# 65G slice of heaven



## df001

*65G planted community*

Thanks to another member(thanks CarmenH), we've got a great deal to start us off!

65gallon (36x18x24) Miracles in showroom condition with a coralife 2 bulb t5ho And eco-complete with MTS  and assorted plants!










Of course now the pressure is on to build/find/remake a stand because the temp location isn't ideal!

And of course I gotta do something temporary to keep things happy happy till we come up with the plant list and scape design we want.


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## df001

*To make, or not to make, that is the question: tank stand*

So far I see a few options, one of which will likely be decided on today.
Option one;
LFS - buy a somewhat mediocre(aesthetically) stand ready to go.
pro's price will be cheap, and can likely call around to BA and have one by mid day.

cons: Ugly UGGGGLY! I really cant abide crappy miter joints, or bad paint jobs/veeneer work

option two; Repurpose(after reinforcing) standard base cabinets.
pros - flatpack cabinets are available darn near every big box, easy and quick turn around. Get just about any color/style I want.

cons: need to reinforce, will need to adjust for sizing etc, will be more expensive.

option three(a) build custom cabinet out of hardwood
pros: I already have the cherry lumber, and maple veneer plywood so material cost is next to nil. Can design the aesthetic to be whatever I want

cons: time, tank stays in stasis till the stand is present

(b) make stand out of 2x4 and existing plywood
pros: - stupidly strong and steady, easy to level etc. Fast to build and assemble ie done by the end of today. not expensive

cons - uuuuuugly ugly ugly, and did i mention... ugly!


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## Rmwbrown

Take the time and build the stand you want. Once your set up and looking at your gorgeous planted tank, you will regret your impatience while looking at a crap stand. Or at least, I know i have int he past. 

If you want a quick solution that also looks good, there are a few DIY plans for Amano style stands... or if the wood you have around is any indication of your wood working/cabinet building experience.. just look at one and build it. I knocked one off in a night in the shop and though i wish i took a bit more time finding a better way to mount the door, it looks good.


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## Kooka

I agree with Robert, building your own stand is far more rewarding and you wont regret it in the end. The BA generic stands are terrible (I know from experience), their overall build quality is far from "top-knotch". Anytime I buy any particle-board furniture piece, something always is inevitably wrong with it. 

Looking forward to seeing your progress!


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## df001

Agreed, am working on stand design now, will fabricate tomorrow likely.

need to nail down a few details to ensure functionality:

size of 10lb co2 tank? (height and diameter) w/ or w/o regulator is fine, as i'm not sure what regulator I'll get yet.

Weight of 65g tank + water + substrate etc is aprox 800 lbs?

Want to make sure the cabinet is sufficiently overbuilt to handle the load.

off to sketchup, rendering to follow shortly.


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## carmenh

Yay! Tagging along!


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## Rmwbrown

The Co2 tank is going to be around 22" high by around 8" wide. Everyone seems to go really crazy on the structure and builds some really bulky 2/4 internal frame. I'm not sure how necessary it is in most cases. As we have all concluded the big als stands suck, but they will hold a fish tank.. most of the time with 3 or 4 uprights made out of 3/4" particle board. My 25 gallon stand is supported by two 3/4" plywood uprights and its not going anywhere. 

Obviously you need to build something your comfortable with, but it seems most sacrifice style for a bulky internal frame.


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## df001

so in playing around with sketchup, I'm thinking a 3/4" plywood construction torsion box frame, supported at either end by a plywood panel. the whole thing topped with a peice of 3/4 ply

Obviously there are a lot of details missing in the attached drawings; doors, cabinet back for stability etc, I figure i'll grab a co2 tank tomorrow just to make sure on size etc, and see what I can come up with. 

my main concerns are - a strong enough base that wont deflect so as not to put undue stress on the tank, keeping the base height reasonable and still being able to fit the co2 tank, reactor, inline heater, and other tank accessories neatly underneath.

I'm also now starting to think about plumbing for water changes, do a simple bypass off the filter so all I'll have to do is run a hose, open the valve and let'r rip. its about 10' to the kitchen sink from where the tank will be.


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## Rmwbrown

How do you plan on securing the torsion box to the plywood frame... (glue and screw?). How well will this transfer the weight? I really know nothing about this, but looking at other stands i found that the top normally sits on plywood/particular board.. which i assume is for efficient weight transfer??. Like i said though, I really don't understand the physics of all this...


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## df001

Rmwbrown said:


> How do you plan on securing the torsion box to the plywood frame... (glue and screw?). How well will this transfer the weight? I really know nothing about this, but looking at other stands i found that the top normally sits on plywood/particular board.. which i assume is for efficient weight transfer??. Like i said though, I really don't understand the physics of all this...


yeah, exactly glue and screw the torsion box to the side-panels, the main load transfer is via the 3/4" top which will be bearing directly on the side panels, the torsion box is just there to prevent deflection.

I'm sorta doing this by the seat of my pants, i could totally ignore all of the above and do something different... I'm even thinking about welding some steel.


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## df001

So I got a few hours in the shop, made the torsion box top, its not pretty, but its dead on flat! I'll still likely add a 1/2" layer of foam underneath the tank just in case.

I've modified the design slightly, and added an extra cross-bar under where the back edge of the tank will be, it's likely unnecessary given the sheet of 3/4 on top, but I had the material so what the heck.

first photo is the torsion box frame assembled, the second is with the stand top glued and screwed in place (top down).

the torsion frame is 3/4 spruce ply, the cabinet top and other pieces are leftover 3/4" paint grade maple ply


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## Kooka

Lookin' good... As for the extra bracing, the more the merrier I always say


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## df001

*Cabinetry! Progress happening here!! Woohoo!!*

So i got the cabinet base assembled, and built the cabinet!
Then spent the rest of the evening dressing stock for trim and doors.
Note the torsion box supported by additional pieces of ply. There is continuous support to the oak base.

Basically i built the whole thing with shop scraps, leftovers from other projects, so in effect no materials cost.

Note the lack of center support At the front, Im not 100% that i can get away without it, But would prefer to if i can, i tested it with about 400lbs and had no measureable deflection.

That said, im being prudent about it, i'm gonna make a brace for it and put it in place when i fill the tank, if it deflects at all, it will press the brace into place, at which point i'll make it permanent. If it doesnt deflect, once the tank is full i'll pull it out.

To be clear, the brace will be a very snug fit prior to filling.

As for the trim, the face will be trimmed with cherry and the doors in a shaker style, but im not sure if i should do the rails and stiles for the two doors out of cherry or maple, the inner panels will be maple.

What do you think?


