# Absolutely new to Saltwater Aquarium - need help with tank and setup



## little_clown (Nov 24, 2010)

Hi guys, I'm very very new here.

I have a 5 Gal tank at home with 2 clown fish right now. I know it is way too small for them and I'm planning to move them to a big tank.

To ensure I'm heading to the right direction, I've been doing a lot of readings and researches lately on forums and I was referred to here!! 
What a nice place to meet some experts to get help and to share info

I was mislead by 2 LFS about how to get started on saltwater aquarium and all that. 

Anyways, to cut my story short, first thing I need to do now is to get a bigger tank. 
Since I will be placing the tank in my bedroom so it won't be a very big one.
I'm looking at something about 20 Gal in size. 

Does anyone know where is the best place to get a proper marine aquarium?
Petsmart are selling some tanks too, good size and price but I don't want to run into the same mistake again so I want to be sure that I'm getting the right one that is compatible and work for saltwater.

Any suggestion?


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## Fish_Man (Apr 9, 2010)

This should get you started.

http://www.gtaaquaria.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7482


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## KeMo (Sep 3, 2010)

Good To see you on here Little Clown as I would think you will be able to get more attention to your needs.
Look on here in the Used tanks and I am sure you will find a good deal.
Also look for some good LR like we talked on Rc.
See You around gota run.

~Sent from Iphone~


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## Big Ray (Dec 8, 2009)

Hello,
the glass tank is the same for everything, marine, freshwater or ... 

if that is what you meant.

about filtration, you should consider a sump. but most importantly, what is the goal ? do you want corals ? or just fish ? and what is the budget like ?


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## gucci17 (Oct 11, 2007)

Nice! Welcome little clown. I love how we are slowly gaining more and more members getting into salt.

Let's start with what you would like to accomplish with your tank.


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## little_clown (Nov 24, 2010)

Thanks guys for your warm welcome!! 

I'm happy I find this place to meet all the great people here...

Just a bit more about myself.
I'm just starting in this hobby and wanted to get some advise on how to setup a tank and all that. 

I have a 5 Gal tank, start running the tank on Oct 31 and it's going to be the 4th week soon and I have 2 clowns in the tank in week # 2. 

I realize the 2 rocks in the tank starting to turn golden brown from white.
The sand are yellowish in diff areas in the tank and I found one of my clown loves to dig into the sand and spill them all around.

I know the tank I have is way too small and I'm planning to get a bigger tank. Looking for something at around 20G because the tank will be placed in my room.

After I've done some readings, some people recommend to get Oceanic which I realize it is kinda like an All-in-One tank with everything ready. Some said I can just get a glass tank and pick up the filter and all other equipments seperately.

Which one is actually better? All-in-one? or a glass tank with seperate equipment?

I'm interested in getting corals in the future with clown fish...


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## Big Ray (Dec 8, 2009)

all in one are great place to start learning. but it would be cheaper to make one yourself 

reef keeping depends on ure budget alot  so make a budget you like to spend first. and more important, research, u need to read as much as you can, google is the best place to get started. 

For starter, Id say get a 30 G tank from Big als(40 bucks), a tunze nano skimmer (180) , more sand and Live rock (100 ? ), and a good 4 T5HO lighting (300) and a heater. 

cycle it and move the clownfish over when cycled. keep everything stable and once you feel comfortable get into corals.

the discoration on ure rocks and sand are algae. caused by nutritions, get an RO/DI unit for good water, do water changes with water with TDS zero, look into Fuge and skimmer and ....


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## Chromey (Sep 25, 2010)

Big Ray said:


> all in one are great place to start learning. but it would be cheaper to make one yourself
> 
> reef keeping depends on ure budget alot  so make a budget you like to spend first. and more important, research, u need to read as much as you can, google is the best place to get started.
> 
> ...


couldnt have said it better.
And if you find this expensive, Look used, And if you find that expensive... DYI, And it thats to much, Buy some guppies and re home your clowns.


