# Yellow shrimp slowly dying off



## alstare2000 (Feb 16, 2013)

So I think I may need some more experianced advice with this one. I have a 10gal tank that has been running for over year and a half that I had some fish in. Fish got moved to bigger tank and about 2 months ago I got over 20 yellow shrimps. Tank has air stone runing 12hrs/day and internal filter intake covered, and gravel on the bottom, heater keeping temp. 24-25C.

Initially the population seemed to stay the same and I fed them hikari shrimp cuisine little bit every day and every few days they got small chunks of algae waffer. I have a lot of java moss and some crypts there; also put in almond leaf there which they seemed to enjoy. 

When I noticed the number of them decreasing I tested the water amonia, nitrite 0 but nitrates were 20ppm with about 10% weekly water changes. I increased water changes to about 20% weekly and tested after a week showing 20ppm nitrates again. I decreased feeding to every couple days and removed almond leaf just in case which seemed to have slight improvement on nitrates but not much effect on dropping shrimp numbers.
Now I have about 12 full grown adults and see about 10-12 shrimpletts 2 different sizes 5mm and mayby 8mm but few weeks ago it seemed there was more of the small ones. Also now and them I catch them munching on left overs of their own kind. So whichever dies they must eat it right away. 
With water changes I used tap water with prime and matched the temperature of the tank. Today I will start using day old tap water with prime just to make sure fresh water wasn't an issue.

Anything else Im doing wrong or may try? I dont vacuume the gravel with water changes as there are always some shrimpletts hiding there, when I did it still had no offect on nitrates.


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## woopderson (Feb 12, 2014)

Hi Alstare, sad to hear you're losing shrimps 

I would recommend putting the almond leaf in, as it can have health benefits for the shrimp. I also recommend running the air stone 24/7.

Few questions for you:

What is your PH? 
Are you dosing CO2?
What substrate?
What is your KH/GH?
TDS?


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## alstare2000 (Feb 16, 2013)

woopderson said:


> Hi Alstare, sad to hear you're losing shrimps
> 
> I would recommend putting the almond leaf in, as it can have health benefits for the shrimp. I also recommend running the air stone 24/7.
> 
> ...


Just tedted 
PH 7.6 that is top on colour card on regular test. 
I used the high range PH kit and its hard to match colour but looks like 7.8 or even 8.0 so not sure which PH is correct and if even I should have bothered with high range PH test.
No Co2 plants seem ok with just LED lights
Substrate: regular black aquarium gravel
Always confused when testing KH and GH but KH was 6 drops as per chart its 6dKH and 107.4 ppm GH/KH.
GH tube was 9 drops so 161.1 ppm GH/KH.
Don't have TDS test.

Will add almond leaf back and have the stone running 24/7 Thank You


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## woopderson (Feb 12, 2014)

Glad to help!

That PH/KH/GH should be ok. You can usually find a tds meter for $5-10 on ebay if you were interested in having one for piece of mind. Having the air stone on 24/7 will make a big difference, as the shrimp like highly oxygenated water. The nitrate levels I don't think will make a huge difference, as my blue bolts have been in 40ppm and been ok.

Do you drip your water changes in? Drastic changes in water parameters can also cause problems.



alstare2000 said:


> Just tedted
> PH 7.6 that is top on colour card on regular test.
> I used the high range PH kit and its hard to match colour but looks like 7.8 or even 8.0 so not sure which PH is correct and if even I should have bothered with high range PH test.
> No Co2 plants seem ok with just LED lights
> ...


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## darkangel66n (May 15, 2013)

Since you are not testing I am thinking your TDS is pretty high. You need to have a TDS pen in my opinion. It is the most used item I have when dealing with my shrimp.


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## alstare2000 (Feb 16, 2013)

Ordered TDS pen online and will post what I'm getting soon.


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## Mykuhl (Apr 8, 2013)

One question.... When you do you aerate the water before you put it in? If there is any micro air bubbles in the water(there usually is in tap water) it will hurt the shrimp and could kill them. I don't recommend doing anything larger than a 10% water change with unaerated water. If you aerate the water well, you can do a 60% water change and shrimp will be fine(at least Neos will). I change this much water about once a week with my Neos with no issues.


