# Red fire shrimp dieing. Please help!



## ppaskova

I have purchased 4 red fire shrimps 3 weeks ago from BA. Last week one died and yesterday I found second one dead.
I have 10Gl planted tank with 6 neons, 6 rummy nose tetras 9 amano shrimps and now only 2 red fire shrimps.
Just tested the water and I have no ammonia, night rights or nutregins, my Ph 7 and temperature is 26C and water hardness is hard. All other fishes doing well. The fish tank is 5 month old. neons there from the beginning, amanos for 2 month and tetras for 1 month. Water changes 20% every week. Please help to determine why I lost 2 of them and possibility of loosing other two.


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## Darkblade48

ppaskova said:


> no ammonia, night rights or nutregins, my Ph 7 and temperature is 26C and water hardness is hard.


I assume you meant that your nitrite and nitrates are both 0 (given the context of your sentence).



ppaskova said:


> I have 10Gl planted tank with 6 neons, 6 rummy nose tetras 9 amano shrimps and now only 2 red fire shrimps.


This is likely your problem; the tetras may hunt down Dwarf Shrimp (even adult ones), if given the chance.


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## ppaskova

Darkblade48 said:


> I assume you meant that your nitrite and nitrates are both 0 (given the context of your sentence).
> 
> Yes you are correct.
> 
> This is likely your problem; the tetras may hunt down Dwarf Shrimp (even adult ones), if given the chance.


Well fire shrimp is larger than usual shrimp like Red cherry shrimp. Plus I found both bodies intact without any damage or so. Also my amano shrimps are the same size as fire shrimps and all of them fine. I hope you know the size of neons and rummy nose tetras they are not much bigger than my shrimps. I have hard time believing that neons or rummy nose eaten my fire shrimps (especially since I found bodies intact without damage). I know sword tail or platy will pick on shrimps, sometimes guppy but not usual. But tetra most likely will eat the dead one not alive. Are your tetras eating shrimps ????


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## Darkblade48

When you say Red Fire Shrimp, I assume you are talking about the redder colour variation of RCS?

I don't see how they would be significantly larger than RCS, considering they are the same species.

It is possible that while the shrimp were molting, they became targeted by the Tetras.


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## igor.kanshyn

Red fire shrimps is supposed to be a more red breed of cherry shrimps. They are not bigger than cherries.

What size your shrimps were?
How did you feed them?


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## Ebi-Ken

agreed, fire reds or painted fire reds comes from the color of the shrimp and nothing else.










This is a picture of a painted fire red. fire reds are slightly lighter color than this.All cherries. Just that they have been selectively bred to the point that they breed true. Never cross with normal cherries otherwise you will need to spend a good 2 years selective breeding them to get back the colors.


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## ppaskova

OK. Now I'm confused even more. According to this website Fire red shrimps are the same family as RCS.
http://www.tropicalaquatics.co.uk/invertebrates.htm
Mine look very similar to the one on the picture from website but completely different from picture Jiang604 posted. They are as big as amano shrimps, about 1.5-2" and much bigger (almost twice) than regular RCS but the same color not much redder. They also algae eating ones. I don't feed them differently than other shrimps or fish. They pickup flakes being pushed down by filter when I do my regular feeding once a day. Sometimes I drop the algae waffle but not often. Also when I bought my neons originally they were in the same tank with RCS. And my local BA has a demo tank where they have a lot of neons, rummy nose tetras and RCS are multiplying there like crazy as they taking periodically some from there (RCS) to sell. I can't believe that tetras in that tank eating RCS as every time I come there I can immediately count 20-30 RCS in that tank. They also have amano shrimps there. What also confuses me regarding them being eaten by tetras is that the first two I found was not damaged at all (looks like I lost another one as I only could see 1 male fire shrimp yesterday, I had 3 females and one male). Also I'm no longer sure which fish will not eat the shrimps? First I had swordtail and I had been told that he has eaten all my RCS after all of them disappeared a few weeks ago (after living 3 months in peace with all other fish) and I removed him. Now I have been told that tetras who lived with RCS in peace for a while can eat them as well. 
Regarding cross breading I'm not planning to bread my shrimps but yesterday I introduced 3 red crystal shrimps to my tank and today I was planning to reintroduce a few RCS as well. So now I understand that I better not to keep any shrimp (maybe amanos) together with fish and have each shrimp (like RCS, or Red fire shrimp or Red crystal shrimp) in separate tanks for them not to inter bread and lose their colors ??? Please advice on how to keep different kind of shrimp in the same tank and also together with the fish and which one ?


