# Wood Stand Materials?



## mauricion69 (Sep 4, 2013)

Hey

I am going to be building a stand for my new aquarium that is currently being built at Miracles, and wanted some input. (hopefully some finish carpenters or cabinet makers can chime in)
I want a modern style cabinet with 2 or 3 doors. But I want to try to avoid wood grain. I want a nice smooth/clean surface, basically like painted kitchen cabinets.
I would like a semi-gloss/flat look to it.
I was thinking about using MDF but I'm not sure how it would hold up with the occasional water hitting it. Is there something I can spray it with that will make it more water resistant? And the smooth finish I'm looking for... Can it be accomplished at home? I think it would have to be professionally sprayed by a cabinet maker.

This is roughly what I'm thinking but in black


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## CanadaCorals.com (May 12, 2013)

If you are looking for a more water resistant type of MDF, its called MDO (medium density overlay). It's used to make outdoor signs.


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## wtac (Mar 17, 2006)

You can use MDF as the multiple layers of paint will seal the MDF from moisture. It can be a fun DIY project for a semi-gloss or flat finish but not a technical and laborious process as a "lacquered" finish. The trick is sanding between coats, clean surface, clean work area and fine spray of paint/foam roller.

MDO is a bit more expensive than MDF but depending on the facing material, it will have voids that you have to fill and sand prior to the painting, especially the edges. 

Since you don't want a wood grain finish, MDF is fine to use. A good primer coat and multiple finish top coats will seal the MDF. If you chip the finish to the primer coat or to the MDF, you have to "touch it up" to seal it.

HTH


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## PaulF757 (Dec 9, 2013)

I've even building cabinets and kitchens for many years. I'm currently in the process of finishing my own stand and canopy. You can use MDF, That's what I'm using. The best finish for both smoothness, looks and water resistance you should use a lacquer paint with first a lacquer primer. I would recommend getting it sprayed professionally because the paint is expensive, it needs to be applied with spray guns and done in a spray booth due to the fumes, you def. do not want to do this at home.

I will be going the extra step and doing an extra layer of clear 10% sheen on all the interior surfaces to handle the extra moisture.
if you want more info just send me a PM.

I also have a bunch of large cut off MDF pieces that I can give you.


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## CanadaCorals.com (May 12, 2013)

PaulF757 said:


> I've even building cabinets and kitchens for many years. I'm currently in the process of finishing my own stand and canopy. You can use MDF, That's what I'm using. The best finish for both smoothness, looks and water resistance you should use a lacquer paint with first a lacquer primer. I would recommend getting it sprayed professionally because the paint is expensive, it needs to be applied with spray guns and done in a spray booth due to the fumes, you def. do not want to do this at home.
> 
> I will be going the extra step and doing an extra layer of clear 10% sheen on all the interior surfaces to handle the extra moisture.
> if you want more info just send me a PM.
> ...


Got any solid contacts for having MDF sprayed professionally here in the GTA?


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## mauricion69 (Sep 4, 2013)

Im thinking profesionally sprayed is the way to go. I want a DIY project, but I dont want it to look like 1. Especially with the finish I want.
I built my last stand, but I stained it. Came out really good. But with painting at home I dont think I will get the finish im looking for.
^also waiting for a response on last comment.


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## PaulF757 (Dec 9, 2013)

mauricion69 said:


> Im thinking profesionally sprayed is the way to go. I want a DIY project, but I dont want it to look like 1. Especially with the finish I want.
> I built my last stand, but I stained it. Came out really good. But with painting at home I dont think I will get the finish im looking for.
> ^also waiting for a response on last comment.


You have a PM.


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## PaulF757 (Dec 9, 2013)

CanadaCorals.com said:


> Got any solid contacts for having MDF sprayed professionally here in the GTA?


You have a PM


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## Crayon (Apr 13, 2014)

My husband John is a professional furniture maker and has built custom furniture for the last 25 years. He does his own finishing. I am not suggesting every one start calling him cause his work load is heavy. I am saying this so it is clear that I speak from our career knowledge and not just trial and error. My knowledge base is the design, and I have worked as a professional designer for the past 30 years. So I hire a lot of people to build things for me. A lot.