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## Sunstar (Jul 29, 2008)

Or, with your 5 gallon right now, simply do frequent waterchanges, I have an AC110 on the back which is a large filter being used as a fuge. Macro algae help pull out unwanted nutrients. 

All in Ones are decent start. But pricy.

My white rock went brown then pink. it's progression of the rock. All of my rock is brown except where I pulled some macro off.


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## bigfishy (Jun 19, 2009)

Saw this tank this afternoon, and I almost bought it, kind of regretting to turn it down

lol

It's really nice and the tank is only 3 months old (according to the seller)

$475 jbj nano cube, stand and chiller



Good luck!

http://toronto.kijiji.ca/c-pets-accessories-28-Gallon-saltwater-aquarium-tank-W0QQAdIdZ244268573


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## KeMo (Sep 3, 2010)

+1 what BigR said.
I would also go with setting up your own 30 gal instead of getting a cube as you will be able to save money + use some of the things in a new setup if you plan to down the road. (I am not a fan of the all in ones.)
Little Clown you should also post all the probs you are having like you did on RC because people can help on here. (like the second clown fish)
The more people know the more they can help !!

~Sent from Iphone~


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## little_clown (Nov 24, 2010)

Thanks a lot everyone!! 

So it's been 3.5 weeks now. Should I change the carbon pack in the filter that started running 3.5 weeks ago? The sponge that was given by the LFS was a used one, no clue the age of it though.
Another thing I notice is the water evaporate very quickly, i would say 5% per day because it is an open top tank and the temp of water is at 26C. I'm adding distilled water to it and there's no water change since day 1.

Probably because the filter isn't a good one so the "poop" are sitting on the sand bed and can't really got suck up to the filter. I see some dirts inside the filter, being blocked by the carbon and the sponge to float back to the tank. 

Should I take the sponge out and wash it with the tank water?
Is it time to change the carbon pack since it has been running for 3.5 weeks now?
There is also a pad on the filter tube kinda work like filtering the dirts so it will be just the dirty water flowing into the filter. Do I also need to take that thing out to clean it?

When I got home tonight, my rock is in golden brown now, the sides are turning into that colour as well. I will take a pic and post it later.


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## explor3r (Mar 14, 2010)

Welcome little clown u are heading in the right direction by joining GTA, u will find lots of people with expirience that would love to advice u and/or help u


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## ChefMark (Oct 23, 2010)

Yes you can go and replace the carbon. I would do that every week or two..
The sponge that you have should be cleaned every few days. I would get a few new ones as they are cheap and can get built up with dirt/fish waste fast and cause poor water.
You are going to always see alot of evaporation because of it being such a small tank. Until you go big you will always see alot of this. As I see daily evap on my 29.
If you are seeing fish poop in the filter it is time to clean and change. You will need to do this on such a small tank with 2 fish alot like every 2 days. Also the fish poop on the sand is not normal. You need to get a good CUC in there to help with that. Also suck out the fish poop with your gravel vac. 
A cuc is snails/hermit crabs that eat fish poop. and help to keep the sand bed clean.You need some.
Golden brown sounds like diatoms.(the color on rocks) That is because of the high waste levels and maybe phosphates. These are normal in newer tanks but with an over stocked tank like you have this might be a sign of to much waste.


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## little_clown (Nov 24, 2010)

Alright~ thanks for the advise

I will go get a new pack of carbon tomorrow but do I need to soak it in the water for sometime before putting it into the filter?

Since there are quite a lot of poop on the sand bed and i see dirts building up on the corners of the tank (brown dirts) and should I move the fish to another place first and clean the tank, remove the poops, wash the sponge, renew the carbon, change 1 Gal of water then put my 2 clowns back?

Will that be too much changes at one time for the fish? will they be able to handle that?


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## little_clown (Nov 24, 2010)

and one thing i realize in the past few days is, my 2nd clown started to chase the 1st one. My 1st clown is very friendly clown that it welcomes the 2nd one and swimming with it, sleeping with it, and you can see my 1st clown likes the 2nd so much. Things were okay until couple days ago, i saw the 2nd clown chasing my 1st one so my 1st clown is now staying to the top of the tank 

is there something I have to work on as well?


