# Green water battle



## Darkblade48 (Jan 28, 2008)

Hi everyone,

I've been fighting green water for the last 3 weeks or so, and I've finally started to get annoyed looking at my green 2.5g nano.

Here's what it looked like before green water, fresh after a water change.



Here's what it looks like now (pea soup warning)



For those that pay attention to detail, yes, the drop checker is more blue in the second photo than the first. Once I added CO2, the GW really just took right off, so I ended up yanking out the tube to see if a lack of CO2 would make a difference (evidently not)  I'm still dosing Excel though, we'll see how that goes.

Anyways, of course, how could anyone help without knowing my tank's parameters:

Lighting: 2x 13W spiral Compact Fluorescent 6500K; on for 8 hours per day
Filter: Red Sea Nano
pH: 8.0 (after yanking out CO2), 6.6 with CO2 injection
NH3: 0 ppm
NO2: 0 ppm
NO3: Somewhere between 5 and 10 ppm, the colour of the water in the test tube doesn't look red/orange enough to be 10 ppm, but it's definitely more than 5 ppm
PO4: 0.5 ppm
kH: 2 dKH
gH: Busted, and too lazy to get one  However, Toronto water is usually about 6-7 dGH
Livestock: Nothing
Plants: Bacopa monneri, Eleocharis parvula (Dwarf hairgrass), Java moss, and some H. polysperma left floating, in an attempt to fight off green water (what a failure).

Edit: Forgot to mention that I dose Trace every other day, and Macros in between the days I dose trace elements. I leave one day for a 50% water change.

I'm currently looking for a way to try to beat the GW. I know a diatomaceous earth filter will do the trick, but I can't afford one of those. I know that a UV filter will also take care of it, but I can't afford one of those either, and, this is a 2.5g nano, I don't think a UV bulb would even fit into the tank  At the rate this is going, I'm tempted to just try a 3-4 day blackout to see if it'll solve my problem, but I'm afraid the GW will just come back unless I address the underlying issue.

If anyone has any suggestions, that would be great


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## Tabatha (Dec 29, 2007)

Anthony, what is the media in your filter, is it just a sponge? Curious.


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## Darkblade48 (Jan 28, 2008)

Just some filter floss; it turns green pretty fast because of all the algae it sucks up, so I just squeeze it out and put it right back in.


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## hotpandesal (Mar 27, 2008)

I had the same problem in my planted 10gal 3 months back.
Been dosing with Kent supplement a capful a day (~5ml)
There's no livestock except MTS which hv been there eversince it was setup

After reading some articles about "over-dosing," I tried it.
It was effective for me.

So my routine goes 4 capfuls after WC. Then WC 95-99% after 4 to 5 days. I don't even have to charge co2 and the plants are lush and seem to be happy. It has been running clear for 3 mos now (age now is 5 mos.) Btw, my lighting is 2 x ordinary spiral daylight at 25W each. So you can say around 5W/gal on for 10 hrs. Filter has just the wal-mart pillow fiber as media 'cuz I use it just for circulating the plant fertilizer. Plants are crypt wendtii, blyxa japonica, h.corymbosa siamensis, java moss, riccia, fissidens, saggitaria subulata, a. barteri nana, cardamine and 2 more which I forgot the names. pH = 7.0 (the only test I make)

So there's my setup; hopefully giving you ideas on the parameters to play around with. 

Don't you want to oversize your filter since you don't hv any livestock anyway?


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## Darkblade48 (Jan 28, 2008)

Thanks for the reply, hotpandesal.

I'm not sure what Kent supplement is; is this just a commercial trace mix? I don't understand how overdosing on a trace element mix could help clear up GW.

I'm surprised your plants are doing so well without CO2! IME, the Riccia I have doesn't grow in a tight mat (even when left floating) without CO2.

With regards to the filter, I have some spare filters suitable for a 10g lying around, I don't think they'd be suitable for the 2.5g solely because of their size (the intake filter would reach right down to the gravel )

Also, I've noticed that even with my Redsea Nano filter, the hair grass gets pushed around quite a bit if I leave the flow at maximum.


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## Tabatha (Dec 29, 2007)

*Phosphates*

Read this article about phosphates and algae: http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/phosphates.php

There are several other articles on this website on algae, worth a read!

Tabatha


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## dekstr (Oct 23, 2007)

I think the article in cichlid-forum only applies to fish-only tanks. In planted tanks, phosphate does not induce algae.

Tom Barr and others have done lots and lots to debunk the myth that phosphate leads to algae in a planted tank.

