# How to start out a planted tank?



## Platypus (Jun 2, 2009)

Hi guys, after looking around the forum, I have noticed the beauty which planted tanks have. After looking around, I haven't found a full step-by-step. I am sure there are a bunch of people like me looking for a guide. If someone has one that I missed, I would appriciate it if you post it. One thing that is a factor for me is that I don't have much money to spend. Thank you.


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## ameekplec. (May 1, 2008)

1. Buy a quality substrate - time and time again I see people cheap out, only to have to do it right the second time or use long term ferts which can get expensive (more so than doing it right the first time). I personally now like eco-complete - but anyway buy a good "planted tank" substrate.

2. Figure out what kind of set up you want. High light, CO2 injection ($$$), ferts, or low light, low maintenance; your next step hinges on this. 

3. after you've acquired the proper equipments for what you want to do, get your plants - the best is to buy everything you want at once and plant all at once, and not collect piece by piece. In the long run this is the best for stability and good growth from your plants.

4. sit back (do maintenance) and enjoy! Oh, and figure out the 105967245418 bumps along the way


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## Platypus (Jun 2, 2009)

Thank you for the response. I have a few questions though.

1. What is the a good substrate thats somewhat cheap.

2. Do we need C02 injection if its low-light?

3. Is dwarf hairgrass good for the bottom and what else would go good with it?

-Platypus


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## greenterror23 (Oct 20, 2008)

1. Cheap and good susbtrate is flourite red which is $27.99
2. No you dont need co2 for low light plants just a good light and a good substrate or you can add a diy co2 if you want.
3. dont know yet as im researching more...LOL


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## Platypus (Jun 2, 2009)

If you find anything that will spread and cover the bottom very quickly, I would love to be updated. THank you!


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## Platypus (Jun 2, 2009)

Lighting.

I have two cfl 13 watt bulbs. Is that enough for a 14 gallon?


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## greenterror23 (Oct 20, 2008)

atleast 2 watts per gallon


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## Platypus (Jun 2, 2009)

I got some dwarf hair grass and a grass which I dont know. Anything I should know?

Also do I run a filter or air pump? Currently no fish in the tank.


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## Darkblade48 (Jan 28, 2008)

Platypus said:


> 1. What is the a good substrate thats somewhat cheap.


Fluorite or Eco Complete are both good products, for a reasonable price. Eco Complete may seem a little more expensive, but you get more (I believe the /100g price is similar). Compared to ADA substrates, these two substrates are quite economical.



Platypus said:


> 2. Do we need C02 injection if its low-light?


CO2 is not mandatory if you have a low light tank, however, it does help.



Platypus said:


> 3. Is dwarf hairgrass good for the bottom and what else would go good with it?


What do you mean by "good for the bottom"? Are you looking for a carpet plant? In low light tanks, your choices are limited to Java Moss and maybe Quadrafolia. Dwarf Hairgrass might do OK in a low light tank, but don't expect it to explode or carpet quickly.



Platypus said:


> Lighting.
> 
> I have two cfl 13 watt bulbs. Is that enough for a 14 gallon?


Depends what you want to accomplish. I would say that it would be enough for a low-low/medium light tank.



greenterror23 said:


> atleast 2 watts per gallon


Not necessarily true for tanks smaller than 10 gallons or larger than ~90 gallons.



Platypus said:


> I got some dwarf hair grass and a grass which I dont know. Anything I should know?


A picture of the unknown plant would help us identify it. Hopefully it is not a terrestrial plant that was sold to you.



Platypus said:


> Also do I run a filter or air pump? Currently no fish in the tank.


An air pump is not really required in a planted tank. A filter would be required, regardless of whether you have fish or not.


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## Mr Fishies (Sep 21, 2007)

Platypus said:


> Anything I should know?


Yes. Read everything. Learn a bit about plants and how they "work", learn a bit about nutrient uptake and fertilizers. There is a ton of information out there, just waiting to be Googled...some sites even have agreeing information! 

In the end there is always trial and error due to the differences in hobbyists' set-ups. Different plants under different lights, different substrates, different water change routines, different fertilization schemes/levels, no CO2, CO2 with high light, CO2 with low light.

