# Plants aren't growing as much anymore



## Teemote (Aug 13, 2016)

Hey Guys, want some thoughts around this.

Water parameter:
Ph ~ 7.8 to 8.0 out of tap - mississauga area.
GH - 9
KH - 4-5
A/N/N - 0/0/~15-20
Temp: 76 F

live stocks: - neons x 9 - cories x 9 - 3 amano shrimps

Tank is about 6 months old now:
Plants:

Amazon sword - seems to growing really well, but slow
Water wisteria - grew really really well for the first 4 months, now the leafs seems to be melting and stunned growth.
Java moss - some yellowing
Crypt - seems to grow okay, not growing tall.
Java Fern - growing pretty well
Frogbit

Dosing:
Excel daily
N P K twice a week
Comp - twice a week

Light - 2 x 23 CFL @ 6500K - 8-10 hours on per day.

Problem:

Noticed growth slowed down a lot, some older leaves are melting, new growth is extremely slow on the wisteria... I dont' think it's the nutrients as I do dosing. Water seems okay.

The only thing I can think of is CO2, maybe switch to gas instead of excel (with GH 9 / KH 4 / Ph at 8, CO2 seems to be really low based on the chart)

Thoughts?

Here's some pictures; one is before (about Aug time frame) you can see that stuff are growing well - The crypt in the back corner are green and tall... now it's just covered in some algae and not growing upward.

Water wistera has since lost a lot of bottom leaves and I am forced to trim and replant..

Any idea guys? - CO2 seems to be my first guess as that's the only thing I am not using and I dont' think Excel is doing its job for this tank - I upped my dose to 2 x recommended but not doing much either.

Thanks for 2 cents!


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## Teemote (Aug 13, 2016)

Forgot to mention, it's a 20 gallon

And some hair algae problem now on older leaves - 2 months ago when growth was good algae was none existence. 

Maybe excel stopped working or something I don't know.


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## infolific (Apr 10, 2016)

Are you using Seachem's NPK and Comp along with their recommended dosing schedule? I ask because I started down that path too before switching to EI macros and micros which has since worked well for me. However, I'm using pressurized CO2 so my set up doesn't match yours.

I also had issues with my wisteria and adding Seachem's Equilibrium to my tap water seems to have fixed my issues. Your GH is already high, but I understand that GH can be affected by different elements and you still may be missing an important one hence my need to add Equilibrium.

Here's what the older leaves on my wisteria looked like before adding the Equilibrium. Aside from the obvious melting, there are little holes in the leaves at the bottom.


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## default (May 28, 2011)

With a glass cover and Frogbit, are you getting enough light through? 

How much are you dosing in regards to the fertilizers?
Are you only dosing recommended amounts?

I'm going to assume you're following Seachem directions, your problem may be in your fertilization regime. Your water is fairly hard, but it shouldn't matter with the flora species you have.
Your Co2 levels cannot be read with the graphs available for gas injection, Excel will not change your parameters like Co2 injection as that can acidify water, while Excel provides an organic carbon source without really altering the parameters. It's odd to say, but I don't think the issue is necessarily with Co2 in this case, of course Co2 injection would always be better, but it's not technically causing your problems.

I would step up your fertilization regime, you're likely running low on one or more of your macros, try increasing the doses of N,P, and K by x1.5 or even x2 amounts, and monitor to see any improvements. Remember to raise the dosage of everything, minus the micros.


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## Teemote (Aug 13, 2016)

Thanks for the input;

Frogbit actually grow pretty well lol I throw them out almost weekly.

Something is off, because I got hair algae now on these older leaves - my Nitrate is at 10-20 (Color seems to be very close on these API test kits) so I am not sure if I want to up the N doses... ?

I'll try to up the P and K. I know K you can overdose without problem but P I am not too sure.. but that might work.

I just thought CO2 might help as this is the only thing I haven't tried.

As for the CO2 chart, I just figure my CO2 naturally would be low because of the PH / KH relationship... (I don't actually have a drop checker)


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## Teemote (Aug 13, 2016)

Oh - yes, I do follow the seachem guideline.. minus the iron + micros (I figure comp should be enough)

So i got Seachem NPK (I actually don't dose a lot of N as the fish poop is giving me 10-15 nitrates already).. + excel and Comprehensive


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## default (May 28, 2011)

Don't dose anymore N then, just dose a little more P and K - are you able to test for phosphate? If your nitrate is so high, there is a chance your phosphate may be a little high as well, do you feed daily?

Also, I would recommend if possible, dose your Excel before lights on, it reacts to UV and having it in before lights on in theory could help with producing more organic co2.


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## Teemote (Aug 13, 2016)

I feed every other day - no, dont' have a phosphate test kit. 

I'll try to dose excel a little earlier, so far been doing it maybe 15 mins before lights on.


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## cb1021 (Sep 21, 2009)

That growth looks typical for non-co2 tank. Not sure how to improve it otherwise.


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## default (May 28, 2011)

I would suggest upping your K dosage and your Excel by a little bit in the mean time. Change your water to reduce your nitrates, ~50% WC would be good. Start doing some spot treatment using a pipette and Excel for some of the filamentous algae.

This is one of the problems with a planted tank utilizing Excel as the only carbon source. Aside from the overall cost over time, you also have to be concerned about Co2 levels. With that said, Excel seems to work well in smaller aquariums and it extras as an algaecide, but it needs to be manually added, so there's inconsistencies and user measurement error. So with the cost in consideration, I would recommend if possible to set up a automated Co2 system, it becomes much easier as it's one parameter you can basically set and forget.


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