# Jumping Angel Genes



## Merman (Nov 23, 2009)

I've only just started breeding and raising angels about a year ago and have forgotten most of the genetics I learned in school, I've been on 'Angelfish' sites and have read dicussion with ref. to alleles, etc...

Since a year ago when I first started breeding and raising angelfish I bred a silver and koi with their resulting young not having kois (no orange blotches/clear fins) but when I matched a silver from their young with a black I more recently acquired there were a few koi (very few maybe 3%) so I guess the koi trait is recessive and skipped a generation (?). Within this most recent batch I have blacks and silvers and few of what seem to be a cross of silver/striped and black....as if those traits 'blended'...but no blacks with clear/koi fins, lol. 

I've got some blue striped angels....really nice fish but not impressed so much with the finnage and I believe I've read that the 'blue' trait may be recessive...my question here is: if I were to cross a blue/striped with a well-finned black would the coloration 'blend'/would I end up with any black angels with 'blue' irridescence and good fins? If blue is recessive will it re-appear in the next generation??

....oh, the things that will run through an idle mind...


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## Cory (May 2, 2008)

Probably won't get an answer like that without consulting a specialist geneticist lol. Most of the genes associated with colours and finnage in fish are little understood and they vary from fish to fish. Guppies, which are one of the most extensively bred fish ever aren't even fully understood. Which colours will mix, how they will mix etc. is really just a try and see sort of thing. I have a breeding pair of koi angels but have yet to raise any fry from them. I expect their fry will be all kois though. The koi/black veil pair that formed is another story. If those two breed, I have no clue what the offspring will look like but I'd love to find out.


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## bae (May 11, 2007)

Angelfish color can be complicated because most forms are due to several genes interacting, sometimes in surprising ways. Also, the length of day the fish are raised under has a strong effect on some patterns -- e.g. silvers raised under continuous light don't develop stripes! The amount of orange in a koi angel depends on several genes as well as environmental factors, including diet.

If you google for angelfish genetics, you'll find a number of sites with good articles. Here's one with a series of articles by Dr. Joanne Norton: http://theangelfishsociety.org/genetics.htm and other information about genetics http://www.theangelfishsociety.org/phenotype_library_2007/NewIndex.html


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## bae (May 11, 2007)

Cory said:


> I have a breeding pair of koi angels but have yet to raise any fry from them. I expect their fry will be all kois though. The koi/black veil pair that formed is another story. If those two breed, I have no clue what the offspring will look like but I'd love to find out.


From a fast pass through the pages I recommended to the other poster, your two kois should produce either all koi or 3 koi to 1 gold, but the amount of orange on the kois can vary from zero to lots. As for the koi/black pair, this gets complicated because there are several different combinations that produce black, but the results may tell you the genotype of the black. Veiltails are can be ****- or heterozygous for that trait, so you'll get either half or all veiltails. Homozygous veiltails have longer, more disorderly tails.

Let us know what happens.


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