Your question is something like "Tell me everything I need to do to have a really nice garden in my backyard". There really is no single better than the rest method, there are just as many paths to have a nice planted tank as there are a nice garden. ie: A yard full of formal flowerbeds is a nice garden, but so is a yard with a huge tree and a bunch of shade loving plants underneath it, but the step by step directions will be very different.

Since cost is a factor I'll mention I got back into aquariums and planted tanks with a few lower light soil based set-ups which are very cheap and easy as long as you control your soil. My main tank at the moment is a lower light lower CO2 type tank.

A few links to fill your head with information:

Tom Barr's 2 steps: Step1, Step2 (a very good read IMO)
Plantedtank.net: Basics to starting a Planted Tank
APC: El Natural - Soil based planted tanks
APC Plant'cyclopedia APC Plantfinder
Chuck's pages: Setting up a New Planted Tank
Cichlid Forums: Setting Up a Planted Aquarium
Naturalaquariums.com Natural Aquarium FAQ page
Rex Grigg's Rex's Guide to Planted Tanks


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## Platypus (Jun 2, 2009)

Firstly, thank you Darkblade for answering my questions. Sometimes Q's & A's are so beneficial to beginners

Secondly, thank you to Mr Fishies. You are right, there is so much to read and those links are great.

Two more questions  

Is 26W of clf for a 15 gallon enough for dwarf and micro sword if I want it to grow quick?

I read that using sand from your local river is also beneficial. Do you agree and would it work?


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## Darkblade48 (Jan 28, 2008)

Platypus said:


> Is 26W of clf for a 15 gallon enough for dwarf and micro sword if I want it to grow quick?


Depends what you mean by "quick". I had to up the light more before I was pulling Hairgrass out on a weekly/twice a week basis. Don't forget that besides light, you will also need CO2 and nutrients for plants to grow quickly.



Platypus said:


> I read that using sand from your local river is also beneficial. Do you agree and would it work?


I would be wary of using local river sand, as it may contain a whole host of various undesirable organisms that may be introduced into your tank (without proper sterilization).


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## Mr Fishies (Sep 21, 2007)

Platypus said:


> Two more questions
> 
> Is 26W of clf for a 15 gallon enough for dwarf and micro sword if I want it to grow quick?
> 
> I read that using sand from your local river is also beneficial. Do you agree and would it work?


The whole watts per gallon thing is a bit deceiving since some lighting gives a lot more light per watt than others. The WPG rules are based on older normal output lights, so while you may have less than 2 WPG (electrically speaking) you have a lot more light with CF bulbs than you would with the same amount of normal T10 or even T8 fluorescents. (See Lighting Guide - Lumens/sq in vs. WPG) You're close to what I would consider a high light setup.

You will almost certainly IMO need to add fertilizers to your tank or with that amount of light your plants will use up nutrients fast leaving conditions that only algae will grow in.

High light = more nutrient demand & more growth and trimming
More light + CO2 = higher nutrient demand & much more growth trimming
Less light + CO2 = elevated nutrient demaid, not as rapid growth less trimming
Less light + no CO2 = low nutrient demand, less growth and trimming

It's an equation that needs to be kept balanced, too much of one thing and not enough of another will almost always lead to problems over time. As your plants grow, they use more nutrients, need more fertilizers, block more light at the top of the tank, lower plants get shaded...you need to keep trimming to keep things growing. It's just like any garden, when you finally get everything growing well, it becomes work to keep everything in check and not overgrown. It's a labour of love though.

I've used soil, bagged soil several times, but I would be scared to use sediment from a water system anywhere here near the GTA, the possibility of contamination, unexpected/unwanted bacteria and pathogens is just not worth the risk IMO.


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## Darkblade48 (Jan 28, 2008)

Mr Fishies said:


> The whole watts per gallon thing is a bit deceiving since some lighting gives a lot more light per watt than others. The WPG rules are based on older normal output lights, so while you may have less than 2 WPG (electrically speaking) you have a lot more light with CF bulbs than you would with the same amount of normal T10 or even T8 fluorescents. You're close to what I would consider a high light setup.