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## df001

*Houston, we have doors.... Sort of.*

I got some shop time in earlier today making the doors, did a pre-assemble to make sure everything fits, will finish the panel tomorrow before I glue up the doors.

I ended up going with the cherry and maple mix, we like the contrast, matches the storage unit I built a while back.

I feel kinda bad posting all this build stuff, without any photos of actual plant stuff, but I promise you'll get some soon!!


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## Rmwbrown

Nice work! This is all post worthy.


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## df001

photo bump.

 snowblower is broken
 filter is broken
 truck needs some repairs

its all irrelevant though 

I finished adding the trim pieces yesterday, today I got the first coat of varathane on the cabinet. Should be able to finish it off tomorrow, which means you may well have photos of *gasp* the tank, *on* the stand tomorrow, with actual honest to goodness plants!

Also a big thanks to holocron for the co2 setup.

(the shims are to hold the doors in place as the hinges (euro) werent installed yet)


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## Rmwbrown

Nice work, this is looking great. you must have a pretty good shop set up to get all this done so quickly... would have took me a night to clean the shop and get the table saw cleaned off before could even think about getting the door frames cut.


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## df001

*Why I need a HVLP sprayer, alternatively high on isobutane...*

Believe it or not, my shop space is a single car garage, half of which is storage...
Machines on mobile bases, shelves on one wall etc.

Just did the last coat of varathane with spraybombs, even with my respirator Im feeling the effects of the propellant. Anyone want to buy me a hvlp unit for my birthday??

I love how fast this waterbased varathane hardens off

Edit - added photo. and we're in!

I ended up making a center brace to act as a backstop for both the doors, so the issue is now moot. the stand has been drilled to run plumbing/electrical as necessary, tomorrow we're grabbing shelves (yay ikea) to go beside it, as well as some hardscape materials - rock, some driftwood, and then the fun begins!!!


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## carmenh

Yay, can't wait for more pics once you have stuff in!


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## Riceburner

very nice work.


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## df001

*first plant photos!*

So to be clear, this isnt at all scaped, I have the two wood peices soaking, but I needed to get the plants dealt with so they wouldn't croak

the plan is to scape it after I get some rock next weekend. I'm gonna add some netlea to the eco-complete, and add the wood then.

Much thanks to CarmenH and Kooka for the hookup! Also grabbed a bunch crypts and other stuff from CAS.

current plants in the tank sort-of left to right ish
Val, Rotala indica, Hygro - unknown type. Mystery crypt? possibly wendti?, crypt wendtii, crypt wilsii, one little miniscule sprig of mystery anubias, lotus, stargrass, and last but not least amazon swords.

I know there's a bunch of stuff that'll get pretty big ie the swords, the lotus etc. but my attitude is I can always rip them out later.

Also, the eco-complete that I got with the tank has MTS (Thanks CarmenH) and I was REALLY careful to inspect and rinse the new plants before they went in, yet to my surprise I found this guy chugging around on the glass shortly there-after, the photo is really blury, but any chance anyone can ID? total size about 5mm


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## Kooka

Wow, this tank is going to look fully awesome scaped. Have you considered any carpeting plants for your foreground? With the amount of lighting you have and the depth of the tank I'd go with some Staurogyne repens or chain sword in the front portions. What kind of filter are you running on the tank now?


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## Kooka

Oh and the snail in your pic looks like a run-of-the-mill pond or mud snail. I would remove it before it starts laying eggs!


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## df001

To answer your question kooka - I've got the Ehiem 2213 fixed and running perfectly - still not sure its enough turn-over for the tank.
Yeah, so far the snail is just zooming around the glass, fast enough to make me think (s)he wants to grow up to be in the never-ending story. its the only one i've seen, and so far it seems content to stay on the glass.

that said you know what they say about snails, if you've seen one, there are most certainly more!

Checked the water this morning, ph 7.6, but that's without the co2 running properly, dont have the reactor going yet.

ammonia - 0ppm nitrite 0ppm, nitrate 0-5ppm... I think the plants are hungry... they've been pearling all day!

We stopped at BA scarb to get some stuff and noticed they had dalmation molly's on sale, they looked really really good. so we grabbed 4, its been a while since i've sex'd them, but I'm pretty sure we've got 1 fine gentleman and 3 lovely ladies to keep him happy 

They're currently exploring, and looking good!

some time this week I've got to build the co2 reactor (I'm bubbling it into a powerhead atm)

But for now its time to build Ikea shelves!


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## carmenh

Looking good! You definitely want to get the pond snail out. Either that or get clown loaches


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## df001

*No loaches, so no more pondsnail.*

Everything seems well, seeing new growth on plants (roots and growth at nodes) Got a slight algae bloom happening.
havent gotten the timer/under cabinet stuff sorted out yet.

Built the shelves for either side. What an experience...


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## df001

tank is doing well, havnt gotten ferts sorted, not to woried about it till I do the re-scape. driftwood is soaking nicely, no issues. will get my rock this weekend and go with it from there.

one thing I have noticed which is kind of cool, is there appear to be some sort of micro-critters in the water - about .5 mm long by .25mm, no idea what they are, but the mollies are eating them with relish, some appear to have 2 apendages for motion, the others a bit of a tail. Any thoughts??

Also - good suggestion on the Staurogyne repens Kooka, i think thats what we're gonna go with for foreground.


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## jimmyjam

the stand looks awesome.. I would totally buy one or trade for a mass amount of any plant u want for a 3 footer. Let me know =)


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## Kooka

I think its time for some close up shots of the tank, its coming along really nicely from what I can see. The stand really complements your IKEA furniture and parquet floor tiles. 
If your having algae issues, the best thing to do is get the CO2 levels up and possibly add some ottos/SAE. Eventually things should stabilize. As for the critters you mentioned, think of them as free live food for your fish... can't see any problems there!


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## df001

Kooka said:


> I think its time for some close up shots of the tank, its coming along really nicely from what I can see. The stand really complements your IKEA furniture and parquet floor tiles.


No point in close-ups yet, I thumped the plants in just to keep em happy till i'm ready to scape it. Getting the rocks this weekend, will be busy as heck next week but at some point I'll add the rocks and DW and get the plants I've got into place.

Thanks, I planned it to look this way, we're really happy with it!!



> If your having algae issues, the best thing to do is get the CO2 levels up and possibly add some ottos/SAE. Eventually things should stabilize. As for the critters you mentioned, think of them as free live food for your fish... can't see any problems there!


Yeah, I've been slowly increasing the co2, need to get another timer so I can have it kick the solenoid in an hour? or so before the lights. The green-water bloom seems to have cleared off, other than that very minor.

yikes... bed-time will finish post tomorrow


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## df001

*I've got the granite lazyness blues*

So I have a crapload of granite, two peices of cool wood, and absolutely no inspiration on how to combine them...

tape is aprox tank dimensions...


