# My new (to me) 35g



## trailblazer295

I recently bought a used 35g and stand to replace my old 20g goldie tank. It will be a FW tank but still unsure about stocking. Stocking ideas welcome and please give quantity numbers as well. This is as big as the tank will be going so please no fish that will require a tank upgrade.

Specs:
Primary Filter: Aquaclear __
Secondary filter: Aquaclear 30
Light bulb: single unknown flourasent tube (haven't bought en it yet, suggestions welcome)
Substrate: sand (colour unknown going with PFS)
Plants: Light to moderate amount(open to suggestions here)

Livestock:
Top: 2 honey gourami
Middle:
Low:


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## buffalo

I like to see serpae tetras maybe a school of 4, congo tertras also nice


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## AquariAM

I'll give you some different ways you can go, all are easy fish provided you have a properly stable tank to start with.

You're probably going to want to augment your filtration. I'm running a 38 gallon with two Aquaclear 70s, which for any kind of significant bioload, I consider the bare minimum.

If you are running a small bioload, a lighter level of filtration will be ok. I honestly don't recommend combining 'just enough' with being new though.

You may want to clone off someone's biofilter so you don't have to cycle.

*Straight tap water, sand or gravel bottom, some plants:*

example 1

1 pair angelfish

1 pair bolivian ram

10 cherry barbs, bleeding heart tetras, or lemon tetras (all very hardy)

1 bushynose pleco

example 2

1 pair pearl gourami

10 cherry/bleeding/lemon

8 bronze corys

1 bushynose pleco

example 3

10 'rose' barbs (barbus nigrofasciatus)

10 corydoras aeneus

1 bushynose pleco

example 4

30 false neons/blue eyes neons (paracheirodon simulans)
20 amano shrimp
breeding pair bushynose pleco

*Elevated hardness and pH*
(by using a powdered buffer or with crushed coral as a buffer)

5 labidochromis caeruleus
7 pseudotropheus demasoni

or

5 labidochromis caeruleus
3 diverse male aulonocara, ie baenschi, firefish

or

a group of metricalima estherae


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## trailblazer295

Would the angels and pleco be ok in that tank for life? I won't be upgrading and don't want to have to sell them off ? Tank dimensions 36" L 15" H 12" D


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## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> Would the angels and pleco be ok in that tank for life? I won't be upgrading and don't want to have to sell them off ? Tank dimensions 36" L 15" H 12" D


Yup. 
Bushynose plecos don't get over 5" and even that's pretty big. 
Don't get crummy angels though get proper quality ones. I'd ask Harold at Menagerie if he can still get good angels from Europe. Used to get really nice ones, silvers, blushers, 'map'. They were good quality. You don't want low quality angelfish.

You'd want to buy small groups of these things and wait for pairs-- with the angels, plecos, bolivian rams.

You could alternatively just buy nice adults. Sort of reduced fun IMO.

If you wanted to you could play around with the load and add some amano shrimp and a clown pleco to that setup, if you're into that kind of thing. Bolivian rams and angels wont eat shrimp unless they're < 1/2" and even then they usually don't bother if they're well fed.

What did you say you were filtering with again? An aquaclear 30 and what's the other one? If the other one isn't a 70 I'm mildly concerned that you don't really have enough filtration. 
Might want to maybe add a sponge filter if you already have an airpump just because they're very inexpensive-- no sense wasting money on something.

By the way, you could work it to fit your two honey gouramis with a pair of angels and with a pair of bolivian rams. Put the filters right in the middle, put lots of wood and broadleaf planting on one far side, ie giant anubias or a large sword plant, put a bunch of rounded rocks on the other far side, and on top of that at the surface put a big clump of floating plants. That keeps everything seperated in little compartments. The angels will take the broad leaf plants, the rams will take the rocks and the gouramis will take the floating plant.

And if you're just using a single tube fluorescent I like the LIFE-GLO bulb. It has a good color for single bulb and it's very bright.


