# To all of the haters saying Ebay LEDS dont work.



## PureHash

Ill start by saying the fixture recomended for my tank size from RapidLED is about 325$

http://www.rapidled.com/standard-40g-breeder-tank-kit-non-dimmable/

Pfffttt... Said it before, and ill say it again... A diode is a diode is a diode.. Rated at different amperages, and voltages, with different colour plastic lenses makes different colour temps. (basically)...

So as long as I match the right colour temps, and intensity, a lighting fixture from RapidED vs a fixture I make from LEDs from ebay. they should be the same..

Well everyone here told me no no no.. You cant do that.... It wont work... Your tank wont be healthy... yadayadayada... Im a risk taker  and I know a diodes a diode.. So guess what? I bought some LEDs from ebay!! :O

I payed 35$ for a "driver" and a 30w* 20,000k LED. (its 30 1w 20,000k micro LEDS wired into 1 chip) I bought 2 broken T5 HO fixtures on an online local auction for 14$. I swapped out some ballasts and bulbs and got 1 fixture working for my 75g. I then cut the other fixture down to my tank size, and went to work mounting everything neatly in the case, with ventilation and wired it all to the built in timer on the fixture.

I ended with a fixture that IMO looks better then RapidLED's by a full 10x, has just as much functionallity and light output, for a fraction of the cost.


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## J_T

Do keep this post up to date please.

I have been in the hobby for a long time, and posts like these are common. They start out with lots of up dates, fts, and video's etc. Then posts become less common, fewer pictures, then a kijiji add.....

I don't disagree, an LED, is pretty much the same as any other, but its the quality, the R&D put into spacing, colors etc are hat make some cost more than others.

Keep us posted, good or bad. 

Sent from my {HTC X8} using Board Express


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## fbi

Awesome!

You have inspired me 

Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk 2


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## LTPGuy

I hope you don't mind my questions, as I am very interested in how your setup works, and how it was built.

How long have you had it running?

Are the current corals grown from your LED lights?

What are the two light source in your fixture aside from the LED chip?

Does the LED chips comes with a heatsink?

Can you post some photo of your hood setup/construction?

Thanks very much in advance.


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## PureHash

I will make a video update of the whole unit and how it works if you'd like, I just can't get around to that right this minute. The 2 lights aside from the LEDs are a couple of 10w coral life 50/50 CFLs. They are not sufficient to light the tank on their own, but add a nice dusk/dawn feature.

The coral has been under the 20,000k led since day 1. The blue LEDs and CFLSwere added about 6 weeks ago with no noticinle change in behaviour besides it looking freakin sweet lol.

The led had been running for about 5momths now 11hours a day with no noticible change in brightness or colour temp.

I will keep everyone up to date on the light.


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## Fishyfishyfishy

No need to argue or try to convince people, just enjoy the lights ourselves! 

With the number of those lights sold, and like 99.9% positive feedback, there is no need to research any further.


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## PureHash

What lights?


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## pyrrolin

I don't understand why LED need heatsinks, they are supposed to be low heat and low power I thought, so shouldn't get hot?


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## PureHash

They get pretty hot still, they run cooler than t5 but if you have a lot of them, or a 30 in 1 like I have, they generate some heat. If you run them with a heat sink, they last longer


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## LTPGuy

pyrrolin said:


> I don't understand why LED need heatsinks, they are supposed to be low heat and low power I thought, so shouldn't get hot?


The following exerpt is taken from Wiki



> High power light-emitting diodes (LEDs) use from 500 milliwatts to as much as 500 watts in a single package.[1] Most of the electricity in an LED becomes heat rather than light (about 70% heat and 30% light). If this heat is not removed, the LEDs run at high temperatures, which not only lowers their efficiency, but also makes the LED less reliable. Thus, thermal management of high power LEDs is a crucial area of research and development. It is highly necessary to keep the junction temperature below 120°C to run the LED's for maximum lifetime.


Here is the link to the article...


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## MDR

LTPGuy said:


> Here is the link to the article...


Wikipedia is far from reliable, the lack of citations in that article takes all credibility out the window. LEDs do need heat sinks because they will get warm and so need cooling in some instances to maintain optimal temperature. That article states 70% lost as heat....GC disagrees: http://oee.nrcan.gc.ca/equipment/lighting/248

You can get high performance LEDs that do get hot, but try getting the same equivalent in halides or conventional reef lighting and you'd burn your house down.

This link shows wattage equivalents between incandescents and CFL http://eartheasy.com/live_led_bulbs_comparison.html#c


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## PureHash

The fact of the matter. The hotter any electronics run, the more resistance they have. If you have high resistance it will burn out.. 