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## df001

*inspiration in a pizza?*

ate some dinner, looked over at it, and it all sort of clicked, each rock knew exactly where it needed to be.

The idea is to provide a bit of a 'retaining wall' as it were for visual effect, also to give some nooks and crannies for some of the critters to hide/chill etc.

Thoughts? criticisms?


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## Rmwbrown

What are you planting? If its predominately rhizomes and moss this should work well. It its stems and rooting stuff, you may want to take out the odd rock to leave lots of planting space or in particular the ones right behind the roots as this will be your focal point and you probably want some green of red right there.

Also keep in mind your filtration - have you created any potential dead spaces with the layout that your filter can't overcome? I was having some algae issues with a 50 gallon I set up about a month ago with a Eheim 2217. I probably could got away with 5 cycles an hour if i was using the spray bar but with the glass outflux I still had some dead spots and had to put in a Koralia Nano to clear up the problem. This makes sense though, with the nano it brought me up to 10x an hour which I think Is mandatory for any glass influx/outflux set up.


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## df001

Rmwbrown said:


> What are you planting? If its predominately rhizomes and moss this should work well. It its stems and rooting stuff, you may want to take out the odd rock to leave lots of planting space or in particular the ones right behind the roots as this will be your focal point and you probably want some green of red right there.
> 
> Also keep in mind your filtration - have you created any potential dead spaces with the layout that your filter can't overcome?


good point!! the ones behind dont really need to be there, they are partially there to hold the wood in place, Most of the stuff I've got at the moment is root/stem

As for filtration - yeah I'm thinking a powerhead may be necessary as the 2213 on its own doesnt seem to cut it. I'll play it by ear. Hard to know what low flow spots will be till its all grown in, and I can see how the plants affect the flow.


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## Kooka

Ya, I agree with Rmwbrown, a powerhead like a Koralia would definately help. On my tank I have a small internal filter with a built-in UV light that provides a lot of extra filtration power and kills free floating algae and bacteria as well. The flow rate on this guy is pretty decent too, 500 litres per hour. I got this filter from Poland so it needs the euro 220 adapter. They might also sell some in the 120 volt model, but I haven't come across any. Here's a link to their website: http://www.aquael.pl/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=129&Itemid=238&lang=en


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## df001

Derp! Put my wood in today after soaking till it wouldnt float, and damn if once i refilled it starts to float :/ pix of the tank tomorrow


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## Rmwbrown

That's always the way, I had a manzy log that took three weeks to sink! Yeah, I would look into the good power head now, the 2213 can't even hack it on my 25 gallon. Better with the spray bar, but by no means ideal.


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## carmenh

Hmmmm, have a pressure cooker?



df001 said:


> Derp! Put my wood in today after soaking till it wouldnt float, and damn if once i refilled it starts to float :/ pix of the tank tomorrow


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## df001

*Finally! plant photos!! *

So ignore the fact that the rocks in the center are out of place, ignore the tupperware holding some extra crpyts and a few small sprigs of val,

And ignore the floating driftwood....

that aside thats prettymuch how its gonna look till it grows in.

Also - the castle was a birthday present for the GF... she thought it was cute..  I like that it blends in!

The addition of the netlea (even after rinsing it lots) is causing MASSIVE ammonia/nitrate spike so the fish are still in the Q-tank till it settles down.

I'm doing some pretty frequent water changes, I just hope the spike doesn't fubar the biologicals.

that said, almost no algae... been running the CO2 pretty heavily, drop checker is a pleasant green.


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## Rmwbrown

eheh, just wait! The algae is coming... 

Here is the thing with ADA Aquasoil and Netlea... you need to do a 50% water change everyday or at the very least, every other day, for 3-6 weeks if you want to get a cleanup crew in there and hold off the algae! 

Keep up with the testing.. i normally do a water change every day for the first two weeks while dosing trace and then for the next 4 weeks, do it every other day dosing trace potassium and phosphate until the N gets to something reasonable and I can start doing regular dosing. 

If you don't do this the N will kill any Amano shrimp and the Ammonia, as you suggest will KO the fish... pretty much tank of death all round.


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## Kooka

Looks good so far, and wow, I had no idea netlea messes with your water parameters that much... Oh and the red rotala macrandra is really looking healthy. If I were you I'd get to work on those carpeting plants soon, they can really help in reducing the NH3 and NO3, not to mention they will set root before you introduce your fish and plants.


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## Rmwbrown

Kooka said:


> Looks good so far, and wow, I had no idea netlea messes with your water parameters that much... Oh and the red rotala macrandra is really looking healthy. If I were you I'd get to work on those carpeting plants soon, they can really help in reducing the NH3 and NO3, not to mention they will set root before you introduce your fish and plants.


I didn't either until my wife start using ADA Amazonia. At the time I had always used ecocomplete (which is much more stable) and I couldn't believe how fast hair algae set in. After testing the water and doing some research we started daily water changes on her nano and it cleared up in about a week.

I have used it in three tanks now and I think the long term productivity of the soil makes it worth while, but in retrospect, it is pretty frustrating that this information is not listed on the packaging - especially for people starting out with planted tanks that aren't testing, have a poor understanding of light, and are not yet up to the very difficult task of finding the right Co2 levels. They are just trying to buy the best stuff while following the Amano line... no need to dose in the first 6 weeks, two bubbles a second and all that, but have no clue why it just isn't working.


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## df001

since last post - been doing ~50& wc each day. co2 has been constant during the day - turn it off when i go to bed, on when i get up, 9 hours of light.

As of two days ago, Ammonia, Nitrite were through the roof, as of tonight, ammonia is down significantly, aprox .25 ppm, and the nitrite appears to be zero. 
Nitrate is at 30ppm or thereabouts.

Interesting to note the PH has finally dropped, before the netlea it was staying fairly constant at 7.4ish(with co2) now its testing out at about 6.6, I've heard it was acidic, but thats a big change!!

My only concern is going to be adjusting the fish to the changed water, I think I'll do small water changes over a few days from the main tank to the QT, ie 10-15% each day. (QT tank is 10g)

As for algae - I've noticed a few very minor spots, some green on the glass, not sure what type, and some small brown spots on crypt leaves, nothing that is bad enough to warrant significant concern... Mostly I'm just so friggin exhausted this week, that I don't have energy to worry about the tank.

Also, I have a line on some amano shrimp, so at some point I'd like to add them.


