# Fish sickness, need help.



## Squeege84 (Feb 13, 2011)

Hey peeps,

So I've been trying to find a reef safe way of treating my powder brown tang and emperor angel of marine ich. I can't take them out of the tank because its a pain to remove the rocks. I've currently got snails, hermit crabs, cleaner shrimp, frogspawn, hammer coral, elegance coral, and Alveopora Coral. Please give me some advice on what meds. u've used or methods that worked. my blue tang and clowns are fine just those 2 are a lil sick.

Thanks


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## sig (Dec 13, 2010)

sorry to say, but what I red before there is no safe way to medicate in SW display tank

copper will kill corals and Hyposalinity will call all, but fishes. Let's you fish in main display to die or survive and after 8 + weeks you can add fishes ( just my opinion)

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## Squeege84 (Feb 13, 2011)

Thanks Greg, was expecting that answer lol I think i'll spend the time trying to catch the fish without stressing them out.


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

Yeah, you're kinda screwed that way. Which is why a quarantine tank is so important in SW. 

I cured ich in my tank by maintaining perfect water conditions and getting an extra cleaner shrimp. Results vary on approaches like this, but it worked for me. That was almost a year ago and not a single case since then. 

Good luck anyway...

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## Squeege84 (Feb 13, 2011)

thanks kevin,

Yea I have a QT setup but its just a pain to catch the fish with all the live rocks and hiding spots.


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## laurahmm (Apr 1, 2010)

Hi there, 

I'm not sure if this is applicable or not but when my freshwater fishes got ich, I just increased the temperature of my tank up to 90 degrees and the ich went away. I couldnt treat my tank either because I had snails and shrimps in my tank. I kept the tank with that temperature for 2 weeks. Goodluck. I'm not sure if your fishes can handle temperatures that high though. Would double check that first. 

Laura


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## Squeege84 (Feb 13, 2011)

I think I read somewhere, raising the temp. in marine tanks don't really help with ich, I'm not to sure tho, never tried it. If someone here has tried that method and has worked for them plz let me know, I'll try it. As for now I'm just soaking their food in garlic in hopes it helps a little. Thanks for the advice tho Laura

- Lu


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## itsmesiva (Apr 3, 2011)

Safer and sure way is to get the fish out ( i know hard it is as i have experneced it) into a QT and do the hypo salinity treatment. Better if you use a refracto meter to measure your salinity. it sure worked for me. I did try one of those reef safe ,Ich fix i believe, prior to Hypo treatment... it never worked for me. Thank god it didnt kill any of my snails shrip or my few corals. Dont waste time spend the time to catch the fish be4 things get worse!
Good luck...


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

Raising the temperature will not work. Don't waste your time. 

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## wtac (Mar 17, 2006)

There is no definitive method to get rid of ich on fish in established reef systems. My recommendation is getting ALOT of cleaner shrimps...at least 6, depending on the size of your display. Unfortunately, it will take some time before the cleaner shrimps "settle in" and establish cleaning stations for fish to come to them.

One has to go to the root cause, which is usually stress. As a prime example, I have a new client w/a 210gal reef who's glod rim/powder brown tang is constantly getting bouts of ich. After the last bout, it has ich again. I have discovered that their school of 2.5" green chromis are spawning, seeing egg masses on the LR and corner of the aquarium with the males defending a 12" radius. Where the tang likes to "hang out", it crosses paths of many of these territorial areas.

As Laura mentioned, adding garlic will help in keeping the immune system up. If it's just spots and the skin is surrounding the areas are clear, that is a good sign. One the skin gets cloudy/hazy, that's the onset of secondary bacterial infection and will be a cause for concern.

For now, look for territorial aggression with other fish. If they are both fussing over a common area, there's your point source of "stress" and they have to sort it out for themselves or make that tough decision of which has to go. Adding more cleaner shrimp will help in future, but not in the immediate moment.

Best of luck and hang in there!

JME/HO/HTH


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## Chris S (Dec 19, 2007)

The problem with not directly treating marine ich is that it is likely always there, even if you no longer see it. This is problematic because if you decide to add new fish, you will likely see a reoccurance of the parasite - especially on the new addition. This is due to stress, and in conjunction with stress comes a reduced ability of the immune system to fend off disease and parasites. If the fish isn't tough as nails, I would say it will likely succumb to the parasite. 

This leads to another problem, in that the marine ich will be able to rapidly reproduce on the sick fish, which in turn puts strain on your current fish because of the increased amount of MI now existing in your tank. This is often why people assume that their "new" fish brought in crypt, when in actual fact it has existed in the tank for some time already.

The best thing to do is to remove the fish to a QT and treat them with good ol' copper - however be careful if you go this route, as your emperor is quite a bit more sensitive to it than your tangs. It is also important to treat all the fish in the tank, as even those who show no signs of the parasite still carry it.

Good luck!


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## adrenaline (Jan 17, 2011)

Aside from treating the fish firectly, you can run a diatom filter in the tank, which would remove free floating ich in the tank, which i've done in freshwater before as well as med's for the fish.