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## Darkblade48

First, you should figure out what shrimp you actually have. If the size of your shrimp is double that of a normal RCS, then it is probably not a RCS nor a colour variant.

A picture would be much more helpful in this case.

As for breeding shrimp, RCS, CRS and Amano shrimp can co-exist in the same aquarium with no interbreeding.

If you have a true Fire Red/Sakura RCS, then they will interbreed with your regular RCS, and the progeny may not be as red.


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## ppaskova

Unfortunately I cannot find a lot of info about my shrimp as I bought them in local BA and they list them as Red Fire Shrimp. They are almost twice bigger than my crystal shrimp and almost the size of amano shrimp. Their color is similar to RCS but little redder for female and similar little red for a male (but not as red as on the picture that has been posted in this thread). The website I provided is the closest one I could find that can describe them as description there is exactly the same as my shrimps. It will be very difficult to make a picture as I don't see them around very often anymore. But my question still has not been answered, what is killing them ? And would my tetras will eat my crystal and RCS ???


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## Calmer

By the off chance do they look like the ones in these pictures? If so then they are saltwater shrimp.
http://www.google.ca/#hl=en&source=...=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=&fp=ba17ffa4794fdb44


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## ppaskova

Calmer said:


> By the off chance do they look like the ones in these pictures? If so then they are saltwater shrimp.
> http://www.google.ca/#hl=en&source=...=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=&fp=ba17ffa4794fdb44


No. Not as red as on the pictures. And BA keeps them in the fresh watter tank. But could be same as amanos who are salt watter that can live in fresh watter


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## waj8

ppaskova said:


> I have purchased 4 red fire shrimps 3 weeks ago from BA. Last week one died and yesterday I found second one dead.
> I have 10Gl planted tank with 6 neons, 6 rummy nose tetras 9 amano shrimps and now only 2 red fire shrimps.
> Just tested the water and I have no ammonia, night rights or nutregins, my Ph 7 and temperature is 26C and water hardness is hard. All other fishes doing well. The fish tank is 5 month old. neons there from the beginning, amanos for 2 month and tetras for 1 month. Water changes 20% every week. Please help to determine why I lost 2 of them and possibility of loosing other two.


 How is it that the water is hard but the pH is only 7. Do you have CO2 in the tank.


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## matti2uude

Maybe he has these
http://www.planetinverts.com/Red Tupfel Shrimp.html


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## Ebi-Ken

ppaskova said:


> No. Not as red as on the pictures. And BA keeps them in the fresh watter tank. But could be same as amanos who are salt watter that can live in fresh watter


oh ok let me clarify. fire red, painted fire reds. whatever you want to call them. ALL originated from normal red cherries. BUT through selective breeding of the most reddest shrimps over many years. but yes, all in all they are all still cherries. just the red intensity is different depicted by the names. But to answer your question about why your shrimps are dieing. How are they dieing? molt problems? just dead on the spot? showing signs of lethargy?


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## ppaskova

waj8 said:


> How is it that the water is hard but the pH is only 7. Do you have CO2 in the tank.


No no CO2 or any fertalizers expept florish tablet under one of the plants


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## ppaskova

matti2uude said:


> Maybe he has these
> http://www.planetinverts.com/Red Tupfel Shrimp.html


They look similar to my


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## ppaskova

Jiang604 said:


> oh ok let me clarify. fire red, painted fire reds. whatever you want to call them. ALL originated from normal red cherries. BUT through selective breeding of the most reddest shrimps over many years. but yes, all in all they are all still cherries. just the red intensity is different depicted by the names. But to answer your question about why your shrimps are dieing. How are they dieing? molt problems? just dead on the spot? showing signs of lethargy?


They look dead on the spot. When they die they look as normal alive ones but not moving and their noses facing gravel. May be it's too worm for them ? In addition one looked like showing signs of lethargy but when I picked him up he looked like molting. The second one was very active the day before and was always swiming on top of the fish tank as he wanted to get out


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## waj8

So what is the KH and GH of your water? Are you doing something else to lower the pH?


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## Darkblade48

waj8 said:


> So what is the KH and GH of your water? Are you doing something else to lower the pH?


+1. This could be the answer.

Also, the temperature is not too warm for your shrimp.


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## igor.kanshyn

I'm intrigued. 

Are your shrimps really red?
You might have bamboo shrimps. They are big.

You can also have red nose shrimp

It can be orange sunkist shrimp as well.


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## matti2uude

I don't think he has Red nose or Orange sunkist shrimp as he said they are the size of Amanos.