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## df001

*Mollies aka algae cleanup crew?!!*

So cuz I still havnt gotten ferts sorted out yet, chosing between EI or what haveyou. I've noticed the tank has a crapload of algae forming on the crypt leaves, looks like brown spot to me.

The plastuc tub that was in the main tank got put into the qt tank, it was covered with algae.

And my 3 chubby dalmation mollie ladies, and their handsome friend demolished every last spot of algae, not a spec was left.

So I'm thinking I'm gonna drill and slate the driftwood today as I'm sick of waiting for it, do a bit of re-adjustment to fix it into its home in the tank, then add the Amano shrimp, and the fish once the water settles.

Ammonia and nitrite spikes are finally over, nitrate is constant at about 5-10ppm, co2 is right in the sweet spot, plants look good. the rotala macranda is going a bit green - I'm thinking iron deficiency?

will post photos later


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## df001

*critters!*

So figured I'd shoot some pictures of critters

Gold ram aka "asshole fish" who unless he chills out with the other ram, will be getting re-homed,

MTS from CarmenH - thanks again for the great deal!

Yamato shrimp from ALosaurus! also a great deal!


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## Kooka

LOL, my GB ram attacks my hand whenever I'm cleaning the glass in front of "his" CO2 diffuser. Tank seems to be coming along very well.


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## carmenh

No problem, I'm glad it's in good hands 



df001 said:


> So figured I'd shoot some pictures of critters
> 
> Gold ram aka "asshole fish" who unless he chills out with the other ram, will be getting re-homed,
> 
> MTS from CarmenH - thanks again for the great deal!
> 
> Yamato shrimp from ALosaurus! also a great deal!


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## df001

*update time - with a question?*

So the wood is in, place, not convinced its permanent - the tiger lotus is hidden behind it - but hopping it will be more visible once it grows in more. rotala on left has been pruned and re-planted hope it will put out some side shoots/more growth - feel like everything is shooting up towards the light and ignoring lateral growth - makes me want to cut it all back to 3" or so once its rooted.

I decided for now to not do a slate base - mostly because I didnt want to disturb everything, so the two pieces of wood are screwed together, and wedged into place to counter buoyancy till the damn thing saturates enough to sink. its about 2/3 to 3/4 from the front of the tank, leaving a nice foreground area that will fill in eventually.

at this time I've got the powerhead in the tank to help with circulation - wondering if I should consider upping the system to a larger filter for higher flow-rate. maybe get a 2217? or maybe just pull the bio media in the 2213 and replace with pads?

thoughts?


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## Kooka

I think the 2217 has a vastly better flow rate than the 2213 has so you might look into trading your's in for one. What kind of filter media does your filter use at the moment? If you use the eheim filter pads, I'd swap them out with some regular filter floss; I find it cheaper and more effective. The charcoal pads are also pretty useless in a planted setup, unless you want to remove all your trace elements. 

What kind of water parameters are you trying to maintain more or less? If your shooting for softer, more acidic water a filter bag with some peat moss can really help things out.


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## Rmwbrown

I find the 2217 is the right size for my 25 gallon high light tank and for my 50 medium light tank. It seems to me the more light you have, the more flow you need.


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## df001

*FTS to start the new year.*

So the stress I had about the changes to the tank, and it being ok while we went away for new years was for nothing.

The timers seem to have worked perfectly, the auto feeder was good. No issues! woohoo!

A few changes you can see in the FTS, Ripped out the star grass on the left all but one stem that some-how managed to escape. Mowed down the (rotala) indica and macranda and re-planted tops. Moved the star grass on the right further back so its between the swords and tiger lotus.

Was at the LFS and the gf saw some alternanthera reineki "rosafolia" and asked me to add it, so its slotted in there against the driftwood for now, with one sprig mixed in with the crypts up front.
the staurogyne repens got a haircut, separated the clumps and replanted, and added some HC, that is proving a challenge to keep the clumps down till the roots get well set. I'm thinking of using some stainless wire in a U shape to hold it down (think sod staples)

Other than that, removed the algea on the anubias finally and tied it on to the wood - may move some of the upper stuff lower down - think the light is giving a bit of stress.

And now without any further ado: the FTS


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## df001

*Houston, we have a "problem"*

Holy crap! went to the cottage for the aft - ended up drinking too much at a friends house last night, and crashing there - missed feeding the fish yesterday... and this morning...

Had seen the gold and GBR pairing off somewhat but wasnt expecting this:


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## df001

*Win some, Lose some.*

Came home with high hopes, but low expectations on the GBR eggs. Sure enough, no eggs left when I got home. I'm guessing here, but most likely option is eggs werent viable - and as they started to go bad/white that mom and dad ate them (noticed them doing this).

Or other critters in the tank ate them, there was a suspicious looking malaysian trumpet snail hanging out in the vicinity.

But, its not all bad news! In watching the tank I noticed a lot of translucent debris near the surface. Turns out, its not debris, one of the mollies finally has dropped fry.

Dalmation Lyretail molly in a few weeks anyone?

Oh, and it looks like my amano shrimp are berried, not that they would be viable.

I guess the brine shrimp that I started will go to feed the young mollies or get frozen.


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## Groovychild

Tank's looking good Dave!


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## Kooka

Nice job with the tank so far. I'm guessing the stragrass was starting to look ratty for you. I find that it really needs a lot of trimming in order to look its best. Each week I cut half off each stem and it seems to grow back with nice new leaves every time. If the lower leaves are turning black it means they aren't recieving enough light, so I'd either hide the lower part of the stems with other plants, or somehow provide it with more light. 

As for the GBR's spawning, personally I've never had any luck in letting the parents raise the eggs/fry themselves; they always end up eating the eggs or the newborn fry (I have witnessed them doing this). On the next occasion my pair breed, I'll remove the eggs and place them in a breeding trap used for livebearers. Hopefully then they will have a chance in surviving.


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## df001

Had to euthanize a guppy this morning before my 2.5 hour drive to work!!!!! :/ she was pretty fin nipped had her in the qt tank and she just kept getting worse and worse. Also came home to the other GBR dead  had been meaning to pull out of the tank, am guessing the pair bullied to death 

Only one molly fry left that i can see, am guessing the others were snacks, the other two mollys look ready to drop almost any time now, same with the guppies.

I need to pick up some sort of intake cover, so i dont lose any fry to the filter.

Other than that, the cotton thread i had tied the anubias on with has let go, not heavy enough thread i guess, so the Anubias looks all burnt and crappyfrom the root pruning, and floating too close to the lights 

And to top it off, since the other two rams have paired off, we decided that the male gold ram needs a new home.

