# help with my german blue ram



## race22 (Apr 6, 2007)

Have 2 of them and one of them seems to be breathing very heavily. the gills are pumping non stop and the mouth is opening and closing non stop. i have a 20 gallon freshwater tank with 0 ammonia 0 nitrites and low nitrates. any suggestions?


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## nightowl1350 (Mar 19, 2006)

What else is in with them ie live plants and other fish?

How long have you had the rams? Is it a newly set up tank or has it been cycled? Amything including a w/c done to the tank in the last few days?

Rams are a bit more delicate than many fish....make sure your temp is 84 if your other fish (if you have any) can take higer temps. I would add an airstone and see if that helps. 

Any other signs of illness? You could add a cap of hydrogen peroxide to the tank, it may help, but won't hurt at that strength. I had an apisto act funny after a w/c.....added the peroxide and the next day it was back to normal.


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

I have to jump on your back again, Nightowl.

You can't tell someone to put 'a cap' of hydrogen peroxide in their tank.

Caps range from 2.5 to over 20 mL in capacity.

Furthermore, he did not mention the volume of water in his aquarium.

Your suggestion could potentially be fatal in this case, and hydrogen peroxide is hardly the solution in this situation. Best case scenario if the proper dose was used it would briefly increase oxygen in the water, which would soon go back to what it was before and your problem is still there. better to increase aeration properly.

The fish is stressed. Possible causes are contaminants in the water, low oxygen levels in the water, stress from another fish harassing this fish, lack of proper places to live and hide, injury, shock (pH or hardness changed abruptly at a faster rate than the fish could adjust)


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## race22 (Apr 6, 2007)

hey guys,

the fish didn't make it. the other one is doing just fine. we'll see how things go. everything seems ok with the tank. as far as water is concerned, i'm using a biowheel penguin filter with carbon. i'm also using Purigen from seachem in there as well. i do 20% water changes every week and a half.


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## nightowl1350 (Mar 19, 2006)

Sorry pablo I normally add in brackets approx 3mls....but if you have a cap for a peroxide bottle that holds 20 mls you must use alot of peroxide.

And if YOU look he did say a 20g tank! I also did say to add an airstone.


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## wtac (Mar 17, 2006)

Assuming that body colouration is good, skin is clear...it's a growing trend that fish are developing fatty liver. Not enough HUFA and to high crude fat content. Very predominant w/African cichlids. Tough to say w/o looking inside.

W/fatty liver, the liver is degenrated to a point where it cannot remove toxins from the blood stream. It's well documented in humans and reptile (esp. monitor lizards) afflictions.

JM2C


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## Graham (Apr 10, 2007)

Actually fish that have Fatty Liver Degeneration have lousy colour and usually have been fed crappy foods high in poor quality protiens and in a lot of cases high in corn products of one type or another. Poor protiens result in an imbalance in amino acids...if the fish is missing one or two od the amino acids then they can't process the protiens and they get stored as an energy...fat.

A fish that is pumping go looking for lousy water and or parasites...dig the microscope out


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

wtac said:



> Assuming that body colouration is good, skin is clear...it's a growing trend that fish are developing fatty liver. Not enough HUFA and to high crude fat content. Very predominant w/African cichlids. Tough to say w/o looking inside.
> 
> W/fatty liver, the liver is degenrated to a point where it cannot remove toxins from the blood stream. It's well documented in humans and reptile (esp. monitor lizards) afflictions.
> 
> JM2C


any info so far on what foods predominantly cause this Wilson? I'm using Dainichi and NLS...


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## Graham (Apr 10, 2007)

Pablo said:


> any info so far on what foods predominantly cause this Wilson? I'm using Dainichi and NLS...


Feeding those foods it's not something that you would ever have to worry about......


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

Graham said:


> Feeding those foods it's not something that you would ever have to worry about......


 good to know

thanks


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## wtac (Mar 17, 2006)

Agree w/Graham...excellent ingredients and low crude fat %.


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

wtac said:


> Agree w/Graham...excellent ingredients and low crude fat %.


Well I guess I'll stop worrying about my fishs' diet then 

As per the fat purple guy in my basement who only ever eats bacon... that's another story... and quite ofen, as smells rise (sadly) another smell too...

Oh hey Wilson I dropped your saw off btw


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