# OMG- im running a phosban reactor!!!



## Letigrama (Jul 6, 2008)

hi all,

I finally made the big jump  Greg you must be so proud of me. I found a 150 two little fishies used, got the pellets and a pump.

I have looked at the set ups and videos, and have a few questions.

1.I set the valve 3/4 strength. I should start with less I think, but the pellets wont move much if I go less than this.. I put very little pellets in it to start safe.
2. the set up. The pump takes from the middle chamber and the out is in the last chamber right next to the main pump. Is is ok to do it this way? Is is safe that the water outlet will be so close to the return pump? and should the reactor pump be in the 1st chamber instead, next to the skimmer? The way I have it set up is- 1st skimmer- then reactor picks up- then return pump picks and through the UV filter, to the tank.

Took a pic of the reactor, you can see the water dropping next to the pump ( need a longer hose...


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## noy (Nov 19, 2012)

Leti
I noticed you are running the biopellets with the sponge inserts. There is actually a screen you should use to increase the tumbling (and effectiveness).

http://www.jlaquatics.com/phpstore/store_pages/product-info.php?product_ID=tf-reactory

There are different thoughts on whether the output should be directed to a skimmer input to minimize the chance of a bacteria bloom.

You may also want to kick start your anaerobic bacteria population with a product like microbactor7 or KZ Zeobrak.

This is a pretty useful article.

http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/instructions/article/BRS-Biopellets

Nonetheless, its a great start!


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## sig (Dec 13, 2010)

Letigrama said:


> hi all,
> 
> I finally made the big jump  Greg you must be so proud of me. I found a 150 two little fishies used, got the pellets and a pump.
> 
> L]


I am proud, but sorry I have no clue about using bio pellets Somebody will help

this is a good beginning

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## Letigrama (Jul 6, 2008)

Greg, LOL. I know I'll try GFO later on, I wanted to start with the pellets.

NOY, thank you so much! I now the pellets are not tumbling that much, but the instructions show the sponge and it didnt come with the screen, which I saw somewhere and I was wondering what was that for. I am going to buy it online. 

Should I watch a bacteria bloom? Should I do some WC if that happens or let it subside?

In regards to the placement, in the instructions show the intake in the middle chamber of the sump like mine... i think it should be alright

And I will start to look at the other link you gave me which I have no clue whatcha talking about....


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## noy (Nov 19, 2012)

If you have a bacteria bloom your water will get cloudy. Also you may get a cyano bloom - which was always my problem. WC really won't do much you just have to weather it. 

there is nothing magic about that screen - you can make one yourself if you can get some of that plastic mesh material. All it does is provides a smooth surface and prevents the pellets from dropping through. The only problem with the sponge is that the bottom layer of pellets gets trapped and they don't tumble (as much).

I actually have one if you want it.


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## Letigrama (Jul 6, 2008)

thank you Noy. No worries, I will get it. yes, there is some pellets under the sponge...

Question: do we run this 24/7? i turn it off for the night as i am bit scared and then i started to wonder if this runs all the time like the skimmer...

Thanks!


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## noy (Nov 19, 2012)

7/24 - if you stop the pellets from tumbling too long they will clump together.


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## Letigrama (Jul 6, 2008)

so far so good but nothing has happened... bad or good. I will test my phosphate levels...


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## Letigrama (Jul 6, 2008)

ok so, quick update.

Super frustrated. Reactor is working 24/7, however, after a week of running, phosphate levels are showing a whooping 2.5 

Im beyond mad. So the pellets are tumbling but not all the way. I order the screens and a new O ring, as the one inside is broken, and I know if might be affecting the pressure inside the canister. If that doesnt do the trick, Iam getting GFO ( phosban media) and dumping these pellets to the garbage. I was reading yesterday that:

* it takes about 10 days to see any results, is this right>
* and that GFO is acts 5 to 10X faster than the pellets.

I dont know why the phosphates are not down. The algae seems under control though and I dont see any new...


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## wtac (Mar 17, 2006)

Don't get too impatient. Keep in mind, PO4 will be leaching out from the LR and substrate as it is removed from the water column.

Whether you use GFO or BP, it's going to take time before you see the PO4 levels begin to fall. If the algae is under control and not getting worse, it is a step in the right direction. Is your skimmer showing an increase in skimmate production? Corals looking a bit "plumper/fuller", greater polyp extension? If so, then the sloughed off bacterial biofilm is being removed/consumed. 