Kind of bummed out about this week, loss of the eggs, two fish gone, plants not cooperating. Oh well next week will be better, FTS to follow as im posting from the tub 

@Kooka, I pulled the clump on the left Because i wanted to see more of the val, its growing so well i cut it back about once a week. So im not too worried, also now that the root tabs are in the lotus has taken off exponentially.


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## df001

oops, forgot to post a FTS last week, oh well, lights are off for the night, so I'll have to post one tomorrow.

Guess who's got eggs again... the rams spawned this evening, and one of the guppies dropped fry - can you say snack-time! there's a few hiding in the star-grass, one molly fry left.


----------



## mauve

Who lives in that cute little castle? Does it have furniture and a tiny plasma TV for the inhabitants to watch?


----------



## Kooka

If you want to save some ram eggs from being "fish omlets" and give it a try rasing some fry, I recommend you take whatever the rams laid their eggs on and place it into a cut open plastic bottle. Then hang the water bottle just above your water level in front of a filter or waterhead so that the eggs get some flow and are safe from predation. Make sure to cover the open top of the bottle with some sort of netting material, I used some nylon roe tying material.

I did the same for the first time with my rams last nest (after losing faith in the parent fish's ability to take care of the eggs themselves) and after about 2 days the eggs have hatched and behold - ram wigglers!


----------



## 50seven

Why don't you just use it as an excuse to start another tank? Give the kids their own digs  

Sent from my HTC Magic using Tapatalk


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## Kooka

I can't succumb to MTS, oh wait, too late...


----------



## df001

*FTS and closeups*

Did some major pruning in prep for going away as I wont have time next weekend and want to give things a chance to stabilize before we go away.

Hacked the star-grass down without mercy, then hacked it down s'more  Chopped a few of the bigger tiger lotus leaves that were at the surface. 
Trimmed a bunch of val, moved a bunch of runners. The rotala indica has been looking like crap for a while, so I ripped the roots out, cut off all but the tips and re-planted. rotala macranda got topped, and tips re-planted -it REALLY wants more light.

german rams spawned again - and eggs again got eaten within the first day. After we're back I may pull the eggs and try them on their own.

And now for the reward for following along


----------



## df001

*Rip....*

noticed a fish missing today  looked and looked and didnt see the German ram (pictured previous post)

Been VERY busy the last few days, so not sure when he died, but found him resting on the bottom, decomp started, smelly fish. 

Gold ram appears listless, she's cruising the tank.  hope she's ok, we leave sunday morning, will be really disapointed to come back to more fish-loss.

Not sure how I'll proceed with her, try and find her a new male to pair up with? I'll cross that road when we're back. For now, its cleaning, packing etc etc.


----------



## 50seven

Dude that sucks. Hope things go okay while you're away and can get her paired up again.

Sent from my HTC Magic using Tapatalk


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## df001

50seven said:


> Dude that sucks. Hope things go okay while you're away and can get her paired up again.
> 
> Sent from my HTC Magic using Tapatalk


thanks, oh and btw, I wasnt kidding, the super of the building now thinks I'm a drug dealer or something. oh well :/


----------



## df001

*FTS and decisions decisions.*

So after getting back on the 13th, everything was fine, except there are WAY more fry, i covered the intakes with sponges as I figured the last batch got eaten by the filter intake, and sure enough - we have way more showing.

With the loss of the male german ram, I"m left wondering what direction to go.

My gf is kinda done with them, and I understand that, but at the same token, that my female is healthy and has layed in the past makes me really want to consider trying to re-pair her.

Alternatively a friend suggested I check out kilifish.... so after reading faaaaaar too late lastnight, i'm thinking about possibly re-homing the ram, and
getting a Aphyosemion australe orange pair, as my ph/GH are in the right range for them, I could drop the main tank temp while any new additions were in the QT tank to match conditions etc.

Also - if anyone wants any crypt wendtii - let me know now that stuff has grown in some - its time to thin it out and adjust!


----------



## df001

*FTS update*

Productive evening for a guy who's sick... (do fish catch colds?)

Before we left for cuba, I partially tore down the 10g QT tank as it was not so clean. So I emptied it out today and cleaned it as we acquired a few unplanned additions at the LFS. Since the small filter hasn't been running for 3 weeks, I pulled the 2213 from the 65g, and am using it on the QT tank.

At the LFS, saw a lovely gold ram male, that I figured... why not let's try again... also the GF saw some juv cardinal tetras, and after close inspection we decided they looked decent and would give them a try.

So I guess that's the end of the kilifish idea for now...

Did some serious hack'n'slash to the tank today. pulled out the star-grass as it was looking really crappy, cut back all but the top 3" and replanted in a container, removed some crypt wendtii that had gotten VERY big and was shading out the staurogyne repens. Decided to keep the amazon swords for now, moved it to the back-center to make some room for the Alternanthera reineckii ''roseafolia''. Ripped out the hygrophila corymbosa on the right, as it too was shading out the center foreground too much, trimmed the one on the left.

New additions of some riccia, and pearl grass, not sure what i'll do with them for now.


----------



## df001

@Kooka

Check out the staurogyne repens, my lawn is growing in nicely, seems like i get a big enough growth after 2-3 weeks to snip off a few shoots and replant, thanks again for that suggestion, am VERY happy with how it looks


----------



## Ciddian

I am sooo jealous of your tank. My tank is much too high and I just cant get the awesome light you have for your plants. <3

Looking wonderful


----------



## Kooka

Repens is lookin good! Your gonna end up hating those amazon swords, they will take over that corner of your tank, no jokes


----------



## df001

*love is in the air? er water?!*

Got some more cardinals and some cory's from golfers1 the other day. One of the bronze females was behaving weirdly... she was holding in one of the containers of soil I keep plants in the q tank. And today I came home to find this in the Q tank(see image) five or six groups of about 10-15 eggs each scattered about the glass on the tank.

I figured the weird behavior was stress/shock from transport... perhaps the change of venue triggered her bio-clock. as for now - i need to learn up about corydora rearing.


----------



## Kan

Congratulations David  I also recently acquired few julie cories myself and I just love seeing them poke around looking for food. I hope you get to hatch the eggs successfully


----------



## df001

So I posted a quick "need a tank asap" and tom g was kind enough to help me out with the loan of a little tank setup.

using a straw, i managed to remove all the remaining eggs - looks like a bunch got eaten/squished/something.

the straw worked really well - those eggs were tenacious.
Will try to photo the hatch-tank over the coming days.

Thanks again Tom, its people like you willing to help out, on short notice even, that make me glad to be a member here!

Also - the 75g that Tom won in the auction - he has done a fantastic job on it!!

And now its time for sleep!