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## alstare2000 (Feb 16, 2013)

Mykuhl said:


> One question.... When you do you aerate the water before you put it in? If there is any micro air bubbles in the water(there usually is in tap water) it will hurt the shrimp and could kill them. I don't recommend doing anything larger than a 10% water change with unaerated water. If you aerate the water well, you can do a 60% water change and shrimp will be fine(at least Neos will). I change this much water about once a week with my Neos with no issues.


Yes I believe there are bubbles; as I just run the tap for a min match the temp put prime in add tap water and then new water to the tank roughly it was 2.5 gal once a week since I posted here I decreased it to about 1.5 gal and using day old water that just sits in a bucket for about 24 hrs (still add prime initially).
From what it seems the higher nitrates possibly do less harm then the way I'm doing WC and the amount. Still kind of weird that with just few shrimps I can't keep them below 20ppm.
Also almond leaf is back in. Still waiting for TDS pen but didn't seem any deaths lately so keeping the fingers crossed it was my careless water changes since that's how I do it with my 46Gal tank but only 10%.


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## Mykuhl (Apr 8, 2013)

Shrimp are really sensitive to gas bubbles. I personally don't do anything more than a top off(replacing evaporated water) with straight out of the tap water. I don't know if this is the reason for sure but it could be. Years ago I used to do large water changes with water straight out of the tap and got several deaths each time, that is when I started using only aerated water. 

You don't need to let the water sit for 24 hours if you agitate the water with an air stone or pump for a couple of hours or so. The stronger the agitation the less time you need to aerate it.


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## alstare2000 (Feb 16, 2013)

Spoke too soon found another one dead this evening fairly large female. 
Last WC was 2 days ago. I will try putting air stone before I do WC and they are much smaller now then before; but I think nitrate would be increasing steady if I wouldnt do at least 10% /week.


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## hollowpoint (Aug 26, 2014)

alstare2000 said:


> Fish got moved to bigger tank and about 2 months ago I got over 20 yellow shrimps....
> 
> Initially the population seemed to stay the same and I fed them hikari shrimp cuisine little bit every day and every few days they got small chunks of algae waffer.


How many fish did you have? And how long after you moved them out did you get the shrimp? The reason I ask is because maybe the beneficial bacteria died off before you put the shrimp in.

My first batch of shrimp died off over a 3 month period because of ammonia poisoning.


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## alstare2000 (Feb 16, 2013)

There wasn't much break maybe few days and there was still few oto cats in the tank when I got the shrimps. Ammonia shouldn't be an issue as I was checking it periodically and it's always 0.


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## darkangel66n (May 15, 2013)

Shrimp do not like a lot of water changes. Nitrates are not a big issue and they can take very high numbers. Drip your water in for your water changes. The more you do to the water the more will die IMO. What is your filter?


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## alstare2000 (Feb 16, 2013)

It's a small internal filter maybe I should replace it more often I just clean the carbon bag/floss and the foam pad in tank water, but replace the carbon bag/floss every 2-3 months as the most bacteria probably sit on that. 

I have a feeling it's water, can't wait to test the TDS.
Should I do WC maybe every other week 10% or just still keep 10% but drip the water in (which will be some headache)
I think I should build a new tank like a 30Gal for the 20 shrimps so the water is good for a while.


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## darkangel66n (May 15, 2013)

Stop using carbon and use sponge only. Carbon and shrmp do not seem to mix. Not sure why but they do not do well with carbon.


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## woopderson (Feb 12, 2014)

Seconding on the carbon, do not use!


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## alstare2000 (Feb 16, 2013)

Will remove it right away when i get home. Its one of these kit internal filters.

(http://www.tetra-fish.com/Products/.../whisper-internal-aquarium-power-filters.aspx)

That has a baggy that acts as filter but there is carbon inside which can be removed. I'll just put in empty new baggy inside.


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## woopderson (Feb 12, 2014)

If you can, add some bio media in there to fill the baggy. That way the bacteria can start building there as well.


