# Construction rant



## df001 (Nov 13, 2007)

Im sitting on my butt on the jobsite babysitting the plumber cuz the install is fubar due to previous renovation issues.

1, if you dont know wtf your doing, hire a pro

2, cutting corners will only cost more in the long run. Hope people enjoy the bad karma from the cover-up and stick someone else with the fix.

3, if it didnt fit the first time you hit it, chances are that it wont fit after you hit it 15 more times

4, use the right product for the job, see #1.

5, always budget more than you think by atleast 25% to account for surprises, that or be prepared to pay time + materials.

6, most important of all, just because your day has gone to hell, doesnt mean you need to yell, swear, and carry on. Atleast not where anyone can hear.

I'd really rather be planning my tank right now...


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

I feel your pain. I've had countless jobs get screwed up because some clown who came before me thought he was some handyman extraordinaire...

Jacka$$ of all trades, I like to call them. 

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## Zebrapl3co (Mar 29, 2006)

Oh, that's a tough topic. Sometimes it's not the owner's fault. Alot of the so called professionals don't know what they're doing. That's one of the big problem with the trade business. Anyone who picks up a hammer is a professional. It's hard to sort out the good ones and the bad ones. My house for example. The paint job was really good. But the insulation was so-so. The guys who did the duct are assholes. The plumbing was decent but could have put a bit of though into it. Cement work was poor. Electrical was OK, but they could have run it in one place instead of all over the basement ceiling (how the hell did they pass inspection?). Now I have to re-pull a few of them.
The guys who did the patio doors are assholes too. Drywall was good overall except the closets, not sure who was the asholes in this case, the guy who put up the stud or the guy who did the dryway. Won't know untill I put everything apart.
My bathtub - biggest assholes every. Overflow goes into the drain shit head. They shouldn't run down my first floor and drip into my basement.

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## df001 (Nov 13, 2007)

50seven said:


> I feel your pain. I've had countless jobs get screwed up because some clown who came before me thought he was some handyman extraordinaire...
> 
> Jacka$$ of all trades, I like to call them.


Nothing wrong with being a jack of all trades as long as you know your limitations, and when to call in an expert.


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

df001 said:


> Nothing wrong with being a jack of all trades as long as you know your limitations, and when to call in an expert.


I have nothing against Jacks of all trades, go for it if you're so inclined! Its the guys who think they know everything and won't follow proper instructions because they "know better".  I've found that the guys who are less confident usually do a better job.


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## sig (Dec 13, 2010)

50seven said:


> Its the guys who think they know everything and won't follow proper instructions because they "know better".


"proper instructions" from who?

just two examples:

1) last Sunday installed bathtub facet and as usually to make cartridge live longer installed shock absorbers and  I was told by the owner of the house that I just try to spend his money and he never seen anything like this on the web (he checked it before calling a plumber)

2) yesterday went to give the estimate for a new powder room on the main floor. The house did not have it before, it means no piping there.
The general contractor is new for me (somebody recommended me).
*The owner and contractor insisted that the job to be done properly by plumbing code*s, but have no clue the what the "properly" means.
I told them that there is problem with the vent (since there is no existing line to connect) and they have 4 choices.

a) do not install vent at all ( they do not like)
b) install fake went, which will release gases to the wall (they do not like it)
c) to open walls or build a frame in rooms in order to run went line to the attic and connect went there ( this is by PL codes, but they do not like it, since owner should pay more)
d) to make a hole in the wall of the house and run 3" line above the roof. ( this is by PL codes, but they do not like it, since owner should pay more and it is ugly)

*and finally they do not want it done properly* and wanted to install fake went which is illegal, despite sold in Home depot.

What should I do? I can go away and loose money or I will follow their wrong instructions, but later Mr. Holmes will say:" what a idiot installed this one."
Any way, they signed contract with the note that fake went was installed as per owner request.

I can not say about different areas of construction, but with plumbing within *finished* house even if you want do proper job (since it will cost no more that improper), you simple can not do it. the proper job could evolve so much damage that owners or contractors do not want to play with it.

I usually telling my general contractor how we can do it best and they try to arrange their work to accommodate proper plumbing.

I like to see "Holmes on homes" since the guy knows what he is doing, but the problem with this one that his solutions are not for general public due to the cost.