----------



## df001

So aparently my corydoras are active lil fish... came home from the auction to find this:
http://s4.photobucket.com/albums/y143/df001/65gallon/?action=view&current=a30ce272.mp4

Also, I grabbed a second fixture, odessey t5ho 2 bulb... tank really pops now!


----------



## Sharon W

*Tank base construction*

Just don't use MDF. MDF+moisture=mush.

When I've put a tank on a particle board base, I have put a thick plastic underneath and up the side edges. Particle board should be properly sealed as below.

Plywood?: Before assembly, seal all sides and seam edges of open wood with several coats of water-based varathane and let it outgas properly. Seal all joints with silicone, as you would do in refurbishing a used tank.

Without sealing, plywood will warp.

A good solid base can be achieved by using sealed particle board or sealed plywood layered with decorative concrete blocks at 30" spacing - i.e. make sure the sides of the tank line up with the centres of the 4" wide (12"x12") blocks. You can put up to two levels underneath to bring tank to ordinary eye level when seated. Primitive, but works well.


----------



## df001

I guess you didnt see the rest of the build photos...


----------



## df001

Kinda forgot to take tank photos, been very busy as of late so sat down and figured it was time to take a photo.

no real changes to the tank, no new additions, a few losses - lost a few cardinals to misadventure (jumpers) found one dried to a crisp under the lights when i got home from work, another I'm guessing from old age - no obvious signs.

Lost my lovely little gold ram female, she had been behaving odd but no other symptoms till I came home one day to see her barely moving on her side, Euthanization sucks but was the best option.

other than that - here's a full tank shot:


----------



## fly4awhiteguy

Beautiful tank... your new rams will love it in there.


----------



## df001

Call me Dr hacknslash









I think i may have some juvie corys in the main tank.... Aparrently they laid and hatched, and survived, cool!!


----------



## df001

So apparently I have more cory fry, as there Is atleast
One in the main tank....


----------



## df001

*ID this plant?*

Been busy with summer, between re-enacting, camping, work, life etc havnt had time to update.

a few weeks back went to AI, they had some pennywort, looked cool, like the peltate leaves on it. (far left corner foreground)

also grabbed some pearlweed (1/3 in from the right, between staurogyne repens and alternanthera reineicki)

Happened to be at BA, saw some micro sword, thought what the heck, and grabbed a portion. upon pulling it apart, noticed a different plant growing amongst it. no idea what it is so planted it separately to see what it is how it does. (close up photo after FTS)

Lost the awesome gold ram on wednesday, was really disapointed by that. the GBRxEBR that I got from tropicana are doing great, finally have their tank sorted out.

You can see I ripped out more of the crpyt wendtii it was just too close to the front, so I replanted it further back behind the rocks leaving the foreground way less shaded. ripped some more of the hygro on the left as well, snipped the tips of the rotala macranda and replanted.

without further ado, FTS:










and the unknown plant for ID


----------



## default

Nice tank!
The mystery plant are glossos.
Glossostigma Elatinoides.


----------



## Ciddian

maannn looks so nice!


----------



## df001

Figured I was due for an update.

Lost the pea puffer, not sure what happened, but the snail population has made a significant increase since he's gone.

Scored a sweet deal on another 2217, so I now have an intake in each rear corner, and the spraybar pointing to the front of the tank, not sure if I like the setup, but we'll see. I mostly wanted it to be able to clean the filters more often, as the corydoras stir up a LOT of crap into the water column.

Anyway enough blahblahblah, dishes to do, and FTS to look at.


----------



## 50seven

df001 said:


>


That's a very nice tank you have, I gotta see it in person some time  This is the kind of tank that inspired me to fall in love with fish and aquaria when I was a wee youngun' (Before I saw a reef tank of course  )


----------



## df001

Sure maybe dinner one day after work if its on the way home, can show you our little place.


----------



## df001

Been really busy thanks to good fortune and friends, so had forgotten about the thread, got some angels at PRAC, they went thru quarantine fine, and are now adjusting nicely into the tank.

FTS:


----------



## df001

Came home and noticed my angels being hyper agressive, turns out the reason why is they were frisky, better yet, i didnt even notice, we've got wrigglers!!

Not the clearest of images but...


----------



## df001

With all that's gone on the last few weeks, I'm just kind of numb.

What a horrible start to 2013. All that you see below, is gone. 
After an epic move, interupted by being yelled at for things that arent my fault, a super slow drive due to weather, I managed to finally get the 65 gallon back on the stand. with water in it, planted no less. Fish are in a holding tank till tomorrow, will introduce some of them to the 65 and the rest to the 35.

Things I have learned from tearing down and moving this tank.
first - move all the accessories and miscelaneous stuff first. because once the big push to move plants, fish and tanks is on, you're going to forget, and then you're on the clock.

Make sure your moving tools are in good order - you have NO idea how annoying a caster with a flat-spot on a flat-cart is.

Make sure you remember to bring your python. lugging water from the sink 5 gallon pails at a time really REALLY **REALLY** sucks.

So far all of the inhabitants made the move fine. *hooray!!* the only surprise in tearing down and moving the tanks, is that I Was fine till I was sitting in traffic, then it all kind of just hit me. and I've felt like shit ever since. Its been a hell of a week.

It seems like the motto for this week is "they said cheer up, it could be worse, so I cheered up, and sure enough... it got worse!"

have to move the 35g tomorrow, make a new stand for it(dont ask) and get it set up and running - either as bare-tank or just regular gravel.

I'll try to take some new FTS once I get the lights on it and the fish back in.
I think the lay-out is ok, for the rushed job that it is.

RIP old tank lay-out, I'll miss you.


----------



## Ciddian

Moves are insane for fish people, I agree.... I had massive losses for the two moves I had. The first time I had no car, so no control over my fish. Kept getting the 'they'll be fine....' in half a tank of water for three days and no air. I knew it wasnt fine.. 

The second I was pregnant, so I couldnt move everything in the time I had wanted. I couldn't just do it myself. Drove me insane...

I feel ya bud. It sucks.


----------



## df001

*So far so good.*

Well so far all the fish are fine. I checked the lvls with some test strips, touch wood all seems well. as soon as the weather settles down I'll move the other tanks.

But for now I added the mollies and the guppies to start, and all seems well.
All the fish in the temp holding tank are doing fine!!

Big Sigh of relief! But we've a long way to go.

So since I know none of you but Ciddian read any of this blathering here's the eye-candy










sorry for the crappy iphone photo there is lots of natural light making for glare.

The holy-crap-scape-it-now-to-put-the-fish-back asap plan consists of trying to hopefully keep the signature plants in the tank healthy, while the easily replaceable stuff i'm less worreid about.