While I agree that CFLs are often more efficient and output more light than the older bulbs (T12, in particular), there are a host of other variables that must be considered (presence of a quality reflector, orientation of the CFL, height of the CFL above the surface of the water, etc).

Here is an excellent link that discusses this in more detail:
http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/l...choides-blyxa-2-5g-lighting-2.html#post837592



Mr Fishies said:


> You will almost certainly IMO need to add fertilizers to your tank or with that amount of light your plants will use up nutrients fast leaving conditions that only algae will grow in.


I am currently using two 13W bulbs over my 10g tank, and I never dose macros, just the occasional micros along with the weekly water changes.


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## Mr Fishies (Sep 21, 2007)

Darkblade48 said:


> ...there are a host of other variables that must be considered (presence of a quality reflector, orientation of the CFL, height of the CFL above the surface of the water, etc).


Good point, I didn't note that before, but you're absolutely right. I've been using lighting from AHSupply and they come with amazing reflectors and are about 3 inches above the water. I have a 96W over a 75G (so definately not 2WPG) and most stems grow 6+ inches a week and Crypts are adding a leaf a week or so. Maybe that's why I have a different perception of CF performance...I'd bet if I had the same bulbs with no reflector (or one not as good) and I lost 25% of the light energy, or it was 1 foot over the water it would be a very different story...different variables.



Darkblade48 said:


> I am currently using two 13W bulbs over my 10g tank, and I never dose macros, just the occasional micros along with the weekly water changes.


Obviously, the water changes are providing enough nitrates etc, but with that lighting, I would have thought that tank would burn through nutrients really quickly - but it does go to show that it's really difficult to take all the variables into account and provide a "Do steps 1 through X and you'll have a happy planted tank".


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## Darkblade48 (Jan 28, 2008)

Mr Fishies said:


> Obviously, the water changes are providing enough nitrates etc, but with that lighting, I would have thought that tank would burn through nutrients really quickly - but it does go to show that it's really difficult to take all the variables into account and provide a "Do steps 1 through X and you'll have a happy planted tank".


I've tested my tap water before, 0 nitrates. I believe Toronto water has an upper threshold for nitrates, and it is considerably low.


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## Mr Fishies (Sep 21, 2007)

Darkblade48 said:


> I've tested my tap water before, 0 nitrates. I believe Toronto water has an upper threshold for nitrates, and it is considerably low.


No CO2 then? See, that's what makes this hobby so cool...nobody has to take the same path. You don't dose, your water changes are adding less than 1 ppm of nitrate, so the the nutrients are coming from food & waste I guess? Heavily stocked 10G? Something is surely feeding the plants!

I tried running tanks with no soil (nutrient) and adding no ferts (nutrient) and I just could not get anything except algae to grow!


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## Darkblade48 (Jan 28, 2008)

Mr Fishies said:


> No CO2 then? See, that's what makes this hobby so cool...nobody has to take the same path. You don't dose, your water changes are adding less than 1 ppm of nitrate, so the the nutrients are coming from food & waste I guess? Heavily stocked 10G? Something is surely feeding the plants!


I don't dose macros, my water changes add < 1 ppm nitrates, and I have no fish in that tank, it's a plant grow out tank 

I think it's because of the way the lights are set up, etc. I have the CFLs in a horizontal (as opposed to vertical) setup, and also don't have nice reflectors (I'm using the faux-polished aluminum reflectors that comes stock with those 10g tanks).


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## Chris S (Dec 19, 2007)

My 2 cents with plants: Try what you think looks good or want to try, don't restrict yourself to the "demands" of a plant.

I've had serious trouble growing some of the easiest plants around in high-tech, co2 injected tanks and at the same time, have had no problem growing some high-demand plants in low-light, no fert setups. 

Plants are relatively cheap, so try what you want!

The only other thing I would say is take Eric's advice regarding substrate. Don't cheap out. I also recommend eco-complete - great stuff and worth the $$.


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## Platypus (Jun 2, 2009)

A little late, never looked at my thread till now. Thank you all for the largely appriciated input.


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