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## trailblazer295

My aquaclear 30 has been in use for the past few years in my 25g goldie tank but I still plan to give the setup a week not only to get the 70 up to scratch but to ensure my temperature is stable. I hadn't looked up the exact number for the aquaclear but the 70 sounds right. I don't know alot about tropical fish and nothing about quality fish. How do I know the differenc between a quality angel and a poor quality one? Also this may seem dumb but how do you net them without hurting them I feel I'd break those fins. So with a Aqua clear 30 and 70 I could put

1 pair angels
1 pair bolivian rams
1 pair honey gourmai
10 bleeding heart tetra
1 bushynose pleco


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## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> My aquaclear 30 has been in use for the past few years in my 25g goldie tank but I still plan to give the setup a week not only to get the 70 up to scratch but to ensure my temperature is stable. I hadn't looked up the exact number for the aquaclear but the 70 sounds right. I don't know alot about tropical fish and nothing about quality fish. How do I know the differenc between a quality angel and a poor quality one? Also this may seem dumb but how do you net them without hurting them I feel I'd break those fins. So with a Aqua clear 30 and 70 I could put
> 
> 1 pair angels
> 1 pair bolivian rams
> 1 pair honey gourmai
> 10 bleeding heart tetra
> 1 bushynose pleco


Ya. Not all right away though you have to let your biofilter build.

Plecos, tetras, gouramis, bolivians, angels. In that order ideally


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## trailblazer295

How many/how often should I add fish? And how long will the bacteria in the filter survive will I have a fwe hours if I submerge the filter media in a bucket of old tank water while i set up the new tank?


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## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> How many/how often should I add fish? And how long will the bacteria in the filter survive will I have a fwe hours if I submerge the filter media in a bucket of old tank water while i set up the new tank?


thats not a good idea. Just run the filter on an old tank or a container. Much better to have it running than to just let it sit in a bucket. You're going to start losing some bacteria after like half an hour. Much safer to have it running.

Also keep in mind with all the new water in that new tank, that's a lot of nitrogen gassing off, which will also hurt some bacteria, you want to run an airpump and heat that new tank up before you put your cycled filters on it so you don't shock your biofilter.

I'd add fish about 1 group per week myself. Make sure the levels are stable. Test often.

I'd start with the bushynose pleco pair, assuming you're going with that. Put the angelfish in last as they're the only ones really likely to cause issues if they think the whole tank is theirs. something like a honey gourami doesn't really have agression in it. They're obnoxious. They can be pests, but they are not aggressive and have no real desire to injure anything else. They DO like to get stuck though- keep that in mind. Seems rediculous for a fish that needs to breathe air... I've lost a dwarf gourami this way and I've seen several videos of especially honeys getting stuck inside a hole etc. Try not to have any tight spaces if you want dwarf gouramis. The larger trichogaster species aren't prone to this- but you can't house trichogaster with colisa, nor can you house trichogaster with angels in a 3 foot tank. The trichs, especially if they're threespots (trichopterus) will never stop challenging the angels for the entire top strata of the tank.

So grab a bn pleco pair.

Then maybe five or six days later grab a pair of bolivian rams. then a school of cherry barbs or something, then the dwarf gouramis (obviously if you already have these put them in second. Not first. Too risky. They're fragile-- which is why if you dont already have them I suggest you don't go that way) and the angels last. What you're looking for in terms of quality is hard to say. It's not easy to explain. If you go to Menagerie and explain that you want really high quality properly shaped fish and could they please catch you the best specimens of each fish you want possible, they'll try to do it for you. I can't really say that of other stores. Especially if Harold's there he'll try to do it for you.

Just as an example though



















Honey Gourami male 2 is much better. Better body shape, better color. Fins are straighter, fish is shiny. Notice the first fish has bent and kinked feelers (modified ventral fins) and is very washed out. Also that the shape of the fat hump on the back is not smooth as fish two.









This Bolivian Ram's eyes are a bit big for it's body, it has a sunken stomach. It is very washed out. It is carrying itself with somewhat closed fins and looks very stressed and cautious. Also notice the lack of black in the eye and the orangey patches on the outside of the eye. This is a sign of an unhappy or stressed Bolivian Ram. Any time they are under the weather the eye will go like this.









This one is properly proportioned, well fed. Good colors. Looks happy and calm. Fins in great condition. Plump. Eye size is proportionate to body

I forgot to ask you-- where are you??
Your water supply dictates what will thrive vs be 'just ok' in straight tap water.

If you're on Toronto's water supply you're fine for the way you want to go. If you're like in Barrie or Orillia or something you'd be better off with African Cichlids.

