# Cruel to Keep an Angel in 5G?



## thea2003 (Mar 21, 2011)

Like the title says, would it be cruel to keep an angel in a 5g fluval chi tank? My immediate instinct is of course, am I some kind of idiot. I have a hard time giving up my fish and I don't want to set up a second large tank. I suppose I could put guppies in the 5G. 
The angel has killed all of my male guppies. He patrols the tank constantly, I am trying to plant my tank heavily but he gets into the plants as well. Is it something I shouldn't even consider?


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## Y2KGT (Jul 20, 2009)

Minimum recommended tank size for an Angel is 30 gallons so I would say yes keeping one in a 5 gallon tank is cruel. Not to mention the fact that your fish will not grow to its full potential and probably die young.

You can use this link to see the recommended tank size for the fish you're interested in.
http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=830+879+977&pcatid=977
--
Paul


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## mrobson (Mar 5, 2011)

if you really want to keep it maybe try to find him a temporary home until your plants have been able to grow a decent root system, also your guppies will stand a much better chance once you have some decent plant growth.


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## Ital_stal (Jun 4, 2010)

thea2003 said:


> My immediate instinct is of course, am I some kind of idiot?


......Yes.


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## Zebrapl3co (Mar 29, 2006)

Y2K have it correct and so does your instinct. Imagine you living your entire life in your washroom. Can't even stretch propertly. If you really like your angel that much, set it free. No amount of tampering is going make your 5G bigger. You will only make the condition worst.

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## tom g (Jul 8, 2009)

*angel*

yes agreed ... too small time to take to store and trade in for somethiing smaller ,, give it a home that will be bigger .i found it hard as well but i think u have too unless u plan on getting a bigger tank .


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## mrobson (Mar 5, 2011)

thea2003 said:


> I don't want to set up a second large tank.


i dont think he has it in the 5g yet from what i understand he is trying to plant his larger tank but the angel keeps killing his guppies and ripping everything out before the plants can root.

hes looking for advice on how to keep his angel while he plants his tank or should he just give up on planting.

If you can manage to plant it you will have greater success keeping guppies with him, ive got a betta in a 10g planted with a bunch of red eye tetras and dwarf frogs they all coexist peacefully.


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## pat3612 (Jan 29, 2008)

If that is the case It depends on how big the angel is if small its not going to hurt to temporarly keep him in the 5. I see that you are in Barrie if need be I have an extra 20 I could home him for you while you plants take hold just pm me Pat


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## thea2003 (Mar 21, 2011)

Y2KGT said:


> Minimum recommended tank size for an Angel is 30 gallons so I would say yes keeping one in a 5 gallon tank is cruel. Not to mention the fact that your fish will not grow to its full potential and probably die young.
> 
> You can use this link to see the recommended tank size for the fish you're interested in.
> http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=830+879+977&pcatid=977
> ...


Thanks, he is currently in a 30.



mrobson said:


> if you really want to keep it maybe try to find him a temporary home until your plants have been able to grow a decent root system, also your guppies will stand a much better chance once you have some decent plant growth.


It isnt so much that he is uprooting the plants or anything, he chomps on a few of the plants and because everything hasnt grown in, he squeezes into the tiny spaces between plants still. 


Ital_stal said:


> ......Yes.


lol thanks



Zebrapl3co said:


> Y2K have it correct and so does your instinct. Imagine you living your entire life in your washroom. Can't even stretch propertly. If you really like your angel that much, set it free. No amount of tampering is going make your 5G bigger. You will only make the condition worst.


He is not in the 5G. I was just toying with the idea although, i would feel guilty about it and based on responses here as well as instinct, I wont be putting him into a 5G



tom g said:


> yes agreed ... too small time to take to store and trade in for somethiing smaller ,, give it a home that will be bigger .i found it hard as well but i think u have too unless u plan on getting a bigger tank .


I wont take a fish I have a "bond" with to a pet store. I tried giving away an angel to a fish store a few years ago and 2 hours later I went back and bought him back and ended up setting up a second tank. 
I had a huge slew of brichardi fry that i took to a petstore a few years ago because i didnt want cichlids anymore and i never really liked them, they were just given to me, i didnt have any kind of attatchment to them. Worst comes to worst, i will have to set up the second 30G i have in the garage. I just dont want to have to buy new lighting, heater, filtre etc etc. not to mention the hydro costs.



mrobson said:


> i dont think he has it in the 5g yet from what i understand he is trying to plant his larger tank but the angel keeps killing his guppies and ripping everything out before the plants can root.
> 
> hes looking for advice on how to keep his angel while he plants his tank or should he just give up on planting.
> 
> If you can manage to plant it you will have greater success keeping guppies with him, ive got a betta in a 10g planted with a bunch of red eye tetras and dwarf frogs they all coexist peacefully.


Very close, i am a she lol. The angel isnt ripping up roots, but he does chomp on a few of the plants, the problem is the guppies still dont have a safe place and i cant afford to heavily plant my tank right away and cant take advantage of good deals on here since im not in the gta, i am in Orillia and i cant have things shipped now since it is freezing out. So while i wait for my tank to fill in and add more and more plants slowly but surely, my guppies are paying the price. I have no males left and i have about 6 females.

