# Neons dropping like flies



## duckyser (Oct 4, 2009)

I recently bought 20 neon tetras and everymorning when I check on them there are always 1-2 dead. They live in my 50 gal tank that has been running for six months. I condition their water, have co2 and an air pump. They also live with honey gouramis, glowlight tetras and black tetras. The water has a ph of 6.5


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## trailblazer295 (Mar 7, 2010)

Have you tested for ammonia, nitrite, nitrates?


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## AquariAM (Jan 28, 2010)

http://www.aquariumdomain.com/images/fish_freshwater/tetra_neon6.jpg

Try to stick to the blue eyed neon over the yellow eyed. Much hardier.


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## TBemba (Jan 11, 2010)

honey gouramis and Black tetras could and would be picking them off if they are not that big.

I never test water and hardly ever lose fish. I think your tank might not have been running long enough. do you have plants? do you have algae? when did you do your last water change. What temp are you keeping your tank at?

Small neons are pretty sensitive fish and when small have a high mortality rate.


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## duckyser (Oct 4, 2009)

I haven't tested for nitrates, but the eheim 2215 is mature as it has been running for a very long time. I do 40% water changes weekly. I thought neon tetras would be an easy fish to keep =(


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## duckyser (Oct 4, 2009)

The tetras are blue eyed and the tank has many plants and algae I bought them at one inch long, so I thought they might have a better survivla rate than this


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## AquariAM (Jan 28, 2010)

duckyser said:


> I haven't tested for nitrates, but the eheim 2215 is mature as it has been running for a very long time. I do 40% water changes weekly. I thought neon tetras would be an easy fish to keep =(


Try doing 20% every 3 days instead. Neons adapt poorly. They're hardy if you acclimate them slowly and give them time to adapt in a stress free environment. Absolute darkness at night helps too.

It's a fragile fish. People who've had fish 20 years get neons and lose some.


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## TBemba (Jan 11, 2010)

duckyser said:


> The tetras are blue eyed and the tank has many plants and algae I bought them at one inch long, so I thought they might have a better survivla rate than this


I would say they should have a better survival rate in a tank like that. from my experience the Black skirt tetra are bullies and fin nippers and gouramis tend to be as well. But one inch neons should be ok but no idea if CO2 is an issue. I would do smaller water changes as well, some fish don't do well over 30 % a week I agree.


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## BettaBeats (Jan 14, 2010)

Is it me, or does using an air stone and a CO2 diffuser seem counter productive? 

The agitation of the surface water by the air stone will drive off any CO2 that is being pumped into the tank...

lose one.


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## Darkblade48 (Jan 28, 2008)

BettaBeats said:


> Is it me, or does using an air stone and a CO2 diffuser seem counter productive?
> 
> The agitation of the surface water by the air stone will drive off any CO2 that is being pumped into the tank...
> 
> lose one.


+1 Agreed. Using CO2 and an airstone are counter productive.


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## BettaBeats (Jan 14, 2010)

also, 20 neons might have been too big of a bioload. either way more ammonia would be produced, which means more nitrite, and eventually nitrate. 

if ammonia and/or nitrite were high than there is your problem, even with an established tank. It is the same for that other person in another thread that added 20 tetras to an already at-capacity tank and crashed their entire system.


IT IS VERY IMPORTANT TO TEST WATER PARAMETERS BEFORE AND AFTER PURCHASING STOCK. mostly because you will then have answers in case things go wrong, and also for your self in the future.

the more you test and understand how your water changes the more you will know for the next time. It is something I recently learned all to harshly. New tank, added 8 tiny micro rasboras, and only one survived. most likely due to overloading the system.


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## sunjwd (May 31, 2007)

Can you share where you got the Neons, and how long
a trip between the store/seller to your home?


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## duckyser (Oct 4, 2009)

Aqua pets. 45 mins


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## duckyser (Oct 4, 2009)

alright guys update. I removed all fish so that only the neon and black tetras were left in the tank, because i suspected that the honey gouramis might be picking on them. After removing them the tetra deaths have just continued. I'm very sure its disease now. It seems like the disease only affects only the tetras, but they show no sign of sickness and just die the next morning. As i said the tetras have no visible sign of sickness but the black tetras do have faint vertical lines on their bodies. I also saw one black tetra swimming in circles upside down. NEED HELP. Im down from 45 tetras to 25!!!!!!!!


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## TBemba (Jan 11, 2010)

NAFB are selling 10 XL Neons for only $15


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## duckyser (Oct 4, 2009)

alright guys after doing some research i think i might have neon tetra disease. =( 8 more died today. I had them for months, then within two weeks i lost 75%.


