# guess im still cycling?



## afg

hey all,
thanx in advance for the help guys.
I got a 120g tank setup about a month and a week ago, after running the recommended doses for Stabilize stuff for a week then letting the tank sit for another week i took a water sample to the BA's they said i was ready for hardy fish. so i got 3 guppies, 3 bargs and 3 of some other fish, put em in the tank and they stayed for a week in there very healthy and active. i figured at this point my tank was ready and cycled so i got some cichlids and they were fine the first week but they did kill the other fish except the bargs. the second week the water got hazzy and the cichlids got ich. Did all the steps to get rid of them and so far so good almost gone. Also added bio support and the hazzyness is almost gone. I decided to purchase a test kit to test the water my self. 

PH 7.6
AMMONIA 0ppm
NITRITE 2ppm
NITRATE 5ppm


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## afg

and those test results have been the same for 5 days now.


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## solarz

afg said:


> and those test results have been the same for 5 days now.


You're in the middle of a nitrite spike. It might last a while, so have patience.


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## afg

solarz said:


> You're in the middle of a nitrite spike. It might last a while, so have patience.


ive lost 4 cichlids  and i dont want to lose more. How do they stay alive if theres 2ppm nitrite? thought that stuff was toxic to them


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## solarz

afg said:


> ive lost 4 cichlids  and i dont want to lose more. How do they stay alive if theres 2ppm nitrite? thought that stuff was toxic to them


You can try to speed up the cycle by getting some used media. You can also try to add lots of live plants to soak up the nitrites.


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## afg

solarz said:


> You can try to speed up the cycle by getting some used media. You can also try to add lots of live plants to soak up the nitrites.


i dont know any one who can give me media and i dont want a planted aquarium so im outa luck . just pray is all i can do 

would it help if i added more bio-support?


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## solarz

afg said:


> i dont know any one who can give me media and i dont want a planted aquarium so im outa luck . just pray is all i can do
> 
> would it help if i added more bio-support?


You can try, but personally, I don't have much faith in "bottled bacteria".


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## splur

afg said:


> ive lost 4 cichlids  and i dont want to lose more. How do they stay alive if theres 2ppm nitrite? thought that stuff was toxic to them


change the water... a lot.


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## afg

splur said:


> change the water... a lot.


i did a 20% water change already.

how long will i have to wait?


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## splur

afg said:


> i did a 20% water change already.
> 
> how long will i have to wait?


tbh, I've never cycled a tank without established media. With established media, I've seen as fast as a couple days. Without, in the range of weeks?

If you're cycling with fish, you need to do multiple daily water changes if you don't want to risk dying fish. I've heard of people doing 50% w/c every day. Easier getting someone who has a dirty gunky filter media you can take.


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## BillD

afg said:


> i did a 20% water change already.
> 
> how long will i have to wait?


A 20% water change is nothing under the circumstances. You need to change out at least half the water and preferably 75%. The addition of salt is supposed to reduce nitrite toxicity, but, offhand, I don't recall the dosage.
The fact that you are showing nitrates, and they aren't going up, or the nitrite going down, suggests something is amiss. Why doesn't really matter, reducing the nitrite does.


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## chinamon

i noticed at frank's that he has a tank just for cycling sponge filters. maybe ask him if he is willing to sell you one if you dont want to wait so long for yours to cycle.


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## Fishfur

If there is any way you can get to any fish store, ask if they can give or sell you some mature filter rinsings or a piece of media.. dirty floss or a piece of sponge. I got some rinsings from a fellow member and it stopped a spike I had going in my 30 G tank in less than 48 hours. I've heard a sales guy at Menagerie, in Toronto, offer just that to a customer who came in saying he had 60 fish in a 60 gallon tank ! Yikes.. I think he was saying his water was cloudy. Made me cringe, but the Menagerie guy did the best he could.. guy didn't take him up on the offer, but he did buy some dechlorinator, which he had not been using either. 

I'd offer to send you some but unless it went overnight courier, with first thing in the morning delivery and installation into your filter, the bugs would not live. They can only survive outside a tank for, I think someone told me it was 12 hours, provided it does not get too cold or too hot. Is there no other member in Milton who has a tank you could get filter rinsings from ? Or a piece of the media from a mature filter would do the trick too. If not, best get to water changing, often and lots, or you will likely lose the rest of the fish. I made a very similar mistake when I first got back into fish some months back, I am very fortunate that a member here was willing to help me out.