I have two clumps of limnophilia, about 12+ red wendth, one medium-large amazon sword and two small swords(just pulled off the mother plant) I have some hornwort floating, i am getting more water lettuce tommorow, I have a small clump of java moss. I have money wort which has dropped all of its leaves but still has a good root system, I had HC cuba in there but it was largely dying so i took it out and put it in a shallow container closer to the light to try to grow out a bit.
I had some dwarf hair grass but with the fungus treatment it killed some of it off so i only have a few new shoots.



pat3612 said:


> If that is the case It depends on how big the angel is if small its not going to hurt to temporarly keep him in the 5. I see that you are in Barrie if need be I have an extra 20 I could home him for you while you plants take hold just pm me Pat


Thanks! I do have another 30G and i will toy will think over temp housing him in there while i can get the tank growing well and then reintroducing him. He isnt a huge angel but he isnt small, i cant really guess his size, but in a store, an angel his size sells for $15( at least thats how much they were at Big Al on boxing day. He is a little over a year old, got him at about the size of a quarter and have had him for a year. he has HUGE fins, from top to bottom inclusing his fins, he is about 6 inches..maybe more??

Here are a few pics of the tank so far....still a work in progress and alot of trial and error.

I took this pic last night on my phone









These pics are from a few weeks ago but it gives you an idea of the size of the angel. The outside of the tank has since been cleaned lol


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## solarz (Aug 31, 2010)

Why not just put your guppies in the 5G while waiting for the plants to grow in? How many guppies do you need to house?

This way, you can just resolve the problem of the angel chomping on plants. Perhaps you can get tougher, less palatable plants.


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## mrobson (Mar 5, 2011)

have you considered planting some hygro and wisteria they grow super fast, are low light and cheap.


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## Zebrapl3co (Mar 29, 2006)

Or possibly buy a divider and section 1/2 of the tank to allow the plants to grow.
Nice angle BTW, looking at the pictures, it looks like you are taking good care of it.

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## thea2003 (Mar 21, 2011)

mrobson said:


> have you considered planting some hygro and wisteria they grow super fast, are low light and cheap.


Finding them is an issue....finding any decent plants for less that 12.99 is hard.



Zebrapl3co said:


> Or possibly buy a divider and section 1/2 of the tank to allow the plants to grow.
> Nice angle BTW, looking at the pictures, it looks like you are taking good care of it.


I may have to do a divider or put the guppies in the smaller tank for now. One of my concerns with REMOVING the guppies, is when i put them BACK in, the angel will pick on them that much more.

LOL He should look good, he gets all kinds of live food! hahaha.


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## thea2003 (Mar 21, 2011)

solarz said:


> Why not just put your guppies in the 5G while waiting for the plants to grow in? How many guppies do you need to house?
> 
> This way, you can just resolve the problem of the angel chomping on plants. Perhaps you can get tougher, less palatable plants.


Suggestions on tough low light plants?? The one he seems to really enjoy is the "new guy" limnophilia. I am looking for fast growing, bushy plants that baby guppies and adult guppies can hide in that is hopefully dense enough that the angel cant get into it. Is that even possible?


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## solarz (Aug 31, 2010)

thea2003 said:


> Suggestions on tough low light plants?? The one he seems to really enjoy is the "new guy" limnophilia. I am looking for fast growing, bushy plants that baby guppies and adult guppies can hide in that is hopefully dense enough that the angel cant get into it. Is that even possible?


Where are you located? I don't know about angels, but hornwort is pretty tough, grows fast and provides good cover. Otherwise, cabomba and water sprite also grow quickly. Moss of all kinds also provide great cover, if the angel doesn't nom on it.


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## thea2003 (Mar 21, 2011)

solarz said:


> Where are you located? I don't know about angels, but hornwort is pretty tough, grows fast and provides good cover. Otherwise, cabomba and water sprite also grow quickly. Moss of all kinds also provide great cover, if the angel doesn't nom on it.


Cabomba gets eaten by guppies... cant remember if the angel chomped on it or not. I have a little bit of hornwort floating around right now. I have some java moss right now. 
I am located in Orillia, which is outside of Barrie, the only fish store is Big Al's. Other than the local fish store who is very hit and miss with plants.
Water sprite is nice but I havent seen it in stores. It is extremely hard to find moss in stores around here too and if you do find some its all brown.


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## missindifferent (Jun 25, 2010)

Is it too cold to ship out plants? I can mail you some hornwort, water sprite and rotala rotundifolia if you'll pay for shipping (around $2)

Wish this was posted sooner, I just threw out a bunch of overgrown plants.


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## thea2003 (Mar 21, 2011)

missindifferent said:


> Is it too cold to ship out plants? I can mail you some hornwort, water sprite and rotala rotundifolia if you'll pay for shipping (around $2)
> 
> Wish this was posted sooner, I just threw out a bunch of overgrown plants.


Yeah unfortunately, everything is frozen here. I do have a friend who comes to toronto often though... just not sure where. I'm going to talk to her tonight. Thanks for the offer!


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## pat3612 (Jan 29, 2008)

*Plants*

Hey sorry jumping from one forum to another I have lots of plants and moss send me a pm and we can hook up in Barrie or you can come to the salt water meeting and check out my fish room. lol


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## kuopan (Sep 6, 2010)

yah i think it's a bit cruel, I'd only use a 5 gallon for breeding angels..


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## thea2003 (Mar 21, 2011)

After hmm-ing and haww-ing I have decided to move my guppies and plants to the smaller tank this way the guppy babies still have natural cover from adults and the angel can have a big tank and maybe i will get a couple more angels for him similar in size. He can just have plastic plants.
This way, I still have my planted tank, but it will be easier to get the necessary wattage and my angel has a big tank to himself and the guppies will still be ok and in fact be happier away from their enemy.


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