To that end if you compare the previous image, you'll notice that I didnt bother to do anything similar.

Key changes in this lay-out. I've sloped the lay-out more, and used ALL the driftwood that I have. (except for one mopani peice still at the appartment)

the rocks are acting like a retaining wall to allow a foreground area for the staurogyne repense and crypt parva.

I put the 24" amazon sword front and center, and pushed the Tiger lotus to the far left, and I've moved the giagantic clump of crypt wendti to the back left.

I have HEAPS of val left, both the large "jungle" and the smaller ?tiger val? lots of rotala indica, java moss, java fern, elodia, and some other stuff i don't remember what it is that I'll use to fill in the holes, and replant the 35g.

Thank you everyone for your kind words either privately or publicly, I know in a few years time I'll look back at this thread and smile, and think wow, what a hell of a time. The thing that makes it all bearable, is that one, I know the plants will come back, and if I show them the same care I can tweak the tank even better. two, that others have suffered through all this BS, and still not lost their passion for the hobby, which means I can stay the course and not let this speedbump ruin anything.

Its not a tragedy, its an opportunity.

Thanks!


----------



## Ciddian

Looks great! I know it will grow in lovely  Did you change up the tank? I dont know if I missed that


----------



## 50seven

df001 said:


> ...Its not a tragedy, its an opportunity....


Ohhh! I think I sense optimism.... 

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2


----------



## df001

50seven said:


> Ohhh! I think I sense optimism....
> 
> Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2


Darn right. I cheered up and things got worse, so I'm gonna get CHEERIER if thats even possible? until I kill them all with kindness. 

seriously though moving the tank has made me think of the future. and I'm thinking a 90 or 120g tank either a 48x or 72x 24x18 with starfire front and sides. I think that losing 6" of height will help the ability to grow high light foreground stuff, without losing too much of the ability to have taller plants.

But I'll have to save that dream for now till we're in somewhere more permanent. (time to start saving...)


----------



## tom g

*tank*

see there is a brighter side . when i moved from my 55 to the 75 i got so pissed at myself for making the jump and messing with the MOJO of the tank ,but know its like bigger lol .
i think we all get attached to our tanks .i enjoy the build it sort of keeps u going if that makes any sense.im glad things worked out it may not be perfect or not what u want but it looks like its on its way to looking great again in a few weeks u will post some more pics and u will see the diff
cheers 
tom


----------



## df001

YAY!!! the tank is finally home.

I did a fast scape yesterday, I'll likely change it up somewhat but will wait a while. I'm not liking the look of some of the cardinal tetras, they're looking rough around the edges, but other than that, everyone else is doing fine, eating well, looking healthy.

am a bit upset that there seems to be a bit of BBA growing....


----------



## Fishfur

Looks great.. love that wood you have.. like a tree trunk's roots hanging out. Nice !


----------



## df001

So I lost all the alternanthera rosafolia, all but one small sprig of staurogyne repens, and all the val, both the jungle and the other stuff ?itallian tiger val?

so I'm trying to get a few different plants and was thinking about putting in an anubias barteri to compliment the anubias nana, and the nana petite.

I'm also not likely going to set up the 20l, nor the 33, so I'll likely reduce the fish-load at some point, possibly some of the corydoras, the guppies, and obviously the offspring of the angelfish.


----------



## Fishfur

That's a shame.. If you want some Vals, I have some really healthy ones, a couple of fairly long runners with multiple plants of good size growing on them. Not the giant ones, these grow to the top of the tank.. 18 inches about, so far anyway. 

I saw a huge A. Barteri at Aquatic Kingdom the other day. Daniel wanted $30 for it.. I took a smaller one instead. It's got a lot of algae on the older leaves and would need some cleaning up, but it's truly enormous with lots of branching on the rhizome and a gigantic root system.


----------



## df001

full tank shot:

added the staurogyne repens from default! as well as the ludwigia rubin and glandulosa, figure we'll try them out.

he gave me a CRAPTON of staurogyne repens! thanks again!!

I also tore apart the crypt parva, to fill in the area to the right that is currently covered in java-fern.


----------



## default

Can't wait till it grows in!


----------



## df001

So my guess about those two cardinal tetras was spot on, when I got home I found them recently passed  no signs of disease, everyone else looks healthy, so I'm guessing the shock of moving was too much for them.

The HORDES of corydoras havnt yet unrooted all the stauro planted yesterday but its a matter of time.


----------



## df001

So I've been replanting the stauro every day. and I think its safe to say the tank has survived the move/replant ok.

case in point:


though I think the angels would spawn, even if the tank was in full on apocalyptic collapse....


----------



## df001

Guess who's apartment has water damage.. FFS twice in one year should be an automatic free bottle of singlemalt.... 

I was finally just winning the BBA fight... and getting the tank looking great.

even just the thought of moving the tank again is making me nauseus.


ARghhjjhhhhhhhh


----------



## tom g

*tank*

Are u seriius...........from what


----------



## df001

the balcony apparently had drainage holes, but the renovation crew doing the new railings/exterior work never thought to clear them. so we had a lake instead of a balcony due to a curb around the perimiter of it.

the balcony has no membrane, and the caulking against the unit is shot, so the water has come through the floor, about a 10x15' area in the living room against the exterior wall.


----------



## Yann

Rmwbrown said:


> eheh, just wait! The algae is coming...
> 
> Here is the thing with ADA Aquasoil and Netlea... you need to do a 50% water change everyday or at the very least, every other day, for 3-6 weeks if you want to get a cleanup crew in there and hold off the algae!
> 
> Keep up with the testing.. i normally do a water change every day for the first two weeks while dosing trace and then for the next 4 weeks, do it every other day dosing trace potassium and phosphate until the N gets to something reasonable and I can start doing regular dosing.
> 
> If you don't do this the N will kill any Amano shrimp and the Ammonia, as you suggest will KO the fish... pretty much tank of death all round.


I used the Netlea baked soil in my 16 gallon and have not had any noticeable algae... I just kept my lights on for 4hrs a day for the first two weeks and slowly increased the duration over the following month. I dosed about half as many ferts at the beginning until lights were brought up to full duration. Only did h2o changes once a week and don't do anything but trim plants and top up evaporated water once a week. I test the water every week and N sits at negligable amounts and my ph is constant at about 6.4. Just winged the whole thing on intuition and it worked out way better than I could have hoped.

I did have really high N levels for longer than I had anticipated (even though I seeded the filter with media well in advance of setting up), but never any visible algae

Glad the move went alright and sorry to hear about the flood. Not looking forward to the day I have to move my tanks. It took me the better part of a day to un-plant, catch fish, change gravel and re-plant everything in my 30 gallon.