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## afg

Fishfur said:


> If there is any way you can get to any fish store, ask if they can give or sell you some mature filter rinsings or a piece of media.. dirty floss or a piece of sponge. I got some rinsings from a fellow member and it stopped a spike I had going in my 30 G tank in less than 48 hours. I've heard a sales guy at Menagerie, in Toronto, offer just that to a customer who came in saying he had 60 fish in a 60 gallon tank ! Yikes.. I think he was saying his water was cloudy. Made me cringe, but the Menagerie guy did the best he could.. guy didn't take him up on the offer, but he did buy some dechlorinator, which he had not been using either.
> 
> I'd offer to send you some but unless it went overnight courier, with first thing in the morning delivery and installation into your filter, the bugs would not live. They can only survive outside a tank for, I think someone told me it was 12 hours, provided it does not get too cold or too hot. Is there no other member in Milton who has a tank you could get filter rinsings from ? Or a piece of the media from a mature filter would do the trick too. If not, best get to water changing, often and lots, or you will likely lose the rest of the fish. I made a very similar mistake when I first got back into fish some months back, I am very fortunate that a member here was willing to help me out.


wow he put 60 fish in 60g tank with no declorinator thats cruelty to animals.

Thank you for the offer to bad you live far from me. I live in Aurora which is south of New market if any one around the area would like to help send me a pm or post plz


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## afg

Fishfur said:


> If there is any way you can get to any fish store, ask if they can give or sell you some mature filter rinsings or a piece of media.. dirty floss or a piece of sponge. I got some rinsings from a fellow member and it stopped a spike I had going in my 30 G tank in less than 48 hours. I've heard a sales guy at Menagerie, in Toronto, offer just that to a customer who came in saying he had 60 fish in a 60 gallon tank ! Yikes.. I think he was saying his water was cloudy. Made me cringe, but the Menagerie guy did the best he could.. guy didn't take him up on the offer, but he did buy some dechlorinator, which he had not been using either.
> 
> I'd offer to send you some but unless it went overnight courier, with first thing in the morning delivery and installation into your filter, the bugs would not live. They can only survive outside a tank for, I think someone told me it was 12 hours, provided it does not get too cold or too hot. Is there no other member in Milton who has a tank you could get filter rinsings from ? Or a piece of the media from a mature filter would do the trick too. If not, best get to water changing, often and lots, or you will likely lose the rest of the fish. I made a very similar mistake when I first got back into fish some months back, I am very fortunate that a member here was willing to help me out.





chinamon said:


> i noticed at frank's that he has a tank just for cycling sponge filters. maybe ask him if he is willing to sell you one if you dont want to wait so long for yours to cycle.


who is frank? can u get him to contact me if hes in our area.
i think im gona give big al's a try and see if theyll give me some used media


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## solarz

afg said:


> wow he put 60 fish in 60g tank with no declorinator thats cruelty to animals.


60 fish in a 60 gallon tank can be quite normal, provided they're small fish like guppies or tetra. Dechlor is also overrated.

The main thing is waiting for your tank to cycle before putting in any fish.


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## Windowlicka

I'm also in Aurora (SW corner), and have a 90G african cichlid tank that's been running 4+ years now... I have a couple of canister filters on that tank that are in need of a clean - send me a pm, and I'll gladly hand you some repulsively disgusting filter floss media to help you to develop some beneficial bacteria!

(Sorry - would've offered sooner, but I only just caught this thread)


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## afg

Windowlicka said:


> I'm also in Aurora (SW corner), and have a 90G african cichlid tank that's been running 4+ years now... I have a couple of canister filters on that tank that are in need of a clean - send me a pm, and I'll gladly hand you some repulsively disgusting filter floss media to help you to develop some beneficial bacteria!
> 
> (Sorry - would've offered sooner, but I only just caught this thread)


That would be great!! I can come pick it up tonight 
I will pm you 
Thank you


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## RevoBuda

Hey Bud,

Unfortunately I didn't read this post sooner... I live in Newmarket, if you need a hand fire me a PM. I would have offered to toss you some germs without a problem. 

Good luck.


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## afg

afg said:


> hey all,
> thanx in advance for the help guys.
> I got a 120g tank setup about a month and a week ago, after running the recommended doses for Stabilize stuff for a week then letting the tank sit for another week i took a water sample to the BA's they said i was ready for hardy fish. so i got 3 guppies, 3 bargs and 3 of some other fish, put em in the tank and they stayed for a week in there very healthy and active. i figured at this point my tank was ready and cycled so i got some cichlids and they were fine the first week but they did kill the other fish except the bargs. the second week the water got hazzy and the cichlids got ich. Did all the steps to get rid of them and so far so good almost gone. Also added bio support and the hazzyness is almost gone. I decided to purchase a test kit to test the water my self.
> 
> PH 7.6
> AMMONIA 0ppm
> NITRITE 2ppm
> NITRATE 5ppm


Update on the levels

Nitrite. 2ppm
Nitrate. 80ppm

I'm doing a 50% water change and hopefully adding grems lol from the nice people who pm me offering in my area. Thank you


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## afg

so i did a 75% water change and added established floss with good gunk on it. Lets see what the levels will be a tomorrow.

thank you to all those for the advice and especially Windowlicka for giving me his old floss. Great guy and really nice setup


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## splur

afg said:


> Update on the levels
> 
> Nitrite. 2ppm
> Nitrate. 80ppm
> 
> I'm doing a 50% water change and hopefully adding grems lol from the nice people who pm me offering in my area. Thank you


How much are you feeding and what? Decrease that as well until you're fully cycled, leftover food won't help your nitrite/nitrate levels at the moment.


