# are female Snowballs larger than males ?



## Fishfur (Mar 4, 2012)

I've never thought to ask if there is a size difference between the sexes, but now that I've now transferred most, hopefully all, of my Snowballs to a separate tank, i have noticed quite a size difference among them. I actually thought I'd got them all out of the big tank, but found two more tonight I'd missed. One big one, one very small.

So it turns out I have quite a few more Snowballs than I thought I did, which was a nice surprise. There were also a few, including one from tonight, that are far too small to be from the same batch as the ones I started out with, so I think at least one hatching must have escaped my notice. I assume the two or three very small ones are the only survivors. It's easy for them to disappear in the 30 g tank, and I'd never have noticed a batch of babies if they were in the back or under the wood.

If females are, in fact, larger, it looks like I have more of them than I thought too.. at least 3 or 4 that are noticeably larger than any of the others, rather than the one.. and the one that was berried isn't berried now, so she must have dropped them, so maybe there are some babies in the big tank I have yet to find. I'll keep an eye out to see if more show up. 

So please tell me, are the bigger ones girls or just well grown shrimp ? Not one has a saddle I can see, do those only appear when they are in breeding condition ?


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## randy (Jan 29, 2012)

Female shrimps are generally bigger. Shrimps in the same batch don't all grow at the same rate either so you can see some much smaller some much bigger. In my limited experience, female shrimps don't get noticeably bigger until breeding age but I could be wrong.


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## Fishfur (Mar 4, 2012)

Well, I know at least one of these was berried.. and is no longer berried. So they are most definitely breeding age. Size wise, most are pretty much the same, aside from the four or so that are much bigger, which I now assume are likely female, and the rest male.. but the ones that are small are so much smaller, less than half the size of the next smallest, so I kind of think they may be offspring. Whether they are or not, it was still a very nice surprise to find I have as many as I do. Before I started catching them to move them, I thought I had but one female and maybe a half dozen males. It's next to impossible to tell them apart, so I've obviously been seeing more than I thought. But there are quite a few more than I originally started with, so I must be doing something right . Hope so !

I have to say, they are very attractive little creatures. Ghosts are amusing, they remind me of the harried business man characters in old cartoons, scurrying to a meeting in the rain, one hand holding their hats on, one holding up a briefcase. When they've got a food pellet, the image is quite vivid.. yeah, I know, crazy imagination ! 

But the Snowballs, even though they have similar behaviours, never look harried. They always look sort of serene and purposeful. Hope I can get a tank set up for cherries soon, I'd really like to get some cherries.


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## randy (Jan 29, 2012)

Fishfur said:


> But the Snowballs, even though they have similar behaviours, never look harried. They always look sort of serene and purposeful.


I thought so too until one day I witnessed them mating....


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## Fishfur (Mar 4, 2012)

Now that is one behaviour I have yet to see ! Snails'll do it anytime, not that there is much to see, but shrimp, never have seen them mating, at least, not that I know of. What all do they do, if it's not too rude to ask  ?


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## randy (Jan 29, 2012)

Fishfur said:


> Now that is one behaviour I have yet to see ! Snails'll do it anytime, not that there is much to see, but shrimp, never have seen them mating, at least, not that I know of. What all do they do, if it's not too rude to ask  ?


To some's disappointment, the actual mating is very short. I was referring more to the part when a male snowball chases a female, they lose their cool and serenity.


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## Fishfur (Mar 4, 2012)

Well, at least now I'll know if I'm seeing the possibility of mating, perhaps ? The more I learn, the happier I am - 

Thanks, OH Fearless Leader  !


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## randy (Jan 29, 2012)

Fishfur said:


> Well, at least now I'll know if I'm seeing the possibility of mating, perhaps ? The more I learn, the happier I am -
> 
> Thanks, OH Fearless Leader  !


Karen, I'm no leader and definitely not fearless ;-)


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## Fishfur (Mar 4, 2012)

Then you do an excellent impression of a Fearless Leader ! Don't see anybody else setting up a nifty shrimp group .

Out of curiosity, did you ever see the Rocky and Bullwinkle cartoons, with the very campy '60's Russian spies, Boris and Natasha ? That's where the line comes from. Something I grew up with. 