Mdf is a sponge. MDO is a phenolic paper overlay and it's ok, but as mentioned it has voids and edges would be an issue. However. There is a waterproof mdf which could be used for better assurance of water tightness although it should still be finished appropriately. You can order this from a few trade suppliers such as Robert Bury or Rayette Forest products and they should be ok with cash and carry but I can't say for certain cause we generally get deliveries from them. It's been a while since we used it and I am not sure about availability.
Also, and a better option for a number of reasons is marine grade plywood. If you want something really sexy check out the mahogany marine ply. All of this is from Noah's. I like this material a lot cause it has a really cool dense plywood edge that doesn't need to be edge banded and has a nice appearance. Plywood is also a better construction material than mdf. However it's best use is as a wood grain finish, which is not what the OP wanted.

MDF has no horizontal strength and unless it is reinforced properly and used in construction as it is intended could be a disaster. Which includes how it is joined together. MDF does not like to hold screws on the edge, should be predrilled if screwing and you should use long screws. Or better still don't use it to construct a tank stand that has to hold a few hundred pounds. 
You can use MDF to create finished panels on the outside and build an internal box that supports the weight. This is how most kitchen cabinets are built and in this case the mdf would not be structural so there is less fear of cabinet joints failing (as long as the box is built properly).
Now for finishing:
Ideally, with any wood including the marine ply or the waterproof mdf, you still want to saturate the raw surface with a 2 part thin clear epoxy resin coating to seal the wood. There are several products. Zpoxy is one. West system low viscosity epoxy also is good, but expensive. East System also has a product which is less expensive than West but not as good (from our experience). Zpoxy can be purchased from a few hobby stores, and this is what we used as a sealer for our units when we built them. East and West can be purchased from Noah's and a few other places that others have mentioned. Any place that sells carbon fibre cloth or fibreglass resin products. The idea is that you use a thin epoxy, applied by a rubber squeegee to coat all surfaces, inside and out. Push the epoxy right into the grain and then when it's dry sand it with a hard pad until you are flush with the wood, don't leave it thick.
Sand in varying grits starting with about a 80 or 100 grit cause this stuff is a b***h to sand! but really really worth it. Epoxy is smelly and messy and should be done with good ventilation. Once it is set, the off gassing is minimal and I find it's not that smelly within a couple days, but it depends on the epoxy. Finish sanding at around 220 and make sure you can sand somewhere that has good ventilation and you can get dusty. Our sanding set up has dust collection on it, which means the dust does not get airborn and end up everywhere.
Now, there are options to finishing.

There are marine finishes in solid colours that could be brushed on and sanded like the epoxy just noted, but it's a lot of work and not always the smoothest most professional look. To get a really smooth finish, spraying is still the best.

Yes, you can lacquer, and yes there are lots of professional finishers in the GTA that I know that would love to take your money and would give you a super excellent gorgeous finish, however, the finish is only as good as the material that you have used to construct the units. Look at it like this. Coat a sponge and it's still a sponge, just inside a thin coat of something that can still let water through. If you have built your unit in normal ply, mdf or something with a particle board core and are intent on using lacquer ask the finishers to use a post catylized lacquer, not just a pre-cat or non-catylized lacquer. If possible use a moisture cure urethane or catylized urethane. All of these noted finishes should be applied by someone with experience and a spray set up. A lot of them are toxic and require appropriate protection. Or in other words, don't try this at home.

But, if you were ok with a wood look, what you could use, and this is what we used on our cabinets we built and is a finish that I am using more and more on jobs, and can be applied at home, and does not require special spray equipment is a product from Exotic Woods in Burlington, made by a company called Rubio called Monocoat. It might seem expensive at first glance, but a large tank stand that is 60 x 24 x 36 can be entirely finished in less than half a pint. The coverage is extremely good. It comes in clear and also a variety of stain colours. As the name suggests, it only requires one coat. It is a post catylized moisture cure oil. It gets mixed as per the instructions using the oil and hardener in the correct ratios, and gets applied with a cotton rag and thinly coated, wiping all of the excess finish off. Follow the instructions. Honest, don't leave extra sitting on the wood, it doesn't work like that. But if you really want to put a second coat on, go ahead. The finish sets up within hours and is good to move after 24 hours. Use a mask when mixing and applying, but once it's cured does not off gas at all.
Do not dispose of rags in the garbage, lay them out to dry entirely, outside, not in a pile. You don't need a fire. 
The reason we are using the Monocoat more is because of the toxicity issues of spray finishes and the fact that John was getting sick. We have moved to more natural based finishes (don't get me started on water based finishes that stuff is s***) which has been primarily oil finishes. The oil does not need to be sprayed, does not stay wet so doesn't get dust in the finish, does not need to be sanded after applying and gets applied by hand, so no special equipment.
I have seen some awesome hand painted finishes done by people who are patient and careful. The trick is the sanding and doing good prep. It is possible to have a satin painted finish done at home, on mdf, if you have sealed the mdf properly and smoothly. Mdf gets fuzzy when painted raw, and you have to deal with this.
If, after all this, finishing is not your bag, and you do want to hire someone to finish a cabinet, let me know. I work with many many finishers in the GTA and if you PM me, and we can chat about what you want to do, I can give you some recommendations (not John). But as these are my trades and guys I work with regularly, it's not appropriate to stuff names here on the forum.

