# Where to get "real" SAE?



## vraev (Mar 29, 2012)

Hey guys,

I am sure the Big Al's generally don't have the true SAE. Also AI is out of them and not sure when they will get some in. Anyone know where I can get the true SAE? And...I just cleaned my tank thoroughly and there is little algae..still beard algae on rocks but thats it atm...don't expect it to be long before it comes back. But want to get the cleaners in: amano shrimp and sae and oto. Any place where I can get the read deal? + do I need to get algae wafers just in case? I plan on adding like 20 shrimp..perhaps will start with 5 first to make sure water stays stable... 2 sae and 2 oto...

thanks,

v


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## coldmantis (Apr 5, 2010)

I know of only 2 place in GTA that carry true SAE, that is lucky's and BA north york.


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## vraev (Mar 29, 2012)

wow! Hmm! I guess I'll give them a call and see if they have it. Jimmy...are they delicate fish?


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## menagerie (Mar 18, 2006)

coldmantis said:


> I know of only 2 place in GTA that carry true SAE, that is lucky's and BA north york.


We _always_ have them at the Menagerie. Driving from Hamilton for $2.99 fish would be a bit crazy. Ask Big Al's in Hamilton to get them, they are a franchise and frequently have different stock than the corporate stores. I'm sure The Fish Room in Brantford would have them as well. They are a lot closer to you.

True SAEs lack barbels unlike most of their doppelgangers.


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## vraev (Mar 29, 2012)

Infact true SAE apparently have barbels:


















http://www.future-digital.com/aquar..._tropical_fish/crossocheilus_siamensis_7.html

Is this the fish you guys carry?

thanks,

V


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## menagerie (Mar 18, 2006)

Gonna be honest and say the barbels have never been a distinguishing factor for us. We've always gone by the clear dorsal, jagged stripe that goes right into the tail. The picture looks exactly what we have but this batch is small. Not a great tank to see if they have to any barbels.

Customer has pointed out the "no barbel" thing to us and sent us a number of references in support. I guess only an ichthyologist specializing in Cyprinids could give an exact description. Fishbase shows some pictures with barbels and some without.


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## coldmantis (Apr 5, 2010)

vraev said:


> wow! Hmm! I guess I'll give them a call and see if they have it. Jimmy...are they delicate fish?


the ones from lucky's were pretty hardy, the ones from big al's north york not so much lol


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## vraev (Mar 29, 2012)

I just got a couple of SAE and 4 amano shrimp. They actually look real. FOllowed regular instructions...lights off.... changed 30% of water..primed new water, let bag sit for 15 min...then opened...added tank water ...15 min and then emptied bag in a bucket through net...put fish in. Both the SAE are gasping for breath at surface. I know the fish store have air stones in their tanks.....I don't .. I just raised up the lily pipe above the surface now and the fish are still gasping. I can understand perhaps too much CO2 (due to injection of co2 in our tanks)...but i changed 30% water as well... what should I do?  

More precisely...what can I do?  My first fish...


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## jarmilca (Sep 10, 2009)

vraev said:


> I just got a couple of SAE and 4 amano shrimp from the hamilton Big Als. They actually look real. FOllowed regular instructions...lights off.... changed 30% of water..primed new water, let bag sit for 15 min...then opened...added tank water ...15 min and then emptied bag in a bucket through net...put fish in. Both the SAE are gasping for breath at surface. I know the fish store have air stones in their tanks.....I don't .. I just raised up the lily pipe above the surface now and the fish are still gasping. I can understand perhaps too much CO2 (due to injection of co2 in our tanks)...but i changed 30% water as well... what should I do?
> 
> More precisely...what can I do?  My first fish...


Do you have a NO3 test kit?


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## vraev (Mar 29, 2012)

I took the water to the fish store and they tested it. Ammonia was 0...nitrite was 0.2ppm. but I don't have nitrate in my API kit.

The shrimp are at the substrate and once in a while just pop up to surface.

As I said...I did do a water change...so any accumulated nitrates should have been diluted.


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## jarmilca (Sep 10, 2009)

vraev said:


> I took the water to the fish store and they tested it. Ammonia was 0...nitrite was 0.2ppm. but I don't have nitrate in my API kit.
> 
> The shrimp are at the substrate and once in a while just pop up to surface.


Have they measured pH and KH too?


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## vraev (Mar 29, 2012)

THey used the strip test...didn't say anything about it...and then did the nitrite and ammonia test with liquid kit. 

I did pH in the past three weeks including yesterday and it is at 6.4.

YOu are right though...looks like nitrite poisoning. I just added 5 times prime to the tank. I hope it helps.


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## jarmilca (Sep 10, 2009)

That is quite a low pH if you are using tap water. Do you have a drop checker?
It looks like you are overdosing CO2. I would suggest to turn off the CO2 (plants do not need it at night anyway) and put the lily pipes back. If you can, try to increase water flow of your filter to bring as much oxygen into the water as possible.


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## vraev (Mar 29, 2012)

yup! CO2 is off. Lights are off atm and the lily pipe is above the surface bubbling water into the tank. One of the SAE looks tired and is resting on the rocks...his breathing isn't as fast anymore. The other is now actually taking occassional dives to the bottom.

EDit: Now the one that was at surface is exploring around..no longer breathing heavily... The second is laying around lethargically. I read though that SAE don't have a great swim bladder so they need to keep swimming. I guess I'll keep watch and see how it goes. Hope the little guys make it. I love their shape. They are pretty cool.

I honestly think u are right...nitrite might be it. How fast does prime act? I used 5 times the dose (not including the two drops per 4L) that I added to the new tap water.

ALso.. do I have to wait for a while after adding prime to tap water? I haven't been waiting at all so far.