As per netting angelfish, when they are upset they will hold their fins in, which makes it easier. Personally I catch angels underwater and don't remove them with the net, there's a way to very carefully pick them up with your hand supporting the entire body then gently lower them into the bag.

I wouldn't really worry about it too much. Just buy the angels from someone who knows what they're doing, ie, a private breeder, menagerie, and ask them to tell you how they think is best for you to move the fish. They are more fragile than most fish but it's not like moving a glass vase. Don't drop it.. but it won't break if you breathe on it wrong .

It's good that you are concerned though it shows you will take good care of the fish.

And yes 1 AC30 1 AC70 is enough for the setup you outlined  I haven't seen any super high quality bleeding heart tetras but I'll keep my eyes open. Big Al's Scarborough always has fantastic honey gouramis usually in all three morphs (yellow/red/standard) but again, this is a fragile, I would argue relatively boring gourami, is prone to internal parasites, and may not be a good choice for a beginner. Angel wise I don't know who has nice ones right now but if I see anything I'll tell you. Menagerie is getting a large European order that'll be ready for sale the 17th of March. There'll be some nice SA/CA cichlids in there. Might include Angelfish.


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## trailblazer295

The big problem is that the old tank is sitting where the new tank has to go and moving a 200lb tank of water isn't exactly doable. I do have a bottle of big als bio support with the beneficial bacteria in it. 

Do you know off hand where to find this tetra safe start everyone talks about? 

I'm in markham and its the colour of the yellow honey gourami's at big als scarborough that made me want them. With angels and rams present I don't really need the gourami as a center piece fish so may just pass on those and give the other fish more space. 

Is there any specific species of angel to look for? Smaller versions that won't feel cramped in a not overly tall tank.
What/where is Menagerie?


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## AquariAM

All angels will reach approximately the same size overall if well cared for. Menagerie is at Parliament and Wellesly in Toronto it's a petshop.

Tetra safe start is one of many similar products. Seachem Stability is a good example. Honestly you don't need any of that stuff. I've used several brands and don't find it to be particularly critical. The seachem stability is the best one I've used and definitely makes a large contribution to nitrification whereas I have found the difference from Cycle (hagen), stresszyme (API) and BA's bio negligable if any. The bacteria in the bottle won't settle down and make a life for themselves in your biofilter. They are faculative. They're around for awhile and help out then they go to the fish bowl in the sky. It's a good crutch for a new tank or when you sharply up your load but honestly if you add fish slowly there is no need for the added expense.

a standard 35 is just fine height wise for angelfish no need to worry .

Have fun.


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## trailblazer295

Sounds good when I set the tank up depends on the weather. One of my goldies is going back in the pond once its warm enough to put him in. 

Menagerie have black sand substrate? How do the prices compare?


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## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> Sounds good when I set the tank up depends on the weather. One of my goldies is going back in the pond once its warm enough to put him in.
> 
> Menagerie have black sand substrate? How do the prices compare?


I wouldn't call it 'sand'. It's more like microgravel. $1/lb and it's pretty heavy stuff. I have some white sand I bought there that I like a lot. Also $1/lb. 20lbs will be enough for you. You don't need more than an inch and a half. The black sand you will probably need 30 or 40 lbs. If you want true black sand you might be able to find tahitian moon sand at a pet shop, or 3M colorquartz black T grade at places like durock alfacing and leo marbelite


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## trailblazer295

Ok I'll keep an eye out.

Looks like I have my stock list

1 pair angels
1 pair bolivian ram
10 bleeding heart tetra
1 pair bushy nose pleco


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## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> Ok I'll keep an eye out.
> 
> Looks like I have my stock list
> 
> 1 pair angels
> 1 pair bolivian ram
> 10 bleeding heart tetra
> 1 pair bushy nose pleco


I've had a tank with that exact combo. You should be very happy with it .


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## trailblazer295

Good to hear, I still don't know about background always had pictures I think it's time to go black with all that will be real infront of it. I can get all the above livestock at Menagerie right? or should I make a trip to big als for some it.


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## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> Good to hear, I still don't know about background always had pictures I think it's time to go black with all that will be real infront of it. I can get all the above livestock at Menagerie right? or should I make a trip to big als for some it.


Probably menagerie. Especially given that they've got a bunch of ca/sa stuff on the way next week.