So, other options that don't require spray finishes that give a contemporary look? Consider back painted glass. It looks like high gloss black and the paint on the back is an epoxy paint which should not be affected by the salt. Although I can't say for certain as I have never tried it. Or just use black glass. That would not be affected by salt at all. But the design of the unit has to accommodate the glass thickness.
Consider the aluminum framed glass doors from places like Richelieu Hardware. You could use black glass inside the aluminum frame and this would be a nice look.
Build the stand from a solid wood, like oak and do a black stain, leaving the doors in black glass.
There are also some really nice options in thermofoils which are high gloss or satin sheen, and would work, but these are usually on particle board cores and there is a seam at the edge of the back which always seems to be the weak spot. Although it's better than a paint finish. Richelieu carries some of these and you could order panels finished to your sizes.
I liked the look of the sketch up you posted, with the wood doors and solid colour frame. Maybe turn it around and make a wood frame with solid black doors? 
There are some many options......

Now to take a poll to see how many people made it to the end of this post!


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## mauricion69 (Sep 4, 2013)

Ouff.. Made it!!!
Thanks for the replies... Definitely rethinking it??...
Oh by the way, yes I will be building a frame first with 2x4 & 2x6s.
Stand will be 72x24


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## PaulF757 (Dec 9, 2013)

With that said it depends on your budget. You can go with marine plywood, exterior grade MDF, they are amazing but you better be ready to spend the big bucks. You want it bullet proof, then do carbon fibre. No way would I suggest you build the stand out of MDF, I just assumed you wanted to wrap it in MDF. 

Here's how I look it, if a door gets damaged or sucks up water, $60 gets you a new one. The same thing could happen with better materials. I always use the best hardware to ensure durability, that's where I spend my money, on the moving parts. 

Again do you want a Ferrari or a Honda. If you're willing to spend a few bucks check out teak, love it, can't afford it, rather waste money on corals.

Hope that helps.


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## mauricion69 (Sep 4, 2013)

^ Being a Honda guy, I dont appreciate that last comment. Lol
That Honda might be cheaper, but will be more reliable than the Ferrari ever will.

Yea.. Definitely have options to think about. I gotta get crackin on this cuz I think the tank should be ready within 2-3 weeks.


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## Flameangel (Sep 25, 2013)

mauricion69 said:


> That Honda might be cheaper, but will be more reliable than the Ferrari ever will.


Yeah,you don't see Ferraris on the road in the winter time.


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## PaulF757 (Dec 9, 2013)

mauricion69 said:


> ^ Being a Honda guy, I dont appreciate that last comment. Lol
> That Honda might be cheaper, but will be more reliable than the Ferrari ever will.
> 
> Yea.. Definitely have options to think about. I gotta get crackin on this cuz I think the tank should be ready within 2-3 weeks.


I'm a honda guy too. Honda does not mean crap, it means reliable, affordable, cost effective to maintain and reasonably priced.


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## mauricion69 (Sep 4, 2013)

Flameangel said:


> Yeah,you don't see Ferraris on the road in the winter time.


But I see them on the side of the road in the summer broken down. Lol


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## Flameangel (Sep 25, 2013)

mauricion69 said:


> But I see them on the side of the road in the summer broken down. Lol


Probably in the chop-shop selling for parts or on their way overseas.lol


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