# Heeellllp....



## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

I've had this betta for a long long while... Maybe about half a year?

He's never been well. I picked him up because he was at my old work and in nasty shape. 
His scales look like hell and his tail is in tatters...

He lays on the floor of the tank and will only move when i come by to say hi.
He eats well dispite some bad aim...

I am not great with diseases so i dont even know where to start.

I tried maracyn II for a week with no take. 
Not sure where to go now because i dont want to make things worse...

Thanks for any help you guys can offer!


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## Brian (Mar 14, 2006)

That looks pretty nasty.

I don't have much experience with treating bettas, once any of mine got sick... they were culled.

If you want, you could maybe try some potassium permanganate or a salt bath.


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## Thistle (Jun 4, 2006)

Awww, the poor lil guy. *sniffle*

Have you tried Seachem's Kanaplex? (only place I've ever been able to find it is BA's)

I'd heard rave reviews about it so I thought I'd try it out. One of my babies had fin rot and in less then 3 days worth of treatment it was all gone, unlike other medications which seem to take soooo much longer.

The other thing I like about it is that it's in powder form so I think it's easier to determine dosage. Plus no more struggling to pull a capsule apart without having the contents fly all over.


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

First piece of advice: Show picture to Wilson, preferably show wilson in person (this may involve a Wilsonification fee)

Second alternative: Put fish in jar, go show Harold or Sedrick @ Menagerie.

Maracyn ain't gonna cure that... that looks like a very bad systemic infection.


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## wtac (Mar 17, 2006)

I replied but for some reason, the reply didn't pop-up. I was going to re-reply but I've got a pretty heavy work load this week.

It could be columnaris in the early stages due to the saddle shape of the affected area. When it becomes advanced the area becomes white. It's not an easy disease to treat as _most_ cases I have encountered haven't responded to various antibiotic cocktails plus QC very well if at all. Cupramine would be the treatment to follow.

HTH


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## ontariobetta (Mar 13, 2006)

I had a couple bettas look like that! Its very weird. Unfortunatly they ended up dying, I tried all kinds of meds but nothing really worked.


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

wtac said:


> I replied but for some reason, the reply didn't pop-up. I was going to re-reply but I've got a pretty heavy work load this week.
> 
> It could be columnaris in the early stages due to the saddle shape of the affected area. When it becomes advanced the area becomes white. It's not an easy disease to treat as _most_ cases I have encountered haven't responded to various antibiotic cocktails plus QC very well if at all. Cupramine would be the treatment to follow.
> 
> HTH


You really think copper would whack that? I'd be tempted to throw balls to the wall and use CLOUT on that...

CLOUT can kill anything... even people... good stuff...


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## wtac (Mar 17, 2006)

CLOUT is basically an organophosphate that kills "higher form" inverts such as lice, mites, ticks, flagellates, etc, by messing up a portion of the electron transport chain (analog of a cholinesterase inhibitor). Columnaris is a Flexibacterium where CLOUT won't do too much to it.

Stuff from the ol' mellon .


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

wtac said:


> CLOUT is basically an CLOUT won't do too much to it.
> 
> Stuff from the ol' mellon .


This is the portion of your post I was able to understand 
But I gotcha, my bad. It doesn't work 
I thought clout was like the nuclear bomb of all fish medications ...


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

Used it... didnt work. Worked on another fish thou..


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

Ohh man Ontario.. I keep expecting to find him gone but he's been kicking along like this for a long long while. I try to keep him well fed... i forgot to mention i gave him a round of paracite meds, internal and external.

I am pretty sure i gave him a salt dip.. which i -hate- doing. Seemed to help a tiny bit..

I'll let you know what happens guys. Ty so much for the feed back


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

Ciddian said:


> Ohh man Ontario.. I keep expecting to find him gone but he's been kicking along like this for a long long while. I try to keep him well fed... i forgot to mention i gave him a round of paracite meds, internal and external.
> 
> I am pretty sure i gave him a salt dip.. which i -hate- doing. Seemed to help a tiny bit..
> 
> I'll let you know what happens guys. Ty so much for the feed back


I dont think salt dipping will work for this.

Do you have copper? If wilson says copper use copper. Cupramine isn't expensive.
BTW Wilson- didnt you say Cupramine wasnt a good form of copper since it goes into solution and becomes indetectable and to use aquarisol?


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## wtac (Mar 17, 2006)

I don't think so. Aquarisol is made of copper salts but doesn't say what form. Coppersafe is just copper sulphate and is easily bound by organics and precipitated out of solution in the form of copper oxide, cupper sulphide, etc. Cupramine stays in solution much longer as the copper ion is "chelated" so that copper ions stays in solution for a longer period of time.

Hope that clears it up .


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

wtac said:


> I don't think so. Aquarisol is made of copper salts but doesn't say what form. Coppersafe is just copper sulphate and is easily bound by organics and precipitated out of solution in the form of copper oxide, cupper sulphide, etc. Cupramine stays in solution much longer as the copper ion is "chelated" so that copper ions stays in solution for a longer period of time.
> 
> Hope that clears it up .


Kinda... I think I get it. Thanks


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

Hmm wilson.. I have been reading about the Cupramine and it says to be careful if you have used coppersafe before? Because of the lingering copper i assume?

What stores carry the stuff? I would really like to try it own. Its by seachem correct?

Thanks so much guys...


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## wtac (Mar 17, 2006)

The caution is there b/c the chelating agent can free copper that has been bound by organics. I highly recommend using a copper test kit to reach and maintain a therapeutic level of copper. Though in FW applications one can get away not using one, Aquarium Pharm has a decent copper test kit.

Menagerie should carry them.


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

wtac said:


> Menagerie should carry them.


100% yup. Seen it there for many years now.


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

Okie ty guys


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## DaFishMan (Dec 19, 2006)

Hi Cid,

Hope your fish is improving ? Sorry was out of town and missed your post.
This looks like a bacterial infection, whether it's columnaris or not, Tetracycline would be worth a shot. It's a stronger antibiotic then the Maracyn II. You could also use Pimafix in combo with the med. Copper or salt will not treat this. 

Tetracycline can be pretty harsh, half dose the amount since your fish is weak, but double the treatment period. Hope I'm not too late and that this is any help. Good luck and keep us posted.


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

unfortuntaly he didnt make it 

But thank you for you help


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