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## df001 (Nov 13, 2007)

sig said:


> I like to see "Holmes on homes" since the guy knows what he is doing, but the problem with this one that his solutions are not for general public due to the cost.


Fwiw, I would have walked... Poor quoting on the GC's part isnt your problem.

Holmes is infotainment, his message over all is good - educate yourself - so you are less likely to be screwed. That said too many people havent bothered, or worse yet now think they know it all.


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## sig (Dec 13, 2010)

df001 said:


> Fwiw, I would have walked... Poor quoting on the GC's part isnt your problem.
> .


The biggest problem with many GC's that they do not have clue about plumbing and electricity.
I never worked with the big guys, but my two small GC who I continue to work with always calling me before to give the estimate.

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## Holidays (Apr 18, 2010)

Everybody want more than what they can bargain for.


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## Chris S (Dec 19, 2007)

Who wants to do work on my house for free? C'mon now, who?


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

Free? No way. Now you put your employee discount on the table and we might be able to start talking, LOL

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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

df001 said:


> Holmes is infotainment, his message over all is good - educate yourself - so you are less likely to be screwed. That said too many people havent bothered, *or worse yet now think they know it all. *


+1

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## Chris S (Dec 19, 2007)

50seven said:


> Free? No way. Now you put your employee discount on the table and we might be able to start talking, LOL


10% off all expired products, deal?


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

Chris S said:


> 10% off all expired products, deal?


lolz, somebody needs to talk to this guy about how to negotiate...


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## df001 (Nov 13, 2007)

You know you are having(or are about to) a bad day when you go to the jobsite and the boss hands you 2 bags of durabond 90, for a standard 3pc bathroom :S


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

df001 said:


> You know you are having(or are about to) a bad day when you go to the jobsite and the boss hands you 2 bags of durabond 90, for a standard 3pc bathroom :S


 okeee... shows how much he knows... LOL

I know I will get a major ribbing from the guys if I bring them the wrong materials. Speaking of which, I better get back to work and finish grouting this floor and get some supplies for the guys at the other jobsite...

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## df001 (Nov 13, 2007)

He got one of those great stuff pro foam dispensers the other day, and when we were at depot getting some material, i suggested he should grab some ID-10-T cleaner for it, sure enough he goes and looks for it while im loading sheets on cart.... I guess the durabond today is just fair play lol..


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

Haha, yeah, I think you asked for it dude!  

BTW I love using Durabond 90 for my first coat to embed the tape. It's good and strong, but too hard to do the other coats. What was he thinking?

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## Riceburner (Mar 14, 2008)

I don't know about some "pros"....I can do as good or better job than some of them.


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## AquaNekoMobile (Feb 26, 2010)

50seven said:


> Free? No way. Now you put your employee discount on the table and we might be able to start talking, LOL
> 
> Sent from my HTC Magic using Tapatalk


Like a employee discount for the next 10yrs?  And one that can double stack on deep sales like on Boxing Day then we're talking.


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## AquaNekoMobile (Feb 26, 2010)

*'Jack of all trades' full saying*



50seven said:


> I have nothing against Jacks of all trades, go for it if you're so inclined! Its the guys who think they know everything and won't follow proper instructions because they "know better".  I've found that the guys who are less confident usually do a better job.


About that saying 'Jack of all trades, master of none' . I found out about 1.5-2yrs ago the full saying to that saying. The full saying to that saying according to Adam Savage (Mythbusters and I hope I'm getting the whole quote right from memory) is 'Jack of all trades, master of none but often better then a master of one'.

This quote was taken from The Last H.O.P.E which was an interesting talk by Adam as he was one of the key speakers there. He also spoke about Myths too controversial to be aired like IIRC the Visa/Mastercard IIRC 'RFID' thing which pretty much stopped at lawyers picking up phone and that pin drop silence on the other end. The audio mp3 can be found online at The Last H.O.P.E's website as well as IIRC I also found out it was filmed and uploaded to Youtube.

EDIT:

Found it. http://www.thelasthope.org/talks.html



> Featured Speaker - Adam Savage
> 
> Adam Savage
> 
> ...


and also listen to this as well. Very interesting and avoiding a crap load of line ups at the airports for hours on end and still be able to lock your bags up with your locks to reduce adding to the TSA's 'santa gift' fund.  There is some coverage for Canada in there. you don't have to own guns just to do this. Just losing stuff sucks enough.