The cooler you run your LEDs the more efficient they will be, and they will live to their life expectancy. Run them without heat sinks and they will draw more power, in turn burning out your LEDs or overheating and burning out your "driver"


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## PureHash

Added a video to the OP to show some detail on the construction


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## LTPGuy

MDR said:


> Wikipedia is far from reliable, the lack of citations in that article takes all credibility out the window. LEDs do need heat sinks because they will get warm and so need cooling in some instances to maintain optimal temperature. That article states 70% lost as heat....GC disagrees: http://oee.nrcan.gc.ca/equipment/lighting/248
> 
> You can get high performance LEDs that do get hot, but try getting the same equivalent in halides or conventional reef lighting and you'd burn your house down.
> 
> This link shows wattage equivalents between incandescents and CFL http://eartheasy.com/live_led_bulbs_comparison.html#c


Sorry Purehash if we are getting a little of topic on your post, but I hope this discussion can help everyone, including myself in understanding LED better.

We'll likely move the topic to a different thread if the discussion gets more interesting!

Yes, I agree that wiki is not a "say all written in stone" source, but it's a quick place to get started. The information of how efficiently LED convert energy to light may be dated. I don't know.

For the question why we need a heatsink, it is, respectfully, irrelevant how LED efficiently convert energy to light.

A 3W LED will generate 3W of power, and likewise a 10W LED will generate 10W of power in the form of heat. 10W of power in the size of a 1cm^2 chip is an incredible amount of heat that needs to be dissipated and thus the requirement of a heat sink.

Try lighting up on of these chip and touch it after a minute or two.

Look at any high power LED in the market today, and you will see a big heatsink attached to it. In fact the bulk of the size is the heatsink itself.

This is why I asked Purehash about his LED chip, the heatsink, and I wonder about whether the fan was running or was there from the original T5 design.

If his chip runs cool and doesn't need a heatsink, this is definitely something I am interested in learning, and it show how quickly the technology has advanced.

Purehash, can you post some quick photo and description of your design. As I mention, I am very interested in how you put your light together!

Thanks again.


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## PureHash

I use a heat sink, just lightly trimmed to fit the cAse better. I added a detailed video to the op for you.


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## kapelan

PureHash said:


>


Do you have a cooler from the fixture?


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## LTPGuy

PureHash said:


> I use a heat sink, just lightly trimmed to fit the cAse better. I added a detailed video to the op for you.


Thanks a lot! I saw your post after I posted mine. You did a really nice job. Not a hack job at all! Thanks for sharing.

Hey MDR, your comment got me looking and I found this high efficient LED!! It's low power, but the future is nearly here!


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## PureHash

With my OCD I can't "hack-job" anything. Lol glad you appreciate it.

I can make a vid of the whole setup one day, the thank sump and all is 100% scratch built. With 15g total water volume, constant syphon and corner overflow.

The only thing not made would be my vertex in-80 protein slimmer, eheim heater, and the rock. I plan to make my own dry rock for my 75.


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## PureHash

kapelan said:


> Do you have a cooler from the fixture?


A cooler? I have a heat sink, and the heats ink is in contact with the aluminum case witch acts as a second heat sink. The fans inside circulate the air to keep everything relatively cool.

The more heat sinks you can cram in there, the better lol


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## CRJ

can you tweak or fade these led's at all? or is it just on off like a t5.


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## PureHash

You can fade any led with a potentiometer, I don't feel the need so I just have them on or off. If you had a self dimming driver they would come on slowly, and turn off slowly.


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## Ik0eS

*My 2 Pennies or Cents (2¢) in Electronics*



> .. A diode is a diode is a diode..


The rules of physics doesn't change...this applies also in electronics. Circuit and components may become smaller, might look different but the principles will be the same.

Did you know that a ballast for CFL bulb can be used in a ordinary T8 fluorescent bulb. You might not see it but it doesn't mean its not there. With the right know how and familiarity with circuitry it's possible. If I'm proficient just enough to look into a circuitry I would be able to know how the components will behave and its purpose. Imagine the possible uses of miniaturize LED driver currently in a LED Bulbs, especially in the future.

Electronics will be much more integrated, capable, smaller, efficient and faster (Moore's Law).

To know the basics in electronics and how will it evolve in the future, the principles will be the same and always goes back to its roots. It's just depends on the applications.

In other words if you know what you're doing you can save a lot of dough.


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## PureHash

Ik0eS said:


> In other words if you know what you're doing you can save a lot of dough.


Ain't that the truth. Lol


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## PureHash

Just so everyone knows, everything is still thriving. The light is doing amazing, and I'm not having any issues with any of the corals.


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## J_T

Pictures? My unicorn is doing well too.... 

I know I sound like an ass, but I have been in the hobby for too long. Success is based on long term usage. Not a few months.

So, lets see some photo's, and we can use this as a log of the lights.


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## kamal

Can we please see progress pictures  I am interested to see how this lighting is working out.


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