# Adding aragonite



## Al-Losaurus (Jul 21, 2009)

Hi 

i have an existing tank with natural gravel and i am contemplating changing over to aragonite sand mixed with a little bit of crushed coral so i dont have to keep buying buffers to keep a good ph for my tang cichlids.

My questions are should the fish be removed from the tank for a period of time when its added? Should i add it little bits at a time? Or does it take time for the aragonite to gradually work into the system to up the ph levels? Also if i do move them to another tank will it be a shock to there system going to a better environment? My ph levels keep dropping from 7.5+ down to like 6.8 i have a few calvus in there and know they are extremely sensitive to change and i dont want to kill them trying to make there life better lol...

Last question when i am doing water changes i know water conditioner is mandatory but will i still need to add any ph buffers or will the aragonite take care of that?

Thank you for reading and any help you may bring to the table


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## Al-Losaurus (Jul 21, 2009)

Ok well after some more research and trying to find better prices then BA's i found this CaribSea:Eco-Complete African Cichlid Sand... it seems like the better thing to go with. Also has the black with white grain affect i wanted to go for. Only 2 problems 1 being all the questions above still apply lol and 2nd does anyone know good places to get this stuff other then online or BA's? i dont even think they cary it... For some reason every online store i order from as soon as i click check-out it stays on that page loading for hours and never finishes rofl


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## KnaveTO (May 13, 2007)

I know menagerie sells Eco-complete as I got mine from them. Ask Harold, he may be able to order it for you.


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## Al-Losaurus (Jul 21, 2009)

Thank you for the reply knave i called that place got put through to the fish department sat there all zoned out and realized i was on hold for 15 mins without speaking to anyone rofl i decided to try the mops site again and it worked in seconds was only $15 for delivery aswell i figured why not id probly pay more if it was from a lfs anyway.

Sorry to ask again but could use a little help in this part of the procedure please. Same question just *African cichlid sand* instead of *Aragonite*


Al-Losaurus said:


> i have an existing tank with natural gravel and i am contemplating changing over to aragonite sand mixed with a little bit of crushed coral so i dont have to keep buying buffers to keep a good ph for my tang cichlids.
> 
> My questions are should the fish be removed from the tank for a period of time when its added? Should i add it little bits at a time? Or does it take time for the aragonite to gradually work into the system to up the ph levels? Also if i do move them to another tank will it be a shock to there system going to a better environment? My ph levels keep dropping from 7.5+ down to like 6.8 i have a few calvus in there and know they are extremely sensitive to change and i dont want to kill them trying to make there life better lol...
> 
> ...


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## overleaf (Feb 1, 2009)

Al-Losaurus said:


> My questions are should the fish be removed from the tank for a period of time when its added? Should i add it little bits at a time? Or does it take time for the aragonite to gradually work into the system to up the ph levels? Also if i do move them to another tank will it be a shock to there system going to a better environment? My ph levels keep dropping from 7.5+ down to like 6.8 i have a few calvus in there and know they are extremely sensitive to change and i dont want to kill them trying to make there life better lol...


Some of the things I've learned in keeping tanganyikans is that they don't really care what their pH is as long as it's alkaline and hard. GTA tap water is usually around 7.4-7.8 pH but the hardness can use a little work.

In order to beef up hardness you can use two things:

- Epsom salt
- Sodium Bicarbonate (Baking soda)

Epsom salts will increase the general hardness and the baking soda will work on the carbonate hardness. Before using these I would perform a water change and the pH would be stable for about 3-4 days and then it would plummet. Once the hardness is used up it doesn't take long for the pH to be affected. Adding the buffers helped immensely.

The aragonite substrate didn't help very much at all. In my post here:

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=191004&highlight=

It seems like you're looking for a 1% increase in pH per 20lbs of aragonite. That post doesn't go over hardness but it will increase the carbonate hardness a bit too.

I've recently stopped using baking soda. Even though the baking soda was 100% dissolved by the time it was added to the tank I started to get white sediment on the bottom of my substrate free tanks. I could only think of baking soda when I cleaned it up as it would start to dissolve again. It may not have been, but after I stopped using baking soda the sediment is gone. I now use epsom salt (to increase the dH, general hardness), and canning salt (general preventative).

With just 2 tablespoons of the epsom salt in a 55G drum it increases the hardness to a point where the pH is stable for about 2 weeks (starting tap pH for me in Mississauga is 7.6). After two weeks you should have changed the water anyway! 

Anyway... to summarize:

- Don't waste your money on pH UP! or any other 'cichlid salts/buffers'. Use Epsom salt and Baking soda, they're usually the primary ingredients in most buffers anyway and your fish don't care about 'trace' elements.
- Stable pH is better than fluctuating pH.
- Local tap water pH is fine for tanganyikans.
- The benefits of aragonite are overrated and the stuff is damn expensive.

Hopefully this helps you a bit.

I don't know anything about 'african cichlid sand'. I assume it's carbonite based and they count on it dissolving to 'buffer'. In any event... it's buffering is likely marginal.


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## Al-Losaurus (Jul 21, 2009)

Thank you very useful info i will keep in mind. The stuff still has not arrived and i havnt found any info on weather i should remove the fish from the tank before adding it or not so im contemplating either adding a few cups at a time or to go buy another small tank and take them out for a few days.

Really i dont see it causing much harm other then the so called "live water-purifying bacteria" but then again like i said i have calvus in there and if you even look at them wrong they might die rofl

Thank you tho overleaf if you want to see or compare the differences to Aragonite here is what they "Claim" it does CaribSea:
Eco-Complete African Cichlid Sand


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## overleaf (Feb 1, 2009)

Al-Losaurus said:


> Thank you very useful info i will keep in mind. The stuff still has not arrived and i havnt found any info on weather i should remove the fish from the tank before adding it or not so im contemplating either adding a few cups at a time or to go buy another small tank and take them out for a few days.


Based of the link you don't have to remove the fish. The sand is ready to use when you open the bag.

As for adding aragonite... If you were to add aragonite from the bag your tank would get extremely cloudy. The handling of the bag during shipping/stocking/etc causes some of it to become powder. Despite gunking up your filters and the tank being opaque this shouldn't hard the fish.

I 'wash' aragonite like I wash sand. Even still it's not perfect but at least you can see in the tank


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## Al-Losaurus (Jul 21, 2009)

Thank you for replying again. That is good to hear i am still just going to add bits at a time through out a day or 2 rather then one big dump. i was basically going to go with Aragonite get a black kind and mix it with a little crushed coral for the black/white look but that sand was just the perfect look. also to top up ph a bit but guess il see how that works out. it should be here any day so il post if it makes my water go cloudy or not i read a few reviews and it was 50/50 people saying it did but only lasted 48 hrs or so.


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## Al-Losaurus (Jul 21, 2009)

Ok so i added the eco sand and i must say i am impressed other then a little clouding wich is going down by the hour but i am sure is natural cause it is sand. All fish survived i put it in 2 cups at a time till all was in. As the water cleared the color of the black calvus darkened dramatically. Hours later i checked the ph level and it was 8.1 i had no idea it would work so fast. So my questions were answered the fish will survive adding it with them in there im going to wait a few days and do another water change to clear a little dust out of the sand and possibly add 1 small bag of regular black sand to darken it up just a little it was not quite as dark as advertised but still looks very great. 

One last thing on the plus side all the fish seem to be noticing the left over sinking pellets on the top of the sand and eating them rather then it slipping through the same colored gravel and rotting away in the water. So far was well worth the change.


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