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## trailblazer295

Great, thanks for the help


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## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> Great, thanks for the help


Once you feel like the tank's ready why not throw some amano shrimp in too? They're fun and hardy


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## Darkside

Surely you'd want more than a single pair of Bolivian rams.


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## trailblazer295

I would? Never even heard of this fish before.


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## Darkside

They do better in a group. If it were my 35 gallon, I'd ditch the angels all together and go with 6-8 Bolivian rams. The rams are entertaining fish. I always find angels to be exceedingly boring. 
Actually I have a 35 gallon tank. The stock list is, 5 checkerboard cichlids (Dicrossus filamentosus), 6 norman lampeyes (Poropanchax normani), 8 gertrude's blue eyes (Psudilmugil gertrudae), 16-20 pygmy cories (Corydoras pygmaeus) and a couple dwarf BN plecos. Its a planted tank with an aquaclear 50 on it.


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## trailblazer295

Is it normal for angels to just kind of float near the surface with the body aimed to it? Was out trying to get prices for tank items and the angels in petsmart were just floating (not sideways) . Is it just poor quality or is this a normal thing for them?


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## dl88dl

trailblazer295 said:


> Would the angels and pleco be ok in that tank for life? I won't be upgrading and don't want to have to sell them off ? Tank dimensions 36" L 15" H 12" D


The measurements you stated above is only a 28gal tank - 36x15x12=6480/231=28.05


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## trailblazer295

It seems i've been ripped off. #[email protected]#@#@

My initial measurement was wrong its 16" high not 15" but that only makes it a 30gal.


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## trailblazer295

With this new light what modifications to my stocking list have to be made?


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## dl88dl

trailblazer295 said:


> It seems i've been ripped off. #[email protected]#@#@
> 
> My initial measurement was wrong its 16" high not 15" but that only makes it a 30gal.


Still a very nice setup


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## trailblazer295

With this new light I may have to swap out my angels for a smaller fish to give them more space. How would this setup work in a 30gal

4 bolivian ram
10 bleeding heart tetra
2 bushy nose pleco


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## Darkside

trailblazer295 said:


> With this new light I may have to swap out my angels for a smaller fish to give them more space. How would this setup work in a 30gal
> 
> 4 bolivian ram
> 10 bleeding heart tetra
> 2 bushy nose pleco


You still have room for 6 Bolivian rams. They do better in a larger group. They aren't as colourful as the blue rams, but they have fantastic personalities.


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## trailblazer295

I have to rethink the centerpiece fish now. I still have time to plan it out but was ready to move on to gathering decor.


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## dl88dl

trailblazer295 said:


> I have to rethink the centerpiece fish now. I still have time to plan it out but was ready to move on to gathering decor.


Would like to see some pictures when you are all done...thanks


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## trailblazer295

dl88dl said:


> Would like to see some pictures when you are all done...thanks


I will snap some shots, setup date is dependent on the weather as one of the goldfish in the old tank will be going back in the pond before I can tear it down.


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## AquariAM

Darkside said:


> Surely you'd want more than a single pair of Bolivian rams.


Not in 36x12. It won't be peaceful. As someone else mentioned you could do like 8 but I don't like keeping them in groups behaviour wise. It bores me. I'd like to comment on a post that said angels are exceedingly boring. I disagree.


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## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> Is it normal for angels to just kind of float near the surface with the body aimed to it? Was out trying to get prices for tank items and the angels in petsmart were just floating (not sideways) . Is it just poor quality or is this a normal thing for them?


That's what they do when severely stressed.


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## Darkside

AquariAM said:


> Not in 36x12. It won't be peaceful


I've always kept 6-8 in that foot print and its been successful for me. Its more active than keeping a pair of fish and its certainly more entertaining.


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## trailblazer295

AquariAM said:


> That's what they do when severely stressed.


Ok it's good to know that isn't the norm for them. I have to take a few walks in other stores to watch the fish in action before I make a final decision but in a now 30gal tank would below stock still work?

2 angels
2 bolivian ram
10 bleeding heart tetra
2 bushy nose pleco


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## AquariAM

http://s110.photobucket.com/albums/n88/111olbap/?action=view&current=100_4657.flv

features all the fish you want minus the plecos. Nothing notices the tetras exist but when the ram violates the angels' territory it gets chased. That's why it's important to have them in seperate corners.

http://s110.photobucket.com/albums/n88/111olbap/?action=view&current=100_4739.flv

^
non stressed behaviour

I think it will still work. The reduced vertical incherage will mean increased ram/angel interaction but you can pull it off.