Looking at the pic of the amount of BP in the first post, you can add another 50% of BP into the reactor. The leakage of water due to the faulty O-ring will not hamper BP tumbling...just water directing as it flows upwards. At least it's in the sump .


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## fesso clown (Nov 15, 2011)

Nothing good happens fast.... (sorry couldn't help myself) 

I don't use bio-pellets but from what I know it could take at least a few weeks to a month to see concrete results in your PO4 and Nitrate numbers. IT is also very much recommended to "go slowly" to start bio-pellets, like a quarter to half the number of pellets to start and build up over a month or so. 

You are also running bio-pellets in a GFO/Carbon reactor. Did you "Mod" it for bio-pellets? 

Do a search on TLF 150 bio-pellet mods. 

Be patient. If you are not seeing tons of algae why worry about your numbers so much, give the pellets a chance or switch to GFO and wait a month there too. 

For me using GFO in a TLF 150 seems to keep my PO4 in check so I haven't tried BP.


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## Letigrama (Jul 6, 2008)

wtac said:


> Don't get too impatient. Keep in mind, PO4 will be leaching out from the LR and substrate as it is removed from the water column.
> 
> Whether you use GFO or BP, it's going to take time before you see the PO4 levels begin to fall. If the algae is under control and not getting worse, it is a step in the right direction. Is your skimmer showing an increase in skimmate production? Corals looking a bit "plumper/fuller", greater polyp extension? If so, then the sloughed off bacterial biofilm is being removed/consumed.
> 
> Looking at the pic of the amount of BP in the first post, you can add another 50% of BP into the reactor. The leakage of water due to the faulty O-ring will not hamper BP tumbling...just water directing as it flows upwards. At least it's in the sump .


Thank you, that is comforting 

To answer some of your suggestions: forgot to mention: I added 50% more pellets. All corals are doing perfectly well, kinda no changes.... the algae is not coming back on the glass, so I think I can say I notice a very little change. This is the most interesting think since you mentioned. I cleaned my skimmer cup yesterday morning. In a regular situation, the skimmer would have pumped all kinds of gunk into the cup. Right now, 36 hours after, the cup is empty and I even increased the flow in the skimmer and the foam goes in the neck, completely clean. does this mean is actually working, or is this bad?

yes, there is minor small leaking going from the canister to the sump because the o ring is broken.....one thing to mention is that the pump chamber where the reactor sits is super clean, and all the lr on the bottom is white bleached, so at least is working somewhere


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## Letigrama (Jul 6, 2008)

fesso clown said:


> Nothing good happens fast.... (sorry couldn't help myself)
> 
> I don't use bio-pellets but from what I know it could take at least a few weeks to a month to see concrete results in your PO4 and Nitrate numbers. IT is also very much recommended to "go slowly" to start bio-pellets, like a quarter to half the number of pellets to start and build up over a month or so.
> 
> ...


I am cool, as long as you guys think it will take more time. I thought this was an overnight thing.... i am happy as long as I know that will work eventually. I am worried because there is no new algae, but there is still some algae and I am dealing with Cyano in front of the tank, and I am pretty sure if because of the Phosphates.... I can also add a powerhead to hit that area, but I have some corals that needs a less flowy area so I figured reducing Phosphates was the way to go.

If you mean pellets mode to take the sponges and replace with the screens, I ordered the screens, they will be here soon


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## fesso clown (Nov 15, 2011)

Long from Mad Jelly Corals did a great Mod for a TLF reactor so the pellets tumble better.










here's the thread where he describes it:
http://www.thefragtank.ca/forum/index.php?topic=4784.0


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## wtac (Mar 17, 2006)

IME, adding more BP will slow down skimmate production until it gets colonized and the sloughing begins.

Hang in there


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

Remember that your rocks will act as a buffer/ sponge for your phosphates. I agree that you won't see a drop in the levels for at least s few weeks, but if you see visible results already, something is working out good for you!

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## noy (Nov 19, 2012)

With biopellets it may be 4-8 weeks before you notice a result. Biopellets work very differently than GFO. Biopellets or any type of carbon doing (vinegar, vodka, sugar) act to build up (anaerobic) bacteria that will break down nitrates and phosphates. The biopellets themselves don't react with phosphates but instead its food for the type of bacteria that will then consume phosphates and nitrates. That's why it may be beneficial to use a product like microbactor7 to kick start this bacteria population.