Anyway, I'm still finding more Snowballs in the big tank, four more since the other day, at least one more potential mama shrimp, if she ever gets berried. For a fairly bright white creature, they sure are good at hiding ! And I finally got a look at my little fan shrimp female. She's green, unlike the others, who are wood coloured, and she blends into the floating plants so well, I rarely can find her. She looks good. I wonder if I will have any success with the fan shrimp getting berried ? I must get to setting up the brackish tank so it will be ready in case I am lucky enough to get an opportunity.


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## randy (Jan 29, 2012)

No idea about Rocky and Bullwinkle. I didn't grow up in North America and I watched different cartoons ;-)

You're adventurous trying to breed the less popular while more challenging species. Do keep up posted on the results, some day I might even give it a try myself.



Fishfur said:


> Then you do an excellent impression of a Fearless Leader ! Don't see anybody else setting up a nifty shrimp group .
> 
> Out of curiosity, did you ever see the Rocky and Bullwinkle cartoons, with the very campy '60's Russian spies, Boris and Natasha ? That's where the line comes from. Something I grew up with.
> 
> Anyway, I'm still finding more Snowballs in the big tank, four more since the other day, at least one more potential mama shrimp, if she ever gets berried. For a fairly bright white creature, they sure are good at hiding ! And I finally got a look at my little fan shrimp female. She's green, unlike the others, who are wood coloured, and she blends into the floating plants so well, I rarely can find her. She looks good. I wonder if I will have any success with the fan shrimp getting berried ? I must get to setting up the brackish tank so it will be ready in case I am lucky enough to get an opportunity.


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## Fishfur (Mar 4, 2012)

Well, I figure there is no point in wasting an opportunity, should one present itself. I am not sure the fan shrimp are even old enough to breed yet, but I kind of hope I will see one berried one day. So far, I have 3 that are at least 3 inches long and still growing, though they do not moult often. Two of these turned out to be male, one was female. The fourth female is much, much younger and much smaller than the first 3, as well as being a different colour. Even should they reach breeding age or condition, I have to wonder if this ratio is a workable one - that is,, two males to two females. With the dwarf shrimp, my impression is that they do better with many females per male. So I may try to get a a couple more female fan shrimp at some point in time. Tough part is figuring out what sex they are when they're small, as the main visible difference is the size of the front legs, and that's much harder to see when they're young than when they get to a decent size. 

I would also like to try with Amano shrimp, if only because it's been done enough times that there is some information about it available. Mind, first I'd have to get some of them . 

But even those little micro crabs I have, I learned recently that someone has succeeded in breeding them in an aquarium, though it appears it was more by accident than by design. Knowing that it's possible to breed these more difficult creatures makes me want to try it, if I get the chance. But it may take a lot of time & a lot of trial and error. But I have time, and I do like a challenge. I simply have to be patient, which is perhaps the hardest thing of all to be. 

And I found yet another Snowball in the main tank today. He managed to evade the net. Have to try again next time he pops up. I'd just like to know where the dickens they are hiding, that I keep finding more of them !


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## randy (Jan 29, 2012)

I can't help much. I found this thread and it stopped at day 7, I even bumped up the thread by asking for an update for you ;-)

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=153293


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## Fishfur (Mar 4, 2012)

Thanks for that.. interesting thread. Hope he does update it. 

I've got a couple other sites bookmarked that have various sets of instructions on them for raising Amanos.. needless to say, none agree completely with any other. But first, I've got to get some Amanos ! And just now, I am flat broke, so I'm not going to be able to invest in any new critters for awhile. But I figure I'll just use the time to practice with the Whisker shrimp instead.. I have at least one that's berried now, and if I can get the brackish tank set up in the next few days, maybe I can try hatching her larvae. From what little I have been able to find out about Whiskers, they have a brief larval stage, more like the Ghost shrimp do. Sadly, I've noticed that the last few berried ghosts have not given me many babies. I wonder if it may simply be a bit too warm for them this time of year. I can keep the tank down to 70 if I leave the fan on all the time, so I'm going to try that for the last two berried Ghosts I have, to see if it IS temperature that's affecting the hatch rate. I also have the females in the breeder box, outside the tank and I have to wonder if that's having any effect on the hatch rate too. All the other batches hatched in the 5 G, then I removed the females.. but it's so much easier to catch them in the breeder box than it is in the tank, I will be unhappy if it turns out the breeder box is the problem, rather than temps. 

Oh well, live and learn !


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