# just saying Hi



## planter

New here just thought I say hello. I've been keeping fish for about a year now and I have only two show tanks. One is a ten gallon planted tank and the other is a 46 gallon planted discus tank. 

BTW: nice forum


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## Ciddian

Hi and welcome planter! 

Thanks so much for taking the time to say hi, I hope we get to see peeks of your tanks someday!


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## planter

Thanks for the welcome. I am in the middle of re-doing both of them I will post some pics soon.


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## Shattered

Good morning, and welcome to the forums.


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## Tabatha

Hi Planter!

How are you finding Discus? Are they as difficult as everyone says they are? Do you RO water?

Welcome to the forum!


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## planter

Tabatha said:


> Hi Planter!
> 
> How are you finding Discus? Are they as difficult as everyone says they are? Do you RO water?
> 
> Welcome to the forum!


I have only kept them for six months, so far so good. I don't use R/O water because they are not wild caught nor do I plan on breeding them. Local bred Discus are a lot hardier then most people give them credit for. The trick is aclimate them slowly. I drip them for about 12 hours or so.

They still need super clean water and plenty of water changes and 2-3 feedings daily. WC discus are more of a challenge.


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## pat3612

Hi Planter and welcome Pat


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## Tabatha

planter said:


> I have only kept them for six months, so far so good. I don't use R/O water because they are not wild caught nor do I plan on breeding them. Local bred Discus are a lot hardier then most people give them credit for. The trick is aclimate them slowly. I drip them for about 12 hours or so.
> 
> They still need super clean water and plenty of water changes and 2-3 feedings daily. WC discus are more of a challenge.


Acclimatizing fish is an interesting topic, some say it does more harm than good b/c of the ammonia build up in the bag.

I've always simply floated the bag to temp then netted the fish and added them to the tank and I've never had a loss that way. Mind you, I've never kept discus. 

With regards to water changes -- more than 25% - 30% once a week?


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## gunnerx

Welcome! I would definitely like to keep Discus one day. What's the definition of "clean water" for discus?


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## planter

Tabatha said:


> Acclimatizing fish is an interesting topic, some say it does more harm than good b/c of the ammonia build up in the bag.
> 
> I've always simply floated the bag to temp then netted the fish and added them to the tank and I've never had a loss that way. Mind you, I've never kept discus.
> 
> With regards to water changes -- more than 25% - 30% once a week?


I don't float a bag to acclimatize my fish. When I purchase a fish I usually bring my own pail to the LFS. I try to get as much water as I can from the store. When I get home I stick a small heater in the pail and an air stone. Then I run a airline tube from my aquarium to the pail. With a airline valve I set the the drip at about one drop every 2 seconds. I know it's overkill in some cases but it's not really a lot of work. I go about my bussiness and I check the pail every hour or so..

I do 50% water changes every other day.


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## planter

gunnerx said:


> Welcome! I would definitely like to keep Discus one day. What's the definition of "clean water" for discus?


Clean water

0 ammonia
0 nitrite
5-10 nitrate (10 max)

Filteration - you should turn over the water a least 3 times per gallon with Discus. TDS also has to stay very low all of the water changes.

Discus alos release hormones when stressed. Those hormones stunt their growth and shorten their lifespan (yet another reason for all of the water changes) Doing a lot of water changes removes that hormone from the water.


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## Tabatha

planter said:


> I do 50% water changes every other day.


Holy Hannah, there's no way I'd ever do 50% water changes every other day, my eco-conscience wouldn't let me, unless it was filtered rain water. But still, that's a heck of a lot of work, I don't have time!

I've heard Harold at Menagerie has a completely different philosophy for Discus. I'll have to ask him about it...


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## planter

They are still young. Once they reach adult size, all of those water changes are really not that necessary. Once or twice a week is enough for the adults


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## Tabatha

AAAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah, okay! I didn't realize you were working with babies! LOL!


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## gunnerx

Wow, 50% WC every other day is quite a bit much. Good thing it's under 50gallons! Hope you have a python.


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## planter

Yes a python is a must with these guy's. I can't imagine doing all this with buckets.


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## twoheadedfish

welcome! I too hope to one day keep discus. great looking fish.


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## ameekplec.

Welcome to the forum!

Wow, 50% WC every other day?!? I thought I was good at 50% a week.

I didn't realize that young discus release potentially growth-stunting hormones. IMO, you could use a UV sterilizer to break down any pheromone present in the water, coupled with effective over-filtration which should eliminate the need for 50% WC every other day. But then again, I have no idea what stocking levels or feeding regime is like either.

Again, welcome to the forum!


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## Fishfinder

ameekplec. said:


> Welcome to the forum!
> 
> Wow, 50% WC every other day?!? I thought I was good at 50% a week.


Lol, i scoff at your 50% a week, i do like.....10-20% every 1-2months +top-ups lol! But i guess thats the benefit of Lowtech and large tank. 
Welcome planter, for someone only in the hobby for a year you sure have gone far and dedicated, hope you keep it up!


