# I am really good at growing algae



## Fergus

I'm trying to grow hemianthis and java moss. i have 2 13 watt fluval pcl13, standard fluval substrate on top of a layer of API First Layer. I guess i've been leaving my lights on for 14 hours a day. For filtration, i have a sponge filter attached to a power head in the sump, and some polyester foam to catch bigger particles.


























Help me out.


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## iBetta

Hello, 

I would first suggest to cut down on your lighting to maybe 7-8hrs first. How big is your tank? You need to find out how many watts/gallon your tank is holding to see if it's too much lighting. It could also be nutrients imbalance, high nitrates (which leads to nutrients imbalance) etc etc. do you use RO water?


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## Will

The first thing I'd do is add some cheap and hearty, breeding shrimp in there, cherries will do fine. But mainly, 14 hours is too much, especially for growing moss. The algae will likely always outpace it and thats the big problem I'd bet. You're plants look fine and healthy. Sustained constant same high intenisty light has been said to encourage algae growth.

I'd suggest picking up a timer, and having it on for a couple short time periods with a couple hours of no light in between. It's worked/working for me. Something like 4hrs on, 2 off, 4 on... some combination that works for you. Some articles I read years ago described algae as speeding up its growth rate much higher, after ~4 hours of direct sustained light intensity. Too short and the plants photosynthesis cycle maybe affected though.

The lights on my planted tank are on for an hour or two in the morning at the time to wake up for work, so that one can see the tank and fish, check for problems, and feed them before going to work. Then the light turns out for a while, it does that a second time in the late after noon.


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## iBetta

That's a genius idea from Mr. Hayward!!  AGREEED!!


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## solarz

You should add some CO2


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## Fergus

First off, thanks for all the great advice. 

It's a tiny 2.5 gal tank. And i've got 8 or 9 "blue shrimp" from the menagerie, and they definitely pick bits of algae of the plants and eat them. Also, 3 otto cats.

The 2 lights were what the guys at the menagerie recommended to grow a lush bed of hemianthus, but the guy helping me (not Harold or Mat) had a hard time visualizing the size, so it might be overkill with 10+WPG.

Also, I'm not sure what "RO" water is. When i do water changes, i use a big bucket that i have a sponge filter in and aerate the water like crazy for at least a day before adding it. 20% once a week, and the water system is about 50% stocked with life.

It must be a lighting period thing. That was a great bit of advice about the timer and having it on for certain intervals. 

I'll update if there is a significant change in my algae farm.


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## iBetta

that's very high lighting for sure O:! if i remember correctly, 3-4 WPG is already plenty enough to grow medium-high light-requiring plants . RO water means reverse-osmosis water, it contains little to no nitrates, metals etc (all of those small particles) so it would greatly help to prevent algae and or excess nutrients (nitrates). but if you have shrimps in there you should use that shrimp conditioner when using RO water because they do need calcium for their shells. high lighting is definetely the number one culprit imo for now for your algae problem. keep on updating us!


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## Zebrapl3co

Yes, you guested right. Your lighting is an overkill. Remove one of the light, one single 13 watts should put you close to high lighting in a 2.5G tank. Lower your on time to 8 hours.
You can try the "siesta" (turning the light off in the middle of the day), but it didn't work for me. I believe some people said that it benefit the algae more because it takes the plant longer to "turn on and off", while it takes the algae alot less time to become active.
With that much algae in your tank, you won't get ride of them that easily. You need to manually remove them by hand first (well with a tweezer). That couple with taking away one of your light and lowering the photo period to 8 hours should fix a majority of your algae problem.
You can also dose Seachem Excel; which is a fertilizer. If you double dose, it's been know to help kill off the algae. However, I would take out the shrimps. Double dosing Excel is bad for the shrimps.
Good luck

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## iBetta

to clean off hair algae the lazy way, you can also use a toothbrush (but remember to clean it first lol) and just twirl it on the hair algae like spaggetthi (sorry thats totally the wrong spelling) and you'll get a massive ball of algae like cotton candy XD.


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## ciao

Zebrapl3co said:


> Yes, you guested right. Your lighting is an overkill. Remove one of the light, one single 13 watts should put you close to high lighting in a 2.5G tank. Lower your on time to 8 hours.
> You can try the "siesta" (turning the light off in the middle of the day), but it didn't work for me. I believe some people said that it benefit the algae more because it takes the plant longer to "turn on and off", while it takes the algae alot less time to become active.
> With that much algae in your tank, you won't get ride of them that easily. You need to manually remove them by hand first (well with a tweezer). That couple with taking away one of your light and lowering the photo period to 8 hours should fix a majority of your algae problem.
> You can also dose Seachem Excel; which is a fertilizer. If you double dose, it's been know to help kill off the algae. However, I would take out the shrimps. Double dosing Excel is bad for the shrimps.
> Good luck


Does spraying / injecting Seachem Flourish™ Excel, kill the algae for good? Are their any chaces of the Algae to come back?