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## coldmantis (Apr 5, 2010)

it shouldn't be the ph, since mines is under 6, but I do accumulate the fishes a little different then you, I have one of those specimen betta containers that you can hang on the side of your tank. I pour in some water from the bag(not much) and the fish. I hang the container on the side of the tank and take a shot glass and pour 1-2 cups of tank water in the container every 10-15 minutes or so, I do this like 5-6 times then I take the container to the sink and dump out as much water as possible, basically the fish will be in a puddle flapping around and I take the container with fish and dump it in my tank. That's how I accumulate all my fishes, no matter if it's from a fish store or I'm moving fishes from one tank to another. The only time I would ever drip accumulate is for sensitive fishes like cardinals, neons, and shrimps


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## vraev (Mar 29, 2012)

well...my first ever fish acclaimatisation. (14y ago...I was too young to understand and remember the way my dad acclaimatised our new fish). Both of them are now looking stable...hopefully they stay ok. But lesson learnt I guess...I need to be more careful. haha! I might have to do that drip acclaimatisation as i plan on getting cardinals later. 

Jimmy....u have these guys too....I right now don't have a lid. Do u think I need to get a lid for the tank? I read everywhere that SAE are strong jumpers..heck...while in the bag..one of them jumped to a dry part of the bag and stayed there for a bit before I realized where he was.

BTW...quick question.... my tank was cleaned yesterday so there is a little bit....but not too much algae. I only bought sera vipan flakes. Do I feed them if they run out of algae? also do the shrimp eat it? or should I get algae wafers?


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## coldmantis (Apr 5, 2010)

I can't tell you how many sae's I had that suicides, I had to go to dollar store a few times and buy some big photo frame for the glass so I can cut one for my ai cube so that they will stop jumping. I try to keep 1 sae and oto per 10g for algae control and 1 per 2g for amano shrimp. You should go buy some more, I'm pretty sure they will jump out of the tank.


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## vraev (Mar 29, 2012)

I do want to get more shrimp and oto before the cardinals...but these guys are the guinea pigs...first tank and I need to make sure they are happy before I get more fish. 

Hmm... lol...I guess I'll use seran wrap tomorrow before I turn on lights and try to get a lid in the evening. Thats a shitty way to go... loose fish because of them jumping out. From what I read..generally..turning lights on does make them freak out a bit.


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## vraev (Mar 29, 2012)

Hey guys....how many SAE can you put in a 25gal tank. I love these two guys. One of the two is a bit bigger and damn...he is a bully to the second guy. It is fascinating to see their threat posture and how they start their chases. But yeah... so far..both are doing well...and I really want to get more so that the second guy doesn't get harassed as much. I am thinking perhaps one more SAE would be great....but wouldn't mind getting 3 more to make it an odd total of 5 SAE in my tank. What do u guys recommend?


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## bigfish (Jun 10, 2011)

is getting just 1 SAE in my regular 10g tank a bad idea? i want it to get rid of my BBA. currently have 4 otos, 2 cory and about 10 guppies... moderately planted i would say



coldmantis said:


> I can't tell you how many sae's I had that suicides, I had to go to dollar store a few times and buy some big photo frame for the glass so I can cut one for my ai cube so that they will stop jumping. I try to keep 1 sae and oto per 10g for algae control and 1 per 2g for amano shrimp. You should go buy some more, I'm pretty sure they will jump out of the tank.


how easy is it to cut glass? i'm thikning of cutting one for my fluval chi


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## vraev (Mar 29, 2012)

I think you can definitely get one in there. I now have 5 SAE in my tank. I do think I overdid it a bit though.  I also got 3 ottos today. Although its awsome to see the 5 school together. The single biggest one (2" compared to 1-1.5 inches ) is still the bully who chases the rest around.


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## coldmantis (Apr 5, 2010)

bigfish said:


> is getting just 1 SAE in my regular 10g tank a bad idea? i want it to get rid of my BBA. currently have 4 otos, 2 cory and about 10 guppies... moderately planted i would say
> 
> how easy is it to cut glass? i'm thikning of cutting one for my fluval chi


cutting glass is easy, if you can draw a line you can cut glass. cutting it perfect every time is the difficult part


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## vraev (Mar 29, 2012)

Bad news! 

Found only 4 SAE in my tank today. Looked by the side of the stand, a dried husk like SAE.  Felt so bad. damn!! First priority this weekend...get a lid.


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## vraev (Mar 29, 2012)

M##$%#^$#*&R ...another SAE jumped out. What the hell is wrong with these fish? Damn it. Dumba## fish....


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## bob123 (Dec 31, 2009)

I have found that one SAE is all that is needed in a tank, as they get older and larger they will fight with each other.


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## vraev (Mar 29, 2012)

Typically from what I have read, true SAE are shoaling fish that do tolerate one another. Infact they are supposedly best kept in a group of 3 to 5. I personally like these fish, so I went with 5. I guess now I have 3 left.


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## GAT (Oct 8, 2011)

I've heard people using duckweed to prevent jumpers.


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## vraev (Mar 29, 2012)

problem is duckweed shades the plants which require high light.  I got my lid holders today...wil pick up a pane of glass and drill holes for lily pipes and make my own lids this week. Currently using seran wrap. lol


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## Dman (May 1, 2012)

Ever in Toronto? I sell acrylic lids for 5-15$ with pre cut holes where ever you want don't have to worry about dropping them or it breaking.


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## missindifferent (Jun 25, 2010)

Dman, do you custom make them, are they hinged? Can you send me a pic?


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## vraev (Mar 29, 2012)

Yes! I would like to see a picture as well please.  thanks


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