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## Calmer

> benefit of Lowtech and large tank


low bioload, and a lot of plants 

Welcome planter


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## ameekplec.

Fishfinder said:


> But i guess thats the benefit of Lowtech and large tank.


lol....my main tank is 75g, low light heavily planted....but also has 5 gold nugget plecs in it and a few leopard frog plecs growing out. Plecs = frequent water changes


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## Shattered

Welcome again, 

I wish I could grow plants with a low tech setup. My hornwart is dying and the only thing I seem to grow is green algae, which is good for the plecos.


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## planter

Shattered said:


> Welcome again,
> 
> I wish I could grow plants with a low tech setup. My hornwart is dying and the only thing I seem to grow is green algae, which is good for the plecos.


I never had much luck with hornwort for some reason too. It's considered an easy plant to keep but mine always ended up losing all of the needles and making a mess.


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## planter

Fishfinder said:


> Lol, i scoff at your 50% a week, i do like.....10-20% every 1-2months +top-ups lol! But i guess thats the benefit of Lowtech and large tank.
> Welcome planter, for someone only in the hobby for a year you sure have gone far and dedicated, hope you keep it up!


Thank you


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## Brian

Here's my late welcome to the forum!


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## Cory_Dad

planter said:


> I never had much luck with hornwort for some reason too. It's considered an easy plant to keep but mine always ended up losing all of the needles and making a mess.


From what I've read about hornwort it requires lots of nutrients, whuch makes sense becasue of it's prolific growth. I've had the exact same experience as you and others. I've managed to save 3 tiny sprouts from my last batch and am going to see if fert's will keep it healthy (thanks gunnerx for flourish advice).

And, oh ya, welcome to the forums. Better latent err, late than never.


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## planter

Cory_Dad said:


> From what I've read about hornwort it requires lots of nutrients, whuch makes sense becasue of it's prolific growth. I've had the exact same experience as you and others. I've managed to save 3 tiny sprouts from my last batch and am going to see if fert's will keep it healthy (thanks gunnerx for flourish advice).
> 
> And, oh ya, welcome to the forums. Better latent err, late than never.


Really ? I've always heard the opposite. Maybe that's why mine kept dying on me. Let me know if the ferts help. I would like to add some to a ten gallon I have. After having several stems die on me the thought of cleaning out those needles again makes me reluctatant to try again.


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## Chris S

In a low-tech, densely planted tank, it helps to have a higher bioload - you will find your plants grow better. Overfeeding will also help some.

Hornwort is also a nutrient sponge, but once you get it growing it won't stop.


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## Cory_Dad

Chris S said:


> In a low-tech, densely planted tank, it helps to have a higher bioload - you will find your plants grow better. Overfeeding will also help some.


Hm... I don't think that overfeeding in a fish populated tank in order to get hornwort to grow is such a good idea because of all the other potential problems over feeding produces.

Stay with ferts. It may cost a bit more but it targets a heck of a lot better than over feeding does with no undue negative affects to the fish.

IMHO

Cheers.


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## Chris S

Overfeeding is a great way to supply nutrients to your plants in a low-tech tank - I wouldn't suggest doing this if your tank is not heavily planted though, it can lead to many wonderful problems.

With lots of plants though, it works like a charm


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## Cory_Dad

Chris S said:


> Overfeeding is a great way to supply nutrients to your plants in a low-tech tank - I wouldn't suggest doing this if your tank is not heavily planted though, it can lead to many wonderful problems.
> 
> With lots of plants though, it works like a charm


Well, if you have direct experience with doing that then who am I to argue. I guess I've just never had a 'heavily planted' tank.

Thanks for the info and cheers.


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## ameekplec.

Overfeeding is indeed a great way to fertilize your plants. You just have to know what 'overfeeding'. I would only recommend this method on a very heavily planted tank (as was said), but also very established tank where you are very familiar with the equilibrium within the tank. Otherwise, ferts are the way to go, IMO.


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## Chris S

I don't run any low-tech tanks anymore, but when I did I took the advice from Diana Walstad's book, "The Ecology of the Planted Aquarium" in that extra food, and the buildup of "mulm" actually supplies a great deal of needed nutrients to the plants, especially in the root column. I was able to attain excelled growth of plants in Ludwigia, swords, pygmy swords and different types of Rotala through slightly overfeeding, in comparison to beforehand.

Many fish foods are high in nitrogen and phosphate, two the macronutrients needed for proper plant growth.

Again though, if your tank isn't densely planted, you don't have the nutrient uptake from the plants, therefore you will get problems like algae, ammonia, nitrite, etc.


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## Mr Fishies

I'd have to agree with Chris S on this one - fish food and what comes after it are 90% of what has kept my 50G going for years now. Only when I see yellowing or holes in leaves (that don't look like snails' handywork) will I add 1/2tsp of KNO3 - maybe 2 times in the last year or so and not since Feb of this year.


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## Fishfinder

Calmer said:


> low bioload, and a lot of plants


that also helps  Which i got! And lack, fish wise lol


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