> Packing and the Friendly Skies - Why Transporting Firearms May Be the Best Way to Safeguard Your Tech When You Fly
> 
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> 
> ...


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## df001 (Nov 13, 2007)

50seven said:


> Haha, yeah, I think you asked for it dude!
> 
> BTW I love using Durabond 90 for my first coat to embed the tape. It's good and strong, but too hard to do the other coats. What was he thinking?
> 
> Sent from my HTC Magic using Tapatalk


Plaster walls, lots of patching.
I'll nomally only use durabond on heavy fills, cgc 90 for tape and then xtra-lite for topcoat. Tho I'm by no means a "pro" taper. The only thing I hate more than taping, is painting, ironically im told im good at both.


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

df001 said:


> Plaster walls, lots of patching.
> I'll nomally only use durabond on heavy fills, cgc 90 for tape and then xtra-lite for topcoat. Tho I'm by no means a "pro" taper. The only thing I hate more than taping, is painting, ironically im told im good at both.


LOL, I have the same thing, except I'm okay with painting though it's not my favourite, but I hate taping. Fortunately I now get my minions to do the sanding and priming for me... 

Hope your job is turning out okay. We are working some overtime this weekend to get some office renovations finished up- the doctor is seeing patients this coming Thursday, so we have gotta be done by then; still have flooring, millwork, wall repairs and painting


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## sig (Dec 13, 2010)

50seven said:


> LOL, I have the same thing, except I'm okay with painting though it's not my favourite, but I hate taping. *Fortunately I now get my minions to do the sanding and priming for me...*
> :


I am doing it rarely for my self, but I have a wife for this job , since she can not stand final result (if I am did it)

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## df001 (Nov 13, 2007)

sig said:


> I am doing it rarely for my self, but I have a wife for this job , since she can not stand final result (if I am did it)


Lol other way around with me, I cant stand most other peoples version of a "good job".

How hard is it to cut in for petes sake, and if you are gonna tape off stuff atleast do it properly so it doesnt bleed under.

My rule for painting is everyone goes away and leaves me alone, it makes for much happier Dave, and a much better job.


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## sig (Dec 13, 2010)

df001 said:


> My rule for painting is everyone goes away and leaves me alone, it makes for much happier Dave, and a much better job.


My problem that wife is checking my job  and starting to show me ugly spaces. Final result - I trow everything on her and leaving 

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## J-P (Feb 27, 2011)

entertaining and interesting thread, thanks.

Any plumbing pro can comment on this thread (I didn't want to hijack).

http://www.gtaaquaria.com/forum/showthread.php?p=216408#post216408


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## df001 (Nov 13, 2007)

*Part two!*

Im only holding a 4x12 sheet of 5/8 fire rated up while you keep missing the stud that i marked out perfectly, its no big deal, its not like the sheet is heavy or anything, its not like were in a rush, please take your time.

Why is it that some people show their incompetence at the most inconvenient times?


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

df001 said:


> Im only holding a 4x12 sheet of 5/8 fire rated up while you keep missing the stud that i marked out perfectly, its no big deal, its not like the sheet is heavy or anything, its not like were in a rush, please take your time.
> 
> Why is it that some people show their incompetence at the most inconvenient times?


LOL I know what you mean... Rule: you can't be the guy doing the screwing until you've first had a few turns holding up the sheet.

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## df001 (Nov 13, 2007)

50seven said:


> LOL I know what you mean... Rule: you can't be the guy doing the screwing until you've first had a few turns holding up the sheet.
> 
> Sent from my HTC Magic using Tapatalk


Ordinarily I'd of been the guy with the screwgun, but apparently today I'm the only one strong enough to muscle a full sheet into position. Whats a 4x12x5/8 type x weigh anyway? about 110 lbs?


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## szuwar (Nov 26, 2009)

It all comes down how much you want to spend, most people try to get the best price that means cutting the cost and quality of the work goes with it , " you get what you pay for" these days everyone tries to save money wherever they can but you can't expect a contractor to do the work of so-called minimum-wage and expect top quality results. I myself I'm a contractor for 20 years and know exactly how this works, always try to make my customer aware of work where their money is going but also certain things cannot be done cheap. There is no way of doing plumbing or electrical cheap , either done right or is not. My Theory always was either doing right on don't even try doing it at all.


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