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## afg

splur said:


> How much are you feeding and what? Decrease that as well until you're fully cycled, leftover food won't help your nitrite/nitrate levels at the moment.


Been feeding less already but those lil guys are always hungry. Can't wait to get home and test the water


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## splur

afg said:


> Been feeding less already but those lil guys are always hungry. Can't wait to get home and test the water


Lol, cause 80 ppm nitrate... is insane. Maybe I'm just a nitrate snob, but my goldfish don't even make that...


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## afg

forgot to ask question


splur said:


> Lol, cause 80 ppm nitrate... is insane. Maybe I'm just a nitrate snob, but my goldfish don't even make that...


new number

ammonia .25ppm
nitrite .5ppm
nitrate 20ppm

doing a 50% water change right now.

can i test the water again in couple hours or is that too early after a water change?


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## RevoBuda

I'd wait 24 hrs. Just my opinion.


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## MattyB

*The worst part is the waiting*

I think you are on track to straightening the tank out. However, I would not go against at least 50% water changes daily. The key part is keeping the fish alive even if it does lengthen out the cycle.

How many Cichlids did you add? You may have mentioned it, but I did not see it in the thread.


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## afg

MattyB said:


> I think you are on track to straightening the tank out. However, I would not go against at least 50% water changes daily. The key part is keeping the fish alive even if it does lengthen out the cycle.
> 
> How many Cichlids did you add? You may have mentioned it, but I did not see it in the thread.


i got 3 barbs (dam things wont die, thought they be gone lik the guppies when the cichlids arrived), about 15 cichlids

the readings on saturday was

ammonia .25ppm
nitrite BIG 0 zero 0 
nitrate 10ppm


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## solarz

afg said:


> i got 3 barbs (dam things wont die, thought they be gone lik the guppies when the cichlids arrived), about 15 cichlids
> 
> the readings on saturday was
> 
> ammonia .25ppm
> nitrite BIG 0 zero 0
> nitrate 10ppm


Either something's wrong with your test kit, or something's wrong with your water. You shouldn't be having any ammonia at this point.


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## afg

solarz said:


> Either something's wrong with your test kit, or something's wrong with your water. You shouldn't be having any ammonia at this point.


the ammonia could have been zero aswell but it had just the smallet hint of green where zero ppm is yellow. looked more like yellow then any green


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## afg

afg said:


> i got 3 barbs (dam things wont die, thought they be gone lik the guppies when the cichlids arrived), about 15 cichlids
> 
> the readings on saturday was
> 
> ammonia .25ppm
> nitrite BIG 0 zero 0
> nitrate 10ppm


todays numbers are

ammonia 0 
nitrite 0 
nitrate 5ppm

ive been doing atleast 50% water change everyday. should i do another water change or should i leave it?


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## splur

afg said:


> the ammonia could have been zero aswell but it had just the smallet hint of green where zero ppm is yellow. looked more like yellow then any green


Ammonia could be 0.25 ppm, if you just changed your water recently and wasn't using a conditioner that takes care of chloramine/ammonia. I've tested tap water straight before and got 0.25 ppm NH3.


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## afg

splur said:


> Ammonia could be 0.25 ppm, if you just changed your water recently and wasn't using a conditioner that takes care of chloramine/ammonia. I've tested tap water straight before and got 0.25 ppm NH3.


i put big Al's conditioner and have been doing minium 50% water changes


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## solarz

afg said:


> the ammonia could have been zero aswell but it had just the smallet hint of green where zero ppm is yellow. looked more like yellow then any green


Good to hear, the colors on those charts can be difficult to differentiate. I would say you effectively had 0 ammonia.

It sounds like your tank is now cycled. Congrats!


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## afg

solarz said:


> Good to hear, the colors on those charts can be difficult to differentiate. I would say you effectively had 0 ammonia.
> 
> It sounds like your tank is now cycled. Congrats!


Thanks 

just did anther 50% WC


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## htjunkie

I don't mean to hijack this thread, but I'm kinda in the same boat as afg. Used Prime with the correct dosage, as well as Stability. I have a 12-gallon tank, initially I added 2 guppies but nothing changes as far as water parameters, they all reading 0. Then I went and got a pair of small gouramis, ammonia went up to 0.25 with twice a week water change. I should have done another test results before adding a Blue Ram Cichlid but I couldn't resist after looking at him at the shop!

