds like the sand I found in Etobicoke. It does have lots of shell bits though and I am afraid it can make water too hard.


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## AquariAM (Jan 28, 2010)

mauve said:


> Sounds like the sand I found in Etobicoke. It does have lots of shell bits though and I am afraid it can make water too hard.


sift it through something


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## mauve (Apr 12, 2010)

They the same size as the sand


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## bluegill (Jan 5, 2010)

BillD said:


> I have used and am using Lake Ontario sand and gravel. Whitby has a nice mix of grain sizes at the waters edge. The wave action sorts the grains by size. It is made up of the rocks in the area which run the gamut from limestone to granite, with lots of black slate bits. The grains are all smooth, again, due to wave action. I use a fairly strong bleach solution to burn off any organic material. I'm actually washing up some for reuse right now. I acquired it about 4 years ago, sifted for the size I wanted, and have been using it ever since, without issue. What I have is actually fine gravel more than sand. All my rocks originated at the lake shore. They too are all nice and smooth. I don't like sharp rocks in a tank; they can cause injury to fish and they look unnatural. For a natural look, sand/gravel and the stones should be from the same locale.
> I used assorted strainers and such from the dollar store to get the grain size I wanted.


bleach is an excellent choice, cheap and effective


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## gucci17 (Oct 11, 2007)

I've seen alot of people online who have done it but I personally wouldn't risk it. Maybe I don't see the appeal in local sand...any pics of the sand to share?


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## AquariAM (Jan 28, 2010)

mauve said:


> They the same size as the sand


Well, I hope you're keeping malawi or tang cichlids on it then


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## mauve (Apr 12, 2010)

Tha photos of tha sand:


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## Fish_Man (Apr 9, 2010)

interesting look. 

I wouldn't risk it either.. 

you can just goto homedepot and get play sand its like what $5 for 20kg?


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## mauve (Apr 12, 2010)

yeah, but play sand does not look as "good".
My only concern is water hardness, that's all. I don't think it's going to be more toxic than water we drink or food we eat.


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## gucci17 (Oct 11, 2007)

Cool looking...looks just like that rock candy with chocolate inside

Was expecting to see play sand type of sand. How ignorant of me lol.


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## Fish_Man (Apr 9, 2010)

mauve said:


> yeah, but play sand does not look as "good".
> My only concern is water hardness, that's all. I don't think it's going to be more toxic than water we drink or food we eat.


guess the only way to know is to test it out?

I like the look too. Haven't seen what play sand looks like... just heard people use them.


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## mauve (Apr 12, 2010)

put in in vinega?
I did, and tiny bubbles resulted.
bad sign?


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## Fish_Man (Apr 9, 2010)

yes bad sign I believe since I've read somewhere else for stones that you buy at hardware stores and test it with vinegar and if it bubbles = chemicals and such on it = not aquarium safe

wonder if it means the same thing?


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## Hitch (Apr 26, 2009)

not really chemicals....per say....

acid + rocks and minerals like sand stone will create gas. Which means the rock or mineral will increase the hardness and thus pH of the water.


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## mauve (Apr 12, 2010)

they don't really fizz up as baking soda would, just a little bubbly, so I don't know if it is tolarable.....


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## AquariAM (Jan 28, 2010)

You realize what you have there can be replicated by a trip to big als. You want dark walnut large, shallow creek large and small grain (all estes, all large bag) one small black painted one small red painted (estes brand) that'll make you enough for about 9 square feet 2" deep. Divide for smaller tanks.


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## bae (May 11, 2007)

mauve said:


> they don't really fizz up as baking soda would, just a little bubbly, so I don't know if it is tolarable.....


I'm not a geologist (although the Ontario Geological Survey once wanted to reclassify my job as Geologist IV - Atypical), but the gravel you have there is fairly coarse, and is mainly igneous and metamorphic rock. I don't think it will have a significant influence on your hardness or pH, partly because with particles that size, the surface area to volume ratio is low, and minerals only dissolve from the surface. Toronto tap water runs about 7.5-7.8, so as long as you aren't trying to lower your pH below 7, you won't have significant amounts of lime dissolve.

You can test this by setting out two containers. Put a cup of water in one, and a handful of gravel and a cup of water in the other. Test both after one day and after one week.

I like the look of natural mixed sands and gravels, myself. The gravel in your picture is a little coarse to be optimal for plants, but will work. Because of the mixed sizes, the smaller particles will work their way down to fill the spaces between the larger ones, so you won't have the problem of coarse gravel filling up with inaccessible rotted food and crud.


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## mauve (Apr 12, 2010)

what's the best way to test water hardness? I am still lo tech in my approaches  
I guess this experience is going to put me on the path of sophistication.


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## AquariAM (Jan 28, 2010)

mauve said:


> at around $40? That's no fun.
> Finding something locally is the adventure.


Pool filter sand? 6 sq ft $10?


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## mauve (Apr 12, 2010)

does it look like the one I showed?


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## bae (May 11, 2007)

mauve said:


> what's the best way to test water hardness? I am still lo tech in my approaches
> I guess this experience is going to put me on the path of sophistication.


You have to buy a kit for testing hardness. But if you're planning to keep ordinary sorts of aquarium fish, they should be okay even if the gravel has some hardening effect on the water. After all, BillD, with decades of experience, is using more or less the same stuff with good results.


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## mauve (Apr 12, 2010)

BillD? PLease, forgive my ignorance.


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## bae (May 11, 2007)

mauve said:


> BillD? PLease, forgive my ignorance.


One of the people who replied to you earlier in this thread.


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## BillD (Jun 5, 2006)

I have lots of rocks from the lake, and am using the gravel. I try to find where the water has sifted the gravel/sand to the grain size I want. I scoop a bunch, and later sift to the size I want. Takes only a few minutes using dollar store sieves. I don't like large gravel and and sifted the batch I'm using now to about 1/16" grain size. I would call it fine gravel rather than sand. As much as anything I wanted to match the gravel to the stones. The last batch I grabbed a few years ago had the shell bits, but the previous batch had none. Since the shell bits didn't dissolve in 3 years of use, I suspect it is not an issue with our tap water and it"s alkaline pH. 
As far as play sand goes, it may or may not harbor toxic elements, and it is extremely dirty. The stuff from the lake needs no washing, just disinfecting.


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