----------



## df001

*Planning on moving in the spring...*

So I've been slowly winding the tank down to just plants, the idea being that it will be easier to move without significant livestock... I'm still here. Just busy with life the universe and everything.

I blame 50seven


----------



## df001

*new town, new house, new ideas, fresh start.*

The tank is moved into our new place, location finalized.

Some new eco-complete acquired, new wood acquired, going to play with the lay out and design, And I have a crazy idea for a homemade tank background, though i'm not sure how that will work with the eheim intakes and outflows.

I'm slowly acquiring everything. will post a teaser photo or two in the next few weeks. tomororw I visit the LFS 2 minutes away - happy discovery once we signed lease on new place.


----------



## tom g

*New design*

Hey man that's awesome ... where did u move too .. look forward to seeing some pics or even teasers ... 
Cheers


----------



## df001

we moved to kingston, the city of liquid rock. I'm not sure what i'm going to do yet. but i'm going to have to do it soon as I got a bunch of anubias barterii "coffeefolia" for super cheap...


----------



## tom g

*awesome*

that's awesome guys ...look forward to seeing your pics periodically .I know it will look fantastic....


----------



## Nebthet78

df001 said:


> we moved to kingston, the city of liquid rock. I'm not sure what i'm going to do yet. but i'm going to have to do it soon as I got a bunch of anubias barterii "coffeefolia" for super cheap...


Ah, you must live near Finaddicts then. I've heard decent things about that LFS. I'm just a couple City over from you in Belleville. Kingston is a pretty good place to live.


----------



## df001

*here's a teaser.*










Going for lots of wood in this one, the front will have about 2" of eco-complete, the back will be raised up about 4-5".

going to anchor the anubias at the sides of the center, some val along the back, and the crypt willsi and parva along the front.

I'm toying with 2 ideas for the back of the tank - one is not putting any sort of background on, the other is going with a black background and wrapping it on the sides atleast up to the edge of the cabinet on the left, and the wall on the right so that they are less of a visual distraction.

Any thoughts?

thanks!


----------



## tom g

*tank*

hey it looks great ..... look forward toseeing more to come 
the only thing I found when I wrapped my tank with paint was when u actally are looking for a fish or trying to see something . unless the tank is enclosed in a casing go for it , but periodically when I am staring and want to peer to try to see a sick fish or a clutch of eggs u get a little pissed that u cant see where u should .
again looks awesome look forward to seeing more 
cheers 
tom


----------



## df001

*Teaser #2*









current thought is anubias all along the wood/rock in the center, crypt parva/willsi along front right. was thinking I'd try montecarlo in the front left, not sure how it will do in this deep tank.
for the background definitely want some val in there, I'm open to other options.


----------



## Professor Monkey

I love the tangled wood - eventually I want a scape like this!

I've seen a few similar layouts and personally like the central and symmetrical round layout.

A green carpet all the way across the front and outside edges, then a ring around the base of the wood (parva, or s. Repens, or anubias) then Java fern with smaller leaves (needle) embedded in the branches making a dense crown above the ring, then a reddish stem plant like ludwigia brevipes peaking over the top of the java fern. Screen of Vals in the background, or even just a bare black background.


----------



## df001

*Sunday update.*

After what felt like hours, but was really only a few minutes with the crazy glue and moss, I used up a massive portion of weeping moss ?Vesicularia ferriei? I acquired from a local here in kingston. Thanks Rob. There was some flame moss mixed in, I'm going to try something else with that, I have an idea....

from left to right - val nana, they got a bit abused on the trip out - tops melted hoping they will re-shoot.

mid central - Anubias barterii "coffeefolia"

front central to front right - crypt parva and some wilsii mixed in, will separate them out once they grow up and I can tell which is which easier. I'll probably regret this down the road but we'll see.

back right - Rotala rotundafolia Also acquired from Rob.

The rocks on the wood are temporary till they soak in enough to lose buoyancy.










I'm thinking at the moment I'm going to start stocking with some cherry shrimp, and was considering getting a bristlenose pleco. I really like the look of the "L144" yellow blue-eyed, any issues with keeping them with RCS?



Professor Monkey said:


> I love the tangled wood - eventually I want a scape like this!
> I've seen a few similar layouts and personally like the central and symmetrical round layout.


Yeah i've always been a big fan of the tangled wood look, I think it works really well with the depth of this tank. Because I want the tank to look good from a few veiwing angles, and I'll likely be tearing it down in a year when we move I figured a more central simple approach was best.



> A green carpet all the way across the front and outside edges, then a ring around the base of the wood (parva, or s. Repens, or anubias) then Java fern with smaller leaves (needle) embedded in the branches making a dense crown above the ring, then a reddish stem plant like ludwigia brevipes peaking over the top of the java fern. Screen of Vals in the background, or even just a bare black background.


Sounds great, post photos when you get it made! its pretty similar to what i'm aiming for, the front left side I wanted to try micranthemum "monte carlo", though experience tells me that may be a lost cause.


----------



## Professor Monkey

Looking good! Can't wait to see it grow out.

I won't be able to attempt the scape for a long time - I only have one tank atm that I could try it with and it'll be busy as a rainbow fisb grow out for the next while.

Might just have to get another tank....


----------



## Nebthet78

How's everything coming along and filling in?


----------



## df001

Nebthet78 said:


> How's everything coming along and filling in?


Was in toronto this week, picked up a bunch more plants.

More anubias coffeefolia, nana, and nana petit.
Rotala nanjensen
Val sipralis and the thin leaf variety cant remember which one.
Some dwarf hair grass, i dont think i have the par for it to thrive but were gonna try it.
And a weird stem plant from finatics that i cannot remember what its called. Was also able to get a lid from finatics. 
By far hands down one of the cleanest and best stores ive seen ever.

Also picked up my new needlevalve and got my co2 tank filled. So now were really in business.


----------



## planter

df001 said:


> current thought is anubias all along the wood/rock in the center, crypt parva/willsi along front right. was thinking I'd try montecarlo in the front left, not sure how it will do in this deep tank.
> for the background definitely want some val in there, I'm open to other options.


FWIW I recently started up a planted tank 3 weeks back. It's a 90 gallon (48 x 18 x 24h). I'm currently lighting the tank with a 36" 2 x 39w t5 Hagen fixture and a 36" 39w led fixture running at about 50 percent.

So far my Monte Carlo is slowing growing across the substrate and not vertically so that's a good sign so far. I was also concerned about the height as well but I found Monte Carlo is much for forgiving than most carpet plants like HC.


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## df001

got everything planted today, co2 regulator sorted, need to hook it up tomorrow.


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