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## trailblazer295

AquariAM said:


> http://s110.photobucket.com/albums/n88/111olbap/?action=view&current=100_4657.flv
> 
> features all the fish you want minus the plecos. Nothing notices the tetras exist but when the ram violates the angels' territory it gets chased. That's why it's important to have them in seperate corners.
> 
> http://s110.photobucket.com/albums/n88/111olbap/?action=view&current=100_4739.flv
> 
> ^
> non stressed behaviour
> 
> I think it will still work. The reduced vertical incherage will mean increased ram/angel interaction but you can pull it off.


Technically I have an extra inch of vertical it's merely less water volume. If there is a more suitable fish that angels that will work with my tank I am open to suggestions.


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## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> Technically I have an extra inch of vertical it's merely less water volume. If there is a more suitable fish that angels that will work with my tank I am open to suggestions.


It'll work.


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## trailblazer295

Good to know, I'll be making a few trips to LFS to see that the angels and rams look like in action.


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## AquariAM

You can never judge by what the fish look like at the fish store. They are stressed and overcrowded. 

GTAA member Calmer breeds angelfish in pickering. He has some nice stuff.










I hope he doesn't mind me using his pictures. I'm trying to sell his stuff so it should be ok and he links to these in his ad. 

http://www.gtaaquaria.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12283&highlight=angel

here is a link to his ad. He should steer you right. I suggest getting a group of young angels and growing them until a pair forms, or if several form, select your favorite, then re-home the rest of the fish.

Nobody that I know of breeds and sells bolivian rams in Toronto. Apparently there's a trick to it. You have to raise the young in almost complete darkness- just enough light for them to see their food. No overhead lighting, and a pH from about 7.4 to 7.8


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## trailblazer295

I'm not concerned with breeding the fish so thats not really a concern. I'm more looking for a healthy pair of each that will get along and look good. If he still has some when my tank is ready for angels I will be contacting him.


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## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> I'm not concerned with breeding the fish so thats not really a concern. I'm more looking for a healthy pair of each that will get along and look good. If he still has some when my tank is ready for angels I will be contacting him.


If you get them young you can add them first. No territorialism kicks in until about toonie body size


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## trailblazer295

Would I be able to add them at the same time as the plecos? or better to split them up 5days or so?


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## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> Would I be able to add them at the same time as the plecos? or better to split them up 5days or so?


What are you replacing bioload wise, a gold fish?

I'd equate about a 6" cubed fancy goldfish to a pair of adult bn plecos in terms of consumption. Ideally I'd space those and the angels a few days apart.
Don't keep this tank below 80F btw. Angels don't like that.


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## trailblazer295

It will technically be goldfish but I will end up losing some bioload ability because the filter will be sitting for at lesat half an hour to an hour while I move the old tank which will have to be mostly drained of water and set and fill up the new before I can put the filter on. I think I'll add the pleco first which gives me a few more days to ensure my temp is stable at 80 or 81 before adding angels then tetra, and rams.


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## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> It will technically be goldfish but I will end up losing some bioload ability because the filter will be sitting for at lesat half an hour to an hour while I move the old tank which will have to be mostly drained of water and set and fill up the new before I can put the filter on. I think I'll add the pleco first which gives me a few more days to ensure my temp is stable at 80 or 81 before adding angels then tetra, and rams.


Get a styro box or a 2 gallon or a bucket and run the filter on it


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## trailblazer295

*slaps forehead* I have a 5.5 gal in my bedroom with 5 bloodfin tetra's in I can hook it up there for an hour.


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## AquariAM

That would be perfect


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## trailblazer295

I'd still give it a few days anyway with the new filter to get up to speed and stabilize my temp anyway. For heater placement on a tank this long where is usually the best place? There is a bit of a cut out offset of the middle on the left side.


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## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> I'd still give it a few days anyway with the new filter to get up to speed and stabilize my temp anyway. For heater placement on a tank this long where is usually the best place? There is a bit of a cut out offset of the middle on the left side.


Doesn't matter. Just make sure there's an even current in there and that it flows across the heater.


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## trailblazer295

Ok thought I'd check I will give it a few days and see I have a stick on thermometer on one end I might add another one on the other end to be sure its getting the proper flow.