Go easy with the pellets - initially it doesn't matter how much you add - it just takes time for the bacteria concentration to build up. 

The downside is that this same carbon food source seems to also promote cyanobacteria. That's why I stopped.

You might want to double check your PO4 results - 2.5 is very high - you should be getting heavy growth on your glass daily. Are you sure its not .25?

GFO is very different and react directly with PO4 and binds it. If you levels have been at 2.5 for a while you will go though a lot of GFO to get your levels down. The nice thing with GFO is that you can measure and see that its working by taking a sample direct from the effluent (output) of your reactor.

Not sure how much livestock you have or whether you are running a refugium in this tank - but you should think about cutting back a bit on feeding to make sure the PO export is less than the import. Frozen foods are generally very high in PO4.


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## Letigrama (Jul 6, 2008)

fesso clown said:


> Long from Mad Jelly Corals did a great Mod for a TLF reactor so the pellets tumble better.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Very cool. I ordered the screens, if is not good enough, I will go buy a funnel


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## Letigrama (Jul 6, 2008)

Thank you all for the replies. We will give it a few more weeks.

Nope the reading is between 2 and 2.5 mg for sure. I have a sea hare that goes out to eat algea every night and keeps it undercontrol. 

Noy, say that my Phosphate levels get under control, but my cyano bacteria instead getting better gets worse, should I try GFO? is GFO associated with Cyano too?

Thank you for your input guys, I hope I dont have to put the reactor for sale soon... lol. I am hoping that one of these media will do the work for me. I have also thought of running carbon phosphate free in the tank, but I dont want to do it now.... do you think the carbon will help at all with Cyano?
I have read you can mix pellets and carbon in the reactor....


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## noy (Nov 19, 2012)

Letigrama said:


> Thank you all for the replies. We will give it a few more weeks.
> 
> Nope the reading is between 2 and 2.5 mg for sure. I have a sea hare that goes out to eat algea every night and keeps it undercontrol.
> 
> ...


Monitor the cyano situation - you can physically remove it for now (siphon it out). If its a small break out you can take care of it with a bit of red slime remover (only after things stabilize with your biopellets). Don't think carbon helps with cyano.

Mixing pellets with carbon is not a good idea. The tumbling will cause carbon fines in the water column. Carbon fines is a sure fire cause for HLLE for tangs.

GFO is not associated with cyano - it only binds PO4 it has contact with. However, GFO only reduces PO4 and does nothing with your nitrate levels.

You should look into what is causing your PO4 levels to go so high whether its feeding, dead livestock or bad rock and do something about that too.


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## Letigrama (Jul 6, 2008)

Thank you.

I only feed twice a day. Every other day frozen food. Nothing ever dies. I dont think Im overstock however my blue tang is huge and poos like crazy.not sure what else....well see what happens. I was in awe about the phoshates as all.my.other parameters are normal. I.will remove the cyano manually.


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## kamal (Apr 21, 2009)

Did you continue with the pellets or did you switch to gfo?


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## MPreston (Nov 11, 2013)

*Damn*

I wish I would have come across this post earlier. 
I could have given you whatever you needed of rowaphos and I think i have a spare screen kicking around for the 150.

Let me know if you need media- I have enough to last me atleast a year.


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## kamal (Apr 21, 2009)

How does the rowaphos compare to gfo?

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## MPreston (Nov 11, 2013)

I was using the ultra Phos from Fauna Marin- STUFF IS INTENSE!

My phosphates were running at 13 (not a typo) used ultra Phos in a 150, 3 weeks later phosphates were at 0.03. I switch to the Rowa to maintain and control. 

The Ultra Phos is a larger granule so it's perfect for a reactor. The Rowa is finer, I now use it in a bag. 

No complaints on either product just use the Ultra with caution. It is extremely powerful and will continue to strip the water if not monitored. 

Hope this helps. 
MP


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## Letigrama (Jul 6, 2008)

wow great info. I didnt get to GFO yet. The pellets are there. they helped but didnt get really better. the screens never made a difference to make the pellets really tumble. I came to the conclusion that the pump I got was not strong enough to tumble the pellets a lot. I will try GFO as I am not happy with the results I got.


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## kamal (Apr 21, 2009)

I ran pellets for two weeks and maybe they needed to run longer but I hated them. I only ran them as I was given a free bag of unused pellets. I have ordered gfo so I'm excited to get that going. They caused an algae bloom Eugh! !!

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