Another thing I know, which works for parasites, which I've seen done at the Big Als in Vaughan is a freshwater dip. The gentleman there showed me how to remove a parasite that was attached to a large blue tangs eye by simply dropping it into a freshwater tank for a minute. The fish was unharmed, and back to normal in the marine tank shortly after, and the parasite literally dropped off.

I'm no expert in the matter, but wouldn't the same principle work? Again i would research this, but it might be worth a shot. I know prolonged exposure to freshwater is harmful, but a brief dip in freshwater seemed to have no affect on the tang what so ever.

I forgot the guys name, taller gentleman, bald, extremely knowledgeable with marine. He's given me tons of advice on getting my marine tank up and running well. He basically said with the difference in osmotic pressure it's literally a little relieveing for the fish in a short duration.

Again I'm newer to salt, so this is just one experience, and a treatment style told to me. I would look into this before attempting it myself, so I would advise the same of others if you intend to try it.


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## sinner (Sep 25, 2010)

Chris S said:


> The problem with not directly treating marine ich is that it is likely always there, even if you no longer see it. This is problematic because if you decide to add new fish, you will likely see a reoccurance of the parasite - especially on the new addition. This is due to stress, and in conjunction with stress comes a reduced ability of the immune system to fend off disease and parasites. If the fish isn't tough as nails, I would say it will likely succumb to the parasite.
> 
> This leads to another problem, in that the marine ich will be able to rapidly reproduce on the sick fish, which in turn puts strain on your current fish because of the increased amount of MI now existing in your tank. This is often why people assume that their "new" fish brought in crypt, when in actual fact it has existed in the tank for some time already.
> 
> ...


chris is right.

to do this right all fish out of display.

leave display EMPTY for 8 weeks. (no fish you break ICH reproduction cycle)

treat fish in QT for 8 weeks Hypo (thats how i did it no chemicals) OR treat with copper.. either way..

bottom line display tank MUST be empty for 8 weeks

and once fish is "cured" in QT tank wait 2 weeks to make sure they are not still sick.. remember ich ia only visible for a very short period of its reproduction cycle..

this is the ONLY way to get rid of "marine" Ich.. 
cleaner shrimps do nothing. 
temp does nothing..


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## sinner (Sep 25, 2010)

LEEBCA from reefsanctuary saved my fishes lifes.. 
he's harsh but entirely truthfull,

http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forums/fish-diseases-treatments/23132-marine-ich-myths-facts.html

please read this and help stop the spread of myth..


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

sinner said:


> LEEBCA from reefsanctuary saved my fishes lifes..
> he's harsh but entirely truthfull,
> 
> http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forums/fish-diseases-treatments/23132-marine-ich-myths-facts.html
> ...


WOW! great article, thanks!


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## adrenaline (Jan 17, 2011)

ahhh there goes my freshwater idea for ich lol. Awesome article. I serioulsy hope i don't come accross this in my marine tank... so much easier to deal with with freshwater, although i still don't want to come accross it...

Thanks for posting the article, at least i'll have some good knowledge to combat it with IF it happens to me, fingers crossed here...

It also makes me feel better about having multiple spare tanks for quarentine


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## Chris S (Dec 19, 2007)

Freshwater dips are useful, but moreso as a relief, not a cure.


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## teemee (Aug 29, 2009)

Personally, I swear by Melafix and a combination of cleaner shrimp and Janss pipes. It worked a treat in my last tank, and if I can find a small pair of Janss, I'll be putting them in my new tank, as well.
Melafix is basically a teatree oil solution (make sure not to confuse with pimafix, which is clove-oil based, and acts like an anaesthetic on fish) - Its the same homeopathic remedy that we use as a disinfectant and antibacterial.


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## Guest (Sep 4, 2011)

teemee said:


> Personally, I swear by Melafix and a combination of cleaner shrimp and Janss pipes. It worked a treat in my last tank, and if I can find a small pair of Janss, I'll be putting them in my new tank, as well.
> Melafix is basically a teatree oil solution (make sure not to confuse with pimafix, which is clove-oil based, and acts like an anaesthetic on fish) - Its the same homeopathic remedy that we use as a disinfectant and antibacterial.


Pimfix is not clove based at all. It is the essential oil Pimento racesoma which is a well known folk fungal remedy.


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## teemee (Aug 29, 2009)

h_s said:


> Pimfix is not clove based at all. It is the essential oil Pimento racesoma which is a well known folk fungal remedy.


Hi Harold,
according to the MSDS sheet issued by aquarium pharmaceuticals, its actually bay oil, not clove or chilis. Presumably the same as what we would put in soups or stews, as they don't list the Latin name - my mom always said that too much was toxic 
But you've definitely sold me something with chili in the past - I found it effective for whatever I was using it for, even though it made me sneeze uncontrollably. Anyway, when I've mistakenly used pimafix instead of melafix, I could smell it right away. And then I'd see my fish basically pass out one after another. They'd all be fine after a while, but its pretty terrifying to witness.


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## Chris S (Dec 19, 2007)

Either way, I would have to step in and say that Melafix and/or Pimafix are both useless in regards to curing crypt - in my experience anyway. 

They may provide temporary relief and help prevent secondary bacterial/fungal infections when used in conjunction with copper or formalin however.


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