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/water-parameters/61625-potassium-deficiency.html#post557828

"You are mostly right, except that phosphates dont cause algae in a planted tank. Phosphates are an important part of plant growth/health. Phosphates=algae is true for a fish only tank, but plants need the entire N-P-K + trace elements (as well as co2) for optimal growth. This optimal growth/healthy plants is what keeps the algae at bay.

high light,co2,low nutrients may not necessarily lead to algae, but an imbalance of nutrients would. (meaning one or more nutrient levels do not meet plant uptake needs)

high light, co2, NON-Limiting nutrients=good plant growth/less(no) algae

Phosphate, a lot of times, helps drive the uptake of other nutrients like N.
When P bottoms out, plants are lacking, and thus the uptake of the other nutrients slows down also.
Plus, levels of P that are undetectable to us, are still sufficient to allow for algae growth but not for plant growth. Plants suffer while algae thrives.
All of this, of course, is assuming that co2 is not the limiting factor. Co2 needs to be in excess to the plants usage for the given amount of light. Poor or unstable co2 is a large cause of algae.

Algae usually is a result of ammonia/ammonia spikes, too much light/light duration, or POOR CO2. Co2 is the hardest one to maintain at adequate levels throughout the lighting period. Using a drop checker properly can help with this. After co2 is taken care of, take care of the nutrients(use EI dosing, for example) and the result is good plant health. Conditions need to be steadily maintained, as plants thrive in stable conditions and algae thrives in unstable/fluccuating conditions (ie: co2 fluccuates during the day, one or more nutrients bottom out or are not in sufficient quantity to meet plant's demand)

Higher light=faster uptake/higher demand of co2---->faster uptake/higher demand of NPK+traces
Lower light=slower co2 uptake/lower demand--->lower nutrient need/uptake

Hope some of this can be of help. I may not be the best at explaining all of this. If so, then sorry.

Good luck with the planted tank!

-Mike B-"
Link

Green water is usually a sign of high light + ammonia + low/unstable co2.

Here is a good read: http://www.barrreport.com/general-plant-topics/3498-green-water-3.html?highlight=green+water

UV filter would be nice too--instant solution. But it doesn't address the root cause and GW will come back once UV filter is removed for a while.


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## Darkblade48 (Jan 28, 2008)

dekstr said:


> Green water is usually a sign of high light + ammonia + low/unstable co2.
> 
> Here is a good read: http://www.barrreport.com/general-plant-topics/3498-green-water-3.html?highlight=green+water
> 
> UV filter would be nice too--instant solution. But it doesn't address the root cause and GW will come back once UV filter is removed for a while.


Thanks for the read Dekstr. I've read on plantedtank that indeed, GW is thought to be caused by ammonia, but my test kit reads 0 ppm. Of course, it's possible there are still trace amounts of it, and that the GW is just scavenging it up.

A UV would be nice, but how would I put it into a 2.5g nano?  Also, I am a poor university student, perhaps I should start up a UV fund? (joking!)  I do agree, however, that using a UV bulb is not addressing the underlying problem, and unless it is solved, the GW will keep coming back.


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## Chris S (Dec 19, 2007)

Green water is caused by ammonia for sure - and it only needs a spike to start and then it can last for months. Can be as simple as stirring up the substrate and GW is often common in newly setup tanks.

Two of the most successful treatments, through trial and error (I had GW on my 20g for like 2 months...) and reading are:

1. 3-4 Day COMPLETE blackout, use a black garbage bag. Do a 50% WC before and then a 50% WC after.

2. Willow Branches. Cut some branches so they stick out the top of the tank, let them grow like that for a couple of weeks and they will starve out the GW.

The good thing about GW is that the "underlying" problems are typically spikes in ammonia, so your water chemistry right now, even though you have GW, might be perfectly fine. It won't necessarily, unlike many other algae types, come back.

There are some other options as well, but try those two first and see how they work.

Good luck!


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## gucci17 (Oct 11, 2007)

I'm really interested in how you beat GW. Fortunately I haven't run into that issue yet. I hope I don't ever  but it would be good to know how you battle it out. I say go for the black out and see how it goes.


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## Darkblade48 (Jan 28, 2008)

Actually, it's kind of weird. I had CO2 feeding into the tank until Wednesday, and it was greener than it EVER had been. I ended up yanking out the CO2 for 3 days, and did several large (> 50%) water changes (easy enough on a 2.5g).

Today's Sunday, and the water is unusually clear....let's hope it stays that way.


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