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## Sagittarius-Aquarius (Oct 30, 2009)

I haven't dealt with this nasty condition before, but could it be neon tetra disease?

I see above that this is the verdict. I wish you the best of luck with dealing with it, it's pretty much a death sentence but maybe some will get lucky.


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## duckyser (Oct 4, 2009)

i want to get more tetras, would cardinals be immune to ntd?


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## Sagittarius-Aquarius (Oct 30, 2009)

I have read that cardinals, for some weird reason, are immune. I'd suggest checking other forums or googling it.


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## Philip.Chan.92 (Apr 25, 2010)

Neon's are some of the most fragile and sensitive fish that I have ever owned, you are better off with hardier tetras. Cardinal Tetras are similar to neons except they are a bit hardier if you are determined to get the beautiful coloration of the neons.


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## mointhehouse128 (Feb 7, 2009)

Wow, I don't know what do say then your neons must have neon tetra disease, that came from the fish store maybe? Anyways, do their colors fade from the middle out? And I've had neon tetras for a long time, in very good conditions but also very bad conditions (when I first started).

I had major algae problems with diatoms when I first started then I was to lazy to clean the tanks, and the water became evaporated slowly till half of water was left. But, the neon tetra have not died, not a single one, and still have them today, in a very good tank  (except for the recent green spot algae bloom im having  )


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## duckyser (Oct 4, 2009)

update guys, 5 neons left. I observe them swimming in cartwheels. I dont expect them to survive until tomorrow, damn 50 bucks of tetras down the drain.


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## duckyser (Oct 4, 2009)

Alright guys, it has been a week since the last noen died. I added methleyne blue to the community tanks water after reading that it might help reduce the chance of the disease spreading. For the past week I have had three black neons that have survived and no deaths. I want to add cardinal tetras but am nervous to because some people say that cardianls are immune to ntd while others say the opposite. Do you guys think that it would be safe to add them now? Do you think the ntd in my tank is gone?


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## duckyser (Oct 4, 2009)

well went out and bought cardinals form luckys aqaurium which when I brought home i noticed have NTD AGAIN!!!!! OMFG

I know that NTD is said to be incuarable but i have to try something or ill lose my school of cardinals. Can you guys tell me the strongest anti parasite meds you know of? I have to try something...


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

I thought someone told me once that cards are immune to neon tetra disease... I could be wrong thou, I've had my cards for almost 4 years now.

It might be an indication that something else is causing the deaths. 

The fish in your tank might not be dying because they are used to the tank's lvls of nirates and trites but when you add the new fish they might get a shock. The store you got them from might have higher PH. Mine out of the tap is above 8. Your tank was around 7. something??..

I wish I could help more D:


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## duckyser (Oct 4, 2009)

No i am 100% sure its NTD. Bought 3 cardianls and had em for a week to make sure the conditions were good ph is 6.8-7 actually. I could see the white patch on the tetra so i know for sure its NTD and not the false kind.

here is a pic of a cardinal with NTD. Not mine but similar white patches. http://badmanstropicalfish.com/fish_palace/tntdmaybe_monaholmstrom.jpg


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## AquariAM (Jan 28, 2010)

When I have constant trouble with a certain group of fish, I don't blame myself, and then I move on.

I've had 'unreasonable' experiences and losses with neons through the years and have sworn off all tetras smaller than toonie sized (ie, black skirts, bleeding hearts) because I feel they're unreasonably fragile in too many ways. 

Maybe you should try a different kind of tetra?


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## Sagittarius-Aquarius (Oct 30, 2009)

I have to agree with Ciddian, I've read that cards are immune to NTD also. I cannot access the picture you've sent, unfortunately. Good luck.


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## duckyser (Oct 4, 2009)

http://badmanstropicalfish.com/fish_palace/ntdmaybe_monaholmstrom.html


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

Well if that is in fact NTD looks like you cant keep tetra really in that tank as AquariAM mentioned, thats all we can advise I guess.


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## duckyser (Oct 4, 2009)

talked to the people at big als and they said the patches could also be bacterial infection and can be treated with melafix. Apparently its impossible to know if its NTD or bacteria without a lab test =(. Fingers crossed for bacteria


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## AquariAM (Jan 28, 2010)

duckyser said:


> talked to the people at big als and they said the patches could also be bacterial infection and can be treated with melafix. Apparently its impossible to know if its NTD or bacteria without a lab test =(. Fingers crossed for bacteria


Take what the kids working in most BA's fish rooms say with a grain of salt 

If you're constantly getting X issue and it only affects Paracheirodon sp odds are it's NTD. I'm pretty sure it only affects paracheirodon so you could keep Hyphessobrycon (the tall fatter tetras like Bleeding heart/lemon/etc) for example and not have problems.


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