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## AquariAM

Really not necessary. You don't have to worry about uneven heating until you get up to about five foot lengths, much higher volumes and less flow than you plan on


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## trailblazer295

Oh ok great either way my heater isn't one with numbers so I still need to play around with it.


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## dl88dl

Have a read on this subject - Fishless cycle by seeding the new aquarium -

http://freshaquarium.about.com/od/startupcycle/f/seedtank.htm

Good luck


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## trailblazer295

dl88dl said:


> Have a read on this subject - Fishless cycle by seeding the new aquarium -
> 
> http://freshaquarium.about.com/od/startupcycle/f/seedtank.htm
> 
> Good luck


thanks for the link I have a better idea how to set the new one up properly.


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## AquariAM

I found that article somewhat overcomplicated the whole concept   

Get sponge/rings from friend/other tank at home, put in filter, put filter on new tank. 

^
Cliff notes edition


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## trailblazer295

AquariAM said:


> I found that article somewhat overcomplicated the whole concept
> 
> Get sponge/rings from friend/other tank at home, put in filter, put filter on new tank.
> 
> ^
> Cliff notes edition


lol can you make it more concise?


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## AquariAM

So how's the tank coming along


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## trailblazer295

Work still needs to be done on the pond that one of my goldies will be going into to. Also the weather isn't warm enough to put fish in anyway. Also need to get rid of my 2 fantails.


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## trailblazer295

What are the stocking differences between a bolivian ram and a blue ram?


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## AquariAM

Like how? Bioload? Requirements? #?

In your 35 you can either do a pair of bolivians or a pair of germans -- but more ideally 1m and 2 or 3f either or.

With bolivians you MIGHT get away with a school of 7 or 8 in the 35. I find it crappshootesque.


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## trailblazer295

AquariAM said:


> Like how? Bioload? Requirements? #?
> 
> In your 35 you can either do a pair of bolivians or a pair of germans -- but more ideally 1m and 2 or 3f either or.
> 
> With bolivians you MIGHT get away with a school of 7 or 8 in the 35. I find it crappshootesque.


I should have been more specific I meant more temperament and compatibility with my other stock. Was visiting a few LFS to see angels and rams in action to get some idea. Didn't seen any Bolivian but did see the blue, gold rams so that's why I asked. And its a 30 not 35


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## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> I should have been more specific I meant more temperament and compatibility with my other stock. Was visiting a few LFS to see angels and rams in action to get some idea. Didn't seen any Bolivian but did see the blue, gold rams so that's why I asked. And its a 30 not 35


You have to look closely for bolivians. They're also sold as red tail rams and crown ruby cichlids, which I think is the most accurate as it really isn't a ram. Also if theyre small they look pretty ratty and arent very colorful.

Either fish is pretty peaceful. The blue ram is much more sensitive.


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## trailblazer295

AquariAM said:


> You have to look closely for bolivians. They're also sold as red tail rams and crown ruby cichlids, which I think is the most accurate as it really isn't a ram. Also if theyre small they look pretty ratty and arent very colorful.
> 
> Either fish is pretty peaceful. The blue ram is much more sensitive.


Oh ok that may have been it, I walked pretty fast back the cichlid tanks. They are usually grouped and didn't think any of the fish I was looking for would be there. would a pair of blue rams and a pair of gold in addition the rest of the stock be ok in a 30?


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## trailblazer295

If they don't specify male/female and only one tank has them in it how would I get 1m 2f or 3f?


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## AquariAM

You buy a big group and crapshoot it and wait for pairs to form.

Menagerie has 'ok' bolivian rams I was just there. BA's scarboro has PERFECT silver angels. They're so perfect I bought four and set a tank up for them tonight cloned off my big tank.. I wasn't even looking for angels they were too perfect to pass up. Run, don't walk, and buy some. $6/ea

They also have some totally perfect laetacara curviceps, absolute 10/10 quality. You could easily get a group of those and wait for a pair or harem just like the bolivian rams. The curviceps and angels are top quality. Just make sure you don't buy any angels with bent or oversize dorsal fins.

If you have a car and you can give me a ride I'm happy to cherry pick fish for you that will turn out good.


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## trailblazer295

AquariAM said:


> You buy a big group and crapshoot it and wait for pairs to form.
> 
> Menagerie has 'ok' bolivian rams I