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## igor.kanshyn

matti2uude said:


> I don't think he has Red nose or Orange sunnier shrimp as he said they are the size of Amanos.


They are bigger than cherries and can grow till amano males size


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## ppaskova

igor.kanshyn said:


> I'm intrigued.
> 
> Are your shrimps really red?
> You might have bamboo shrimps. They are big.
> 
> You can also have red nose shrimp
> 
> It can be orange sunkist shrimp as well.


None of hte above


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## ppaskova

waj8 said:


> So what is the KH and GH of your water? Are you doing something else to lower the pH?


No I'm not doing anthinig special to my watter Ph. I'm changing watter every week 20% and using prime and BA conditioner in the new watter and stability bio support after watter change. Maybe combination of Prime and BA conditioners dropping the Ph. What is KH and Gh and how can I mesure them (I'm using API 5 in 1 kit)?


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## ppaskova

Darkblade48 said:


> +1. This could be the answer.
> 
> Also, the temperature is not too warm for your shrimp.


I don't understand what is +1 ? Also I may agree on temperature (but amanos doing well) as I don't know exacly as I'm using regular (not digital) termometer and my is on top of green mark which I figure out around 26C. Also I found remainig two red fire shrimps as well as crystal ones as they hiding or exploring.


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## ppaskova

OK. Guys according to your answers I better not to have any shrimp (except Amanos) in my tank with my fish ? So what fish if any will be good with Red cherry or crystal shrimps ?


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## Darkblade48

ppaskova said:


> I don't understand what is +1 ? Also I may agree on temperature (but amanos doing well) as I don't know exacly as I'm using regular (not digital) termometer and my is on top of green mark which I figure out around 26C. Also I found remainig two red fire shrimps as well as crystal ones as they hiding or exploring.


+1 simply means that I am in agreement with the previous statement.



ppaskova said:


> No I'm not doing anthinig special to my watter Ph. I'm changing watter every week 20% and using prime and BA conditioner in the new watter and stability bio support after watter change. Maybe combination of Prime and BA conditioners dropping the Ph. What is KH and Gh and how can I mesure them (I'm using API 5 in 1 kit)?


As I mentioned previously in another thread that you started, the Stability Bio Support is not needed whne you change the water. If you are using one water conditioner (i.e. Prime), then there is no need to add the other water conditioner.

It is unlikely that they are the reason that your pH is dropping.

kH is also known as alkalinity and is a measure of the (mainly) carbonate and bicarbonate contributing species. There are other factors that will contribute to kH, which is why you cannot use aquarium water in a drop checker to measure CO2 levels (but this is another story).

gH is general hardness and is a measure of various cationic species such as calcium, magnesium and iron (amongst others) which contribute to the "hardness" of water.

I do not recommend the API 5 in 1 test strips, as they are notoriously inaccurate, and are often found to go bad, especially if stored improperly. I would advise you get a liquid (drop type) test kit for future use.



ppaskova said:


> OK. Guys according to your answers I better not to have any shrimp (except Amanos) in my tank with my fish ? So what fish if any will be good with Red cherry or crystal shrimps ?


Please see my answer to your question here:

http://gtaaquaria.com/forum/showthread.php?p=134587#post134587


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## ppaskova

Darkblade48 said:


> First, you should figure out what shrimp you actually have. If the size of your shrimp is double that of a normal RCS, then it is probably not a RCS nor a colour variant.
> 
> A picture would be much more helpful in this case.
> 
> As for breeding shrimp, RCS, CRS and Amano shrimp can co-exist in the same aquarium with no interbreeding.
> 
> If you have a true Fire Red/Sakura RCS, then they will interbreed with your regular RCS, and the progeny may not be as red.


OK. I was finaly abble to make a picture of them.


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## Darkblade48

Hard to say what that is, as the picture is too blurry...but perhaps it is just a very large female RCS?


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## souldct

Either you have really big rcs or you have really small amano shrimp. 
If i'm correct, the price you paid for these were around 4.99 to 5.99 at big al's right? 
If so, those would be rcs. The picture looks like rcs too, though its blurry like anthony said.


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## ppaskova

souldct said:


> Either you have really big rcs or you have really small amano shrimp.
> If i'm correct, the price you paid for these were around 4.99 to 5.99 at big al's right?
> If so, those would be rcs. The picture looks like rcs too, though its blurry like anthony said.


You are right I paid 5.99 in BA. The description on web site I originaly provided said that is is a bigger variation of RCS who lives longer and slitly bigger. This is what my picture is showing. Sorry could not make a better one as she were on the back of the tank


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