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## iBetta

I've heard that moss/algae don't tolerate ferts/excel well. people (me as well) who were doing the dry-start method would dilute some excel (10% excel, 90% RO/tap water) into a spray bottle and spray that once every two days or so and that would prevent algae growth. I'm sure doing some in an submersed tank has the same effect. algae comes from nutrient imbalance and lighting conditions. so having a balance in nutrients means the existing plants could outcompete the algae . but just like Zebrapl3co said, overdosing excel could be harmful to shrimps, so be careful and just follow the directions on the bottle . good luck! ive been spraying my HC cuba (dry-start method) and i dont see any algae so far!


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## iBetta

oh and the HC cuba have started to have runners!


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## iBetta

I would also suggest to put some floating plants like duckweed because they are really effective to control algae for 2 reasons:

1. they soak up any excess nutrients, nitrates really well
2. they help block out some of the light and thus lower the light penetration/intensity.

The only problem that could arise in the future is that you might find it hard to totally remove them if you ever wanted to since they propagate like crazy (thus making it effective to cover the entire tank/water surface and control algae).

But if you have a larger tank with larger fish like cichlids and goldfish, these guys love them. just give 1-2 nettings to them and they will finish it lol. duckweed is also a good alternative for fish diet b/c i heard they do contain carotenoids which really brings out a fish's colouring. sorry i talk too much XD


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## fishclubgirl

iBetta has some really good ideas. I run some crazy lighting on some of my tanks and do the algae battle too. Floating plants don't have be duckweed, pennywort, hornwort or riccia can help to take away the nutrients. Someone else suggested CO2, great idea.You could do a DIY unit on a tank that small. As well, nerite snails and bristlenose are great algae eaters. I have a 10 gallon that I just about gave up on but the addition of 8 baby bns and pennywort and no more algae!!!


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## ciao

Can Nerite snails eat thread/ hair or fuzz algae?


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## fishclubgirl

Good question, all I know is I have nerites in my high light tanks(6 wpg and over) and no hair algae. Is it them, CO2, mollies, BN or the fact I have fast growing stem plants in there or a combo....


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## Zebrapl3co

ciao said:


> Does spraying / injecting Seachem Flourish™ Excel, kill the algae for good? Are their any chaces of the Algae to come back?


Sorry, I kind of dropped out of this thread. But in answer to your question. No. You can always get algae again if your tank is out of balance or have an excess of fertilizers. The key of overdosing excel is to benefit the plants while killing off the algae. This allows the plant to grow to a point where they can out compete the algae for fertz. But if you ever fall back into excess fertz, algae will always grow.



ciao said:


> Can Nerite snails eat thread/ hair or fuzz algae?


No they don't really eat hair algae. They are very good at scraping those powdering algae that grows on the glass though.
Hair algae is actually the easiest to get rid of. If you keep pulling them off every day, you'll eventually get rid of them. It's the other types that attaches to the plant that you can't really get rid of.

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## ciao

Zebrapl3co said:


> Sorry, I kind of dropped out of this thread. But in answer to your question. No. You can always get algae again if your tank is out of balance or have an excess of fertilizers. The key of overdosing excel is to benefit the plants while killing off the algae. This allows the plant to grow to a point where they can out compete the algae for fertz. But if you ever fall back into excess fertz, algae will always grow.
> 
> No they don't really eat hair algae. They are very good at scraping those powdering algae that grows on the glass though.
> Hair algae is actually the easiest to get rid of. If you keep pulling them off every day, you'll eventually get rid of them. It's the other types that attaches to the plant that you can't really get rid of.


Thanks a lot for your kind answers ....really appreciate it


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## Fergus

Some updates. I've backed the lighting off by about 5 inches, i've gotten more Fluval CO2 canisters, and i added some Marineland "Premium Carbon - ammonia neutralizing blend" in my overflow box. I've also reduced the lighting period to about 10 hours a day.


























Not totally perfect, but a lot less algae.


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## Fergus

I'll post some pics in a week to show how the new regime is working.


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## Fergus

Also, in the sump I swapped the aquaclear 10 powerhead for a maxijet 600, so the water in the 2.5 is replaced by the output of the sump completely about once every minute. I figure the increased current will help give algae a harder time adhering to surfaces.


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## ubr0ke

the reason rasing the light somewhat worked is that your decreasing the demand for co2 and nutrients...less light less demand..

decrease the light to 8 hours..keep that fluval co2 unit running..and add ferts...
Ill guarentee my suggestion will work to get rid of all ur algae.