I tested the water tonight and I get these numbers:

pH - 7.6
Ammonia - 0.50
Nitrite - 0.50 to 1.0 (hard to see exactly which one)
Nitrate - 5.0

I haven't touched the filter at all and it's been more than a month now. Tonight after the test results, I went ahead and did a 50% water change immediately, added correct dosage of Prime + few extra drops to bring Ammonia down hopefully. I also added Stability to the water as well.

I think initially I don't have enough fish to cycle the tank until now? All of them seem to be doing fine so far, gouramis found their hiding spots, and they don't seem to be bothering each other. They seem to be acting normal so far from what I can see.

Should I do a 50% water change everyday and test results?

Thanks for your advise.


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## MattyB

If you are still getting reading of Nitrite and Ammonia you might have to do water changes every day. You might also be over stocked for a 12 gallon. Not sure because I strictly over stock my tanks with African Cichlids, which is completely different


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## htjunkie

Thanks, did a 50% water change tonight, can't say for sure but I thought the ammonia is now at 0.25, nitrite is still at 1.0 or could even be a higher number (closer to purple than in blue colour). With nitrate it's at 5.0.

I didn't go extra crazy to clean the gravel bed, just siphon a bit at the surface a bit.


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## MattyB

Don't touch the gravel. That is where the beneficial bacteria will build.


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## htjunkie

Thanks, I'll leave the gravel then when I change water.


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## Zebrapl3co

Actually, it depends. If your tank is going out of control. Then gravel vac very thoroughly. It just depends. Also, don't blame the additions. Some times, it takes a while for the system to build up and crash. The extra ammonia would have come anyway as it takes a while for the poop to decompose and mess up your water paramenter. So regardless of the addition, your tank will eventually cycle, it was just a matter of when.
At this point, try not to make overly big changes to your water unless it's going to crash or already crashed. You'll be better off making small frequent changes.
Think of it like you're in a car that's doing 200km right now. If you make a big corrections, you'll keep throwning the car out of control. What you need to do is make small frequent corrections to steer your car back on track. And ofcourse if your tank is crashing, you do have to make big corrections like a %50 or even %75 water change. But if you don't have to, make small frequent changes like a daily %10 water change.
*sigh* poor fish.

*Never pay again for live sex! | Hot girls doing naughty stuff for free! | Chat for free!*


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## htjunkie

Here's the reading tonight before any water change:

Ammonia - definitely 0.25
Nitrite - 2.0
Nitrate - 5.0

Looks like ammonia is starting to get lower, while nitrite climbs up and nitrate stays the same. Looks like it's progressing except I need to control nitrite by keep doing water change. In this case with ammonia dropping and nitrite climbing should I go through the gravel crazy? I'm now thinking of water change twice a day at 25%, good idea?

Thanks for your help.


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## Zebrapl3co

I would probably gravel vac thoroughly on the dead spots like the corners of a tank where there is a build up of poop. I probably won't do %25 water twice a day as that will just stretch your cycling process to months. Keep in mind that every time you make a big water change, you more or less, kind of reset the cycling process. So only use this option if your tank spins out of your control. I will probably do a %10 water change for 2 days to see what happens. If you continue to see your nitrite climbing, go for a %50 water change to reset (turn back the cycling process) a bit and then go with %10 for a few days again. Theoretically, as long as your ammonia is dropping, your nitrite will soon drop as well. But you know how it is, some times there are other external factors that will trump theory to trash.

There is something I meant to add, but since you're kind of pre-occupied with cycling, I didn't mention it. But just a note to keep 6 months down the road. Gouramis grow pretty big. I am not sure what kind of you have but, I only know of the sparkling Gouramis that is suitable for a 12G. All other Gouramis will quickly out grow your tank and will require a bigger tank. Otherwise, you risk stumping the fish and they will die within a year. Very rarely do they survive long in such a small tank.
Good luck.

*Never pay again for live sex! | Hot girls doing naughty stuff for free! | Chat for free!*


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## htjunkie

Thanks, looks like ammonia is dropping now very close to 0, just a very slight of green hint. As for nitrite, it's not as dark as before in the purple so I'd say it's dropping but nitrate is the same sitting at 5.0.

I'll keep doing a small water change for next few days to see where it's at.

I have dwarf gouramis, I was told they only grow to about 1.5 inch in size. I'm doing the basement renovation now, hoping in few months when it's all done I'll be able to get a bigger tank. The bigger tank itch is already hurting me


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## htjunkie

Just wanted to post back the tank is finally cycled, nitrite just dropped to nothing in less than 2 days. I'm getting reading of Nitrate about 10-15 with Ammonia 0. Very happy to know finally it's done, all fishes seem to be doing great! Thanks for all the assistance.


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