# Scrape turning ugly



## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

Crap crap crap..

So i had to move the ornate last week or so and while i was trying to get him he busted through the top of the aquarium  Landed on the floor and just about went under the bed. I had to scramble to try to get him...

I put him in the bigger tank which he shares with a pleco. Its a 45 tall i think... (still not big enough i know)

Anyway.. not much was wrong, he was crusing around and checking things out. But then a few days later he gets a dull grey patch, where i figured he messed up his scales. Not fuzzy at all. just a dull grey.

Now the dull grey has a red center all the way down.. I am freaking out.  

There are spots where the ornate bichir can get and the pleco cant. I have never seen the pleco go after the ornate. 

The tank gets about 25% water change on fridays.

As soon as i noticed the f's up back i added Pima and Mela to try to keep anything messed up at bay.

I have no idea on what to do, if i loose this guy i will litterally loose a huge chunck of myself.  If anyone can help i would really appricate it. I am so paniced i can't think of what to do.

Thanks for reading, sorry for the long post

::EDIT:: I am gunna try to pick up a large tubberware and dril holes in the lid in the morning. I'll try my best to get a photo.


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## Katalyst (Jul 29, 2007)

Jess could it be heater burn? I would have used Pima and Mela as well.


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

I dont think so......but anything is possble...The heater doesnt seem to be moved or budged..

I kinda thing its sepcimia (sp?) I thought i was keeping the water clean enough but who knows. Its already too small for the pleco 

This was all suposed to be fixed after we move with a nice huge tank.. and now i dont think i'll even get that far. 

I am gunna work on a photo now


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

Correction....... it is the pleco. Damnit. It kinda looks like he's been rasping the injured scales off.

I wonder if they would have been okay together if the ornate had not been injured...


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## Katalyst (Jul 29, 2007)

I had a plec with a badddd injury from a fight and heater burn. I used melafix and pima fix and he was like new in about 10 days. Hope your guys pulls through. You can also try asking over at www.plecofinatics.com I've found them to be an extremely helpful and nice group of people. Wish I could help more.


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

Thanks so much Kat, i finally got photos so if it looks like heater burn lemmie know. I've never seen it before....

::EDIT:: i just made a post there as well


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## Katalyst (Jul 29, 2007)

Looks similar to what my L114 had and the mela and pima fixed it up. Worse case scenario I'd use maracyn. Is he eating? I had excellent medicated food made by a fish vet specifically in the States. And everyone likes it even the pleco's. I had to seperate my injured one just so he was able to get the food lol. It you want some you are welcome to come on over.

The pleco fora is really helpful as well so I'm gonna go see what they have to say and bump your thread if necessary.


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

Thanks again Kat 

Bob wouldnt let me get another bin so the pleco had to go into the guppy tank. LOL he doesnt seem to mind.

He is eating i think but he doesnt take much else than guppies and silver sides. But maybe if i shoved a bunch of the medicated food into the silvers that would work. I dont know the next time I will be able to make it over.. but i could this weekend if you have nothing else to do 

i'll bring you some plants!


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## Tabatha (Dec 29, 2007)

*OUCH!* That looks really sore. 

I hope he makes a full recovery, I'm sorry it didn't work out btwn him and the pleco. I'm glad it's not an illness!


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

Sorry about your fish Ciddian. I would personally also look towards the pima/melafix route if its getting worse. Have Harold and Wilson weighed in and said what they'd do about it?

It doesn't look like its going to be life threatening or impairing or anything though


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

Nope I havent gotten to bother them yet. However.. After a few hours with the plec getting moved he's been bouncing around just like before

I dont know what i am gunna do now that i have to keep them separated..


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## Cory_Dad (Apr 18, 2008)

Yikes!

It looks like something took a belt sander to him. I've never heard of heater burn and didn't think it was even possible with the amount of water flow in a tank. Maybe if you tied the fish onto a 250 watt heater... Wouldn't they swim away when it got too warm?

As for the wound, I'd monitor it very closely. I don't have a lot of faith in the 2 'fix's when it comes to serious diseases. But for now they can be used to try to control the situation as the wound doesn't appear to be infected. Smart idea to keep up the water changes; the cleaner the water the better.

Good luck and cheers.


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## Katalyst (Jul 29, 2007)

Cory_Dad said:


> Yikes!
> 
> It looks like something took a belt sander to him. I've never heard of heater burn and didn't think it was even possible with the amount of water flow in a tank. Maybe if you tied the fish onto a 250 watt heater... Wouldn't they swim away when it got too warm?


Heater burn can be pretty common with pleco's actually.


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

i can totally see it with plecos and this guy.. he likes to snuggle up to stuff. Thanks you guys, i'll keep you updated


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## Katalyst (Jul 29, 2007)

Ciddian said:


> i can totally see it with plecos and this guy.. he likes to snuggle up to stuff. Thanks you guys, i'll keep you updated


Yep which is why they make heater guards lol. My weirdo's like to squish into tight places and one of those places consists of mashing himself between the heater and the glass. Until I got an external heater which I think annoys him lol. I almost considered putting in a broken one in that I haven't gotten around to throwing out, unplugged of course so he'd have his favorite spot back. 

Hows he looking today Jess?


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

sameo today... I soaked some beefheart in some water and a garlic. He has two new lumps in his belly so i know he's eaten them LoL

His back looks terrible.. Its a water change day.


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## Tabatha (Dec 29, 2007)

Ciddian said:


> sameo today... I soaked some beefheart in some water and a garlic. He has two new lumps in his belly so i know he's eaten them LoL
> 
> His back looks terrible.. Its a water change day.