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## alexxa

Zebrapl3co said:


> Sorry, I kind of dropped out of this thread. But in answer to your question. No. You can always get algae again if your tank is out of balance or have an excess of fertilizers. The key of overdosing excel is to benefit the plants while killing off the algae. This allows the plant to grow to a point where they can out compete the algae for fertz. But if you ever fall back into excess fertz, algae will always grow.
> 
> No they don't really eat hair algae. They are very good at scraping those powdering algae that grows on the glass though.
> Hair algae is actually the easiest to get rid of. If you keep pulling them off every day, you'll eventually get rid of them. It's the other types that attaches to the plant that you can't really get rid of.


im unlucky that i hv the thread alage that attaches to my hc...
wt can i do?


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## ubr0ke

do a 3 day blackout...do water changes daily with a 2x the recommended dose of excel.
after the 3 days make sure to continue to add 2x excel and decrease light..

You need to fertilize macros and micros...if ur not doing so already.


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## alexxa

ubr0ke said:


> do a 3 day blackout...do water changes daily with a 2x the recommended dose of excel.
> after the 3 days make sure to continue to add 2x excel and decrease light..
> 
> You need to fertilize macros and micros...if ur not doing so already.


i thought excess nutrients are the causes of algae...
i hvn't add any fert yet because the tank is only cycled for 1week


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## Zebrapl3co

alexxa said:


> i thought excess nutrients are the causes of algae...
> i hvn't add any fert yet because the tank is only cycled for 1week


It's OK to dose Excel though. It should be fine. Actually, that's my method of starting up a tank. I always start off the first 2 weeks with Seachem Excel and then switch to the EI method.
If it's a big tank, you might need to spot treat instead. By that I mean use a turkey baster or syringe to squirt excel directly at the affected spot. Not as effective but it's better nothing though.

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## ubr0ke

excessive nutrients have nothing to do with algae....I have 4 planted tanks...all of which would have what you consider excess nutrients...My high light co2 injected tanks has 60-80ppm of nitrates at all times....my non co2 has about 20ppm...I have no algae in any tanks...

excessive nutrients causing algae is a myth...its simply not true..think of it this way....how can excess nutrients cause algae when algae needs a lot less nutrients to grow then plants...so when limtiing nutrients all your hurting is the plants....the only way to keep your tanks from algae is to have healthy growing plants..to have healthy plants you need to supply nitrogen, phosphates, and potassium in excess. The reason you want nutrients in excess is so that they never run out of anything...thats when you see problems...

if you keep nutrients in excess and you still get algae then its almost always a light-co2 issue...so you either lower light or add more co2..in non co2 add more excel or lower light..


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## alexxa

after doing 50% wc and 7ml excel, the thread algae stops growing..


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## Fergus

I just want to say thanks again for all the great advice.


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## Fergus

*UPDATE - I managed to crack the tank -*

I'm not going to say how, but it was my fault. I bought a Fluval Flora and replanted after removing the algae. I lost a lot of hemianthus, but it will come back.


















































Any suggestions as to the layout?

Also, i've switched the lighting period to about 9 hours. The fine filamentous algae seems to be gone but I've been getting some staghorn growing in its place. Not nearly as rampant, but still a detraction. I've heard that has something to do with the ammonia level in the tank, but that cant be it. There is about 40 gal in the system, and i do 30% water changes weekly. The amount of livestock (hate that word) i have in the tank would be appropriate for a 5 gal tank.

I'm diffusing CO2 and i dose 4 ml of Seachem Flourish after the weekly water change.


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## ubr0ke

adding co2 increases the "hunger" of plants. Think of it like someone doing steroids but having nothing to eat..
you need to add more then seachem flourish..All that solution is a micro mix..It contains macro's but not enough to matter..if ur not comfortable with dry ferts, just pick up the rest of the seachem line..nitrogen, phosphates, and potassium..

Remove as much algae as possible..start dosing and it wont grow back


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## Fergus

Oh, thanks. Good analogy. I'll do a run to the menagerie and update in about a week.


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## Fergus

The bottle on the right is Tailored aquatics chelated iron.


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## DaFishMan

I'm pretty good at growing algae too lol

When I had to leave my light on for 2 wks in the 75g for angel babies the algae really went nuts and the increased feedings to the parents I'm sure added to overall nitrates and phosphates too. After moving out the fry I did about 3 caps of excel then a 4 day blackout. All the long stuff and the worse of the rest is now gone. my lights t5ho, 11 hrs daily plus the 2nd light I added that stayed on all the time for the fry. Took the 2nd one off, cut the other back to 6 hrs a day. Now comes some cleaning and water changes.


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## ubr0ke

what chelate is used in that iron you have?...edta, dtpa, gluconate?..
gluconate and edta work well with softer water where as dtpa works better with soft or harder water..


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## Fergus

I heard back from The Tailored Aquatics.

"Hi Fergus,
Thank you for your interest in Tailored Aquatics and for already using our products.
The iron in this product is chelated with Diethylenetriaminepentaacetic acid but most people use the term DTPA. I've found DTPA to be one of best chelates on the market.
Please let me know if you have any other questions.
Sincerely,
Brad Taylor
Tailored Aquatics"


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## ubr0ke

your iron is exactly what you want..


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