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## alstare2000 (Feb 16, 2013)

Will find something to put in that bag, also do you guys think the water should be replaced or just leave the things as they are. And stick to my weekly or biweekly water changes ?


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## woopderson (Feb 12, 2014)

Monitor your parameters, and change as needed. You should only have to do light changes (10%)


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## Mykuhl (Apr 8, 2013)

When you say yellow shrimps...are these neocaridina? If they are, they should not be so sensitive that you need to do such little and infrequent water changes. I change from 40 to 60% of the water at a time with mine and they do fine. I change the water once every week to week and a half and aerate the water well. They are even multiplying with this regimen.


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## alstare2000 (Feb 16, 2013)

Yes they are neocaridina, and thats why I got them since they are pretty hardy. May be it was the carbon in the filter, as to water changes I'll do them differently will aerate and use aged water just in case. Will see what happens there is still some shripletts and some small ones and about 10 adults. If all will be good hopefuly the colony will grow as they are fun to watch.


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## Fishfur (Mar 4, 2012)

Just out of curiosity, if you stir up your gravel, do you see any bubbles coming up from it ? If you do, you may have anaerobic bacterial decomposition going on under the gravel and the bubbles of 'swamp gas' these bacteria generate, [ hydrogen sulphide, among others], are fatal to shrimp, some snails and small fish, especially bottom feeders. If they are anywhere nearby when a bubble comes up, it can kill very quickly. If you are not vacuuming the gravel regularly, this is a possibility that should be checked.

If there are no bubbles when you disturb the gravel, that's great and there's no swamp gas.

When you take out the filter carbon, do use the resulting space for some type of media. If it were me, I'd use some floss. Then instead of tossing out the old filter bag every so often, just replace a portion of the floss when it gets really dirty and shredded looking. Meantime, clean all the media regularly Floss will still work just fine even when very discoloured and it holds quite a lot of BB. So I don't replace mine 'til it starts falling to shreds, and then only a part of it at a time, to minimize loss of BB.

Sponge can last years, depending what type of sponge it is, so just rinse it well, squeeze it out or bang it on the bucket sides to clean it. If possible, cut a piece of reticulated filter sponge to fit and use that rather than what came with the filter. It's easier to clean and lasts longest. Big Al's sells this kind of sponge, [ usually it's blue or maybe green] or you can use a replacement Aqua Clear sponge if you like. Other sponge types also work, it is simply that the reticulated sponge works so very well and lasts a really, really long time.

I have replaced the original media in every filter I have, no matter what type it is, no matter how small the media chamber may be or what shape it is. I'm always happier with my own media than I am with the cartridges or replacements that come with so many of these devices. Sometimes it means cutting up or cutting out some part of the frame of the original cartridge in some way, to get access to remove the carbon and then replace it with something else, but the results have been well worth the bit of work involved.


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## alstare2000 (Feb 16, 2013)

Want to thank everyone for all the input and all the things for me to try.

As to gravel no bubbles just mud/dirt when disturbed.
With filter I went the same day and bought bio media balls for similar filters and put it in that baggy that is acting as a floss in my filter, and planning to be using that bag for long time just to clean it now once in a while the sponge itself is holding up great in the filter plus the one that I put on intake I clean on occasion as well since the shrimps love sitting on it and I'm not loosing any baby shrimp in the filter.


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## Fishfur (Mar 4, 2012)

Good to hear there's no swamp gas.


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## woopderson (Feb 12, 2014)

Glad we could help! Hope everything works out


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## alstare2000 (Feb 16, 2013)

Quick update. I got TDS meter and water is showing 180s.
I did all that was suggested and I didnt see any adults dieing past weeks.

I stopped feeding too often as well (only twice a week now) small water change once a week with aged water and carbon gone from filter. So one of the things helped or maybe it was a combination. Now hopefully numbers will slowly increase.

Cheers


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## woopderson (Feb 12, 2014)

Glad to hear things are stabilising. I am willing to bet it was a combination of factors that contributed. But now it sounds like you have it under control. May you have many shrimpy babies in the near future!


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