Poor baby.  Do you think the pleco was gnawing on him for sure? I caught one of my bn plecos gnawing on another's fin over the weekend. Do you physically break them up or do you let them determine dominance?

Have you been treating with Mela/Primafix?

_ - t._


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

I am really unsure.. At first i didnt see any rasping issues.. Usually he only gets that way over food. I know the ornate hit the tank top so he was a bit brused up. I think maybe the pleco just was thinking about an easy meal.

I have no idea if i will be able to keep them together. Unfortunatly they both enjoy the bottom of the tank and the bichir is really shy.. The plec can easily push him around.


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## Tabatha (Dec 29, 2007)

What kind of pleco? Did I miss it?


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

its a sailfin pleco, or red... somthing somthing.. lol Here we go 
http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog/species.php?species_id=148

Op! and yea I have been treating with Pima and Mela


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## Mattsmom (May 21, 2008)

Hi Ciddian! I'm sorry about your little fella... the redness could indicate an infection starting. I don't find that pima and melafix are really much better than pristine water. The pics you posted... the greyish areas seem to be tinged with red (bloody splotches which could be indicative of septicemia). How is he acting since this happened? How is he eating?

If this is a true bacterial infection, it needs good antibiotics. Maracyn & Maracyn2 in combination makes a broad-spectrum antibiotic that covers both gram positive and gram negative bacteria. If you suspect septicemia... I would consider the MI/MII combo or if you can get Kanaplex, which is also a broad-spec antibiotic and slightly stronger/more effective than the Maracyns... but the Maracyns are easier to get and are still quite effective. I had to get my Kana online.

Of course, ensuring his water params remain pristine will also help!

I hope he gets better! 

Michele


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

Thanks michele! He's actually really getting better! Yesterday i was a bit hopeless when i got home and the snails had started to bother him. He didnt look good.. So i added some aquari-sol to the tank to help me keep a fungus out break at bay. (and maybe kick off some of those snails)

I've been watching for any spikes in ammonia as well....

My plan was to pick up those two biotics this friday when i go into work at Pj's. I just didnt want to go med crazy as that can be stressful on its own. 

The redness is starting to fade... it doesnt look internal like i've usually seen sepcimia (sp) but like a blood clot or slow bleed.. But i was definatly worried about it like you said. 

You guys think i should still treat with biotics this friday anyways or just keep up the clean water?


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## Tabatha (Dec 29, 2007)

How's his behavior Cid? Is he eating and active?


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

Well.. he's still mad at me cause I am the mean guy for moving him... But when we walked in tonight he was doing his tank wiggle 

As soon as I came over he ducked and covered.. >.>

I have some beefheart soaking in some garlic right now, i'll let you guys know if he tanks it


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## Mattsmom (May 21, 2008)

Since you're not getting the antibiotics till Friday... just watch him in the meantime... if there's improvement without the meds... then just keep watching and ensure the water stays pristine. 

It's true... we don't want to medicate unless it's truly needed as it can lead to future resistance issues when meds are definitely required. If his appetite is not there, however, and the area seems to get more red or even get fuzzy, and his behaviour gets more lethargic... then I would consider medicating. It's also good to have these antibiotics on hand anyway... b/c illnesses usually pop up when the stores are closed!  

Good luck! I hope he gets better on his own!!

Michele


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

Oohh and you know what! I did have maracyn but i took it out of the box and they wernt labeled oddly! So i wasn't exactly sure what the mystery medicine was LOL

A lot of my stuff is expired too, I'll have to get that up to date.. I just.. rarely need them thank heavens 

Sorry i fell asleep yesterday early but he did eat! And quickly too... He has no red marks at all today. Its looking great!

He still hates me... but after a few silversides that may change.. Hehe


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## Tabatha (Dec 29, 2007)

YAY! I'm so happy he's doing better!!!


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## Mattsmom (May 21, 2008)

That's great news, Ciddian!! I hope he continues to get better.

I've also got a basket full of meds for just incase... but have only ever needed them once when I brought home a very sick betta from the store. Other than that... they're just there collecting dust... but it's good to have on hand regardless. Which reminds me... I should check their expiry dates, too.


Michele


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

Thanks guys! 

This was him a day or two ago when the red went away...Feeling better but omg can these fish put you through a guilt trip. This was all i usually saw of him while he wasnt feeling well.

Today thou, he's doing his wiggle out in the open and not dashing away when we are here 

"I am upset with you..."


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## Katalyst (Jul 29, 2007)

That fish gives some serious pout! What a cutie! Glad to hear he's feeling better.


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## Mattsmom (May 21, 2008)

Awe... so glad he's back to normal! He's a beautiful pleco, Ciddian! 

Michele


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

OOhh the pleco was always okay. The guy who got hurt is actually an ornate bichir. Sorry for not being clear


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## Mattsmom (May 21, 2008)

Ooops - that was my bad!   But he's still beautiful! 

Michele


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

Oohhh so he's still slightly Po'd with me but as long as he is healthy is all i care about lol

Took some shots today! Sore? what sore?..Heehehe I am extreamly pleased with his recovery



















Sorry about the water stain there.


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## lili (Dec 15, 2007)

Good job !


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## Calmer (Mar 9, 2008)

Excellent, I am glad to see he is much better.


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

Thanks!


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## Katalyst (Jul 29, 2007)

What a handsome fellow he is! Yay I am glad he is back.


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