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## gucci17 (Oct 11, 2007)

Sorry I may have missed this but are you using RO/DI water?


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## little_clown (Nov 24, 2010)

I'm just using distilled water purchased from supermarket.


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## gucci17 (Oct 11, 2007)

little_clown said:


> I'm just using distilled water purchased from supermarket.


Ah ok. Do you ever plan on investing in a RO/DI unit?


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## little_clown (Nov 24, 2010)

yes i do. Still researching about stuff i need to setup a reef tank properly. 

I can't really tell what I'll be getting, but one thing I'm pretty sure at this point is I'm going to get a small tank at around 20G in size as my room can't fit in a bigger one.


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## ChefMark (Oct 23, 2010)

Distilled water is fine. As long as it is 100% copper free. 
Do not move the fish out of the tank when doing the cleaning. Moving them will cause more stress. First clean out all of the filter media and replace it but dont hook it back up to the tank yet. Then take a turkey baster to the rocks to get any dirty off of them and floating in the water. Then if you have a magfloat to clean the glass do so. Then with your Gravel Vac start to suck the fish poor out of the sand. Just run the van over the top. If you are using crushed coral you might have to go deeper with that van as fish waste tends to settle at the bottom. While this is happening water will be getting sucked out aswell.
Then hook the filter back up and add your fresh make up water. Then plug the filter back in . 
Oh just a thought also look on AP for used tanks as there are a few set ups for sale right now that are like 400 and have everything you need and the Live rock too.
The clown fish chasing the other I am not sure about as I dont keep them but my thoughts would be that the tank is to small or the clowns are the same gender. When pairing clowns you have to get one alot smaller then the other. But I dont keep them so someyone else will have to chime in for that..


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## Big Ray (Dec 8, 2009)

little_clown said:


> Alright~ thanks for the advise
> 
> I will go get a new pack of carbon tomorrow but do I need to soak it in the water for sometime before putting it into the filter?
> 
> ...


CArbon is good, and should be used at all times, but in a small tank like yours, specially since you are using distilled water, I would recommend using boyd chemi pure Elite instead.
http://www.bigalsonline.ca/Fish_Fil..._Chemi-Pure-Elite_9577985_102.html?tc=default

it removes po4 as well as SI (SI is what causes diatom algae that you see, although its normal, you should try to prevent it from growing more)

post a pic of your set up, we would be able to help alot more if we had a visual of the tank, although, from the sound of it, you dont have enough flow ... (do you mean literally fish poop on the sand ? or just dirt and detritus ?)
what is in the tank ? rocks, sand, heater, what filter ? any power heads ? do you have an oily film on top of surface water ? how thick is the sand bed ? all these are important in deciding how to clean the tank.

the SPONGE in the filter needs to be cleaned as much as possible, I assume you are running a HOB filter, so its best to remove the whole thing with the water, wash the sponge under TAP WATER (not tank water) untill its 100% CLEAN and no smell. this way when removing the sponge you wont be putting the dirt back in the tank.

if sand bed is shallower than 1.5" you should vacuum it, 1/3 each week, so when doing wter change this week, vacuum one side of the sand bed and ....

your biology is in the rocks and sand, so washing sponge wont cause Issues and should be done as often as possible, but sand vacuuming, limit to 1/3 a week.

regarding clowns, that's a good sign, read on clown fish (and every other keyword used here) when paring up, the bigger one changes sex to female ! and they actually do fight till the male gives up and they pair up .... Im just glad Im not a clown fish nor a seahorse  haha


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## Big Ray (Dec 8, 2009)

ChefMark said:


> Distilled water is fine. As long as it is 100% copper free.
> Do not move the fish out of the tank when doing the cleaning. Moving them will cause more stress. First clean out all of the filter media and replace it but dont hook it back up to the tank yet. Then take a turkey baster to the rocks to get any dirty off of them and floating in the water. Then if you have a magfloat to clean the glass do so. Then with your Gravel Vac start to suck the fish poor out of the sand. Just run the van over the top. If you are using crushed coral you might have to go deeper with that van as fish waste tends to settle at the bottom. While this is happening water will be getting sucked out aswell.
> Then hook the filter back up and add your fresh make up water. Then plug the filter back in .
> Oh just a thought also look on AP for used tanks as there are a few set ups for sale right now that are like 400 and have everything you need and the Live rock too.
> The clown fish chasing the other I am not sure about as I dont keep them but my thoughts would be that the tank is to small or the clowns are the same gender. When pairing clowns you have to get one alot smaller then the other. But I dont keep them so someyone else will have to chime in for that..


clowns are genderless like many other marine fish till matured.

excellent point on everything else


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## little_clown (Nov 24, 2010)

went to Big Al's today
picked up a pack of carbon, sea salt and a test kit.

This is how I changed the water, I mixed the water and have it sitting next to my heater to keep a good temp. Then I started taking the sponge and carbon out and clean it. I took some water from the tank mixing with distilled water and squeezed it a couple of times to remove the poops and dirts and I soak the new carbon pack in another bowl of water (tank water and some distilled water) to wash out some of the black substances discharged from the carbon pack. After that, I slightly rinse the filter because some dirts are sticking to the side of the filter. When all were finished, I put the sponge and carbon pack into the filter and start running it in the tank again.

Then i started sucking the poops on the sand bed as well as to take approx. 25% of the tank water out. During this process, I realized I made the tank's water even dirtier probably because the dirts down in the sand got suck out and some of them were floating around the tank.

After all cleaning's done. It wasn't really working very well for the first time... sigh
I replaced the mixed water I prepared earlier and poured it to the tank. Salt level, temp and water level are all okay. Then I started running the water test.

The result wasn't very good seriously.

I guess I don't need to explain the test result. Let's look at the pic below for the test result.

Now my 2 clowns are very very active in the tank, swimming up and down along the corner together. They might be stressed out because of the water changing...i don't know. I'll keep an eye on them.

The color of the rocks are changing, I can see some small dust or tiny feather like thingy on the rock. And one of my clown loves to eat those kinda stuff, it kept going to the rock and uses it's mouth to taste it. I've also attached a pic to show everyone how my rocks look like now.

I hope my 2 clowns are doing ok with the water change and I must need to find a way to get rid of the very high nitrate....any suggestion?

I welcome to any suggestions to fix the problems that I'm having.

If there're anything you guys think it's going wrong, please do let me know as I am now knowledgable enough to figure out that might be an issue.

Thanks loads!! 

Rocks - the brown stuff is now spreading to the side of the rocks









Fish and tank after water change









Sand bed









My water test result --- the amonia result turns more green after 5 mins, so I don't know if i'm okay or not, right after 5 mins, it is very close to the "0" color range but the longer I left it in the test tube, the green-er it goes









Am I doing it right for my first time?


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## ChefMark (Oct 23, 2010)

Ok your test results do not look good at all. 
The Ph for me is hard to see kinda looks like 8.0 ? 
But you are showing signs of that your tank is still cycling . Or it just cant handle the load. Your Nitrates are through the roof. I have never seen them that high . At over 160 your tank is way way to full of fish poop. 
Your Ammonia should always be at O. (other then when cycling tank) anything higher and this can hurt/kill your fish. 
You need to do water changes every 3 days or so and try to get those levels down. I keep my nitrates around 10 well I dont keep them there thats what that are at until I get get some macro algae. You need a bigger tank too
Were is the other clown fish in the pic ? I thought you had two ?
the sand looks ok. You also need a CuC in that tank. 
You need to spend alot of time reading my friend. or this hobby will feel more like a chore and you will not enjoy it and end up not having a a thriving reef tank. 
Read read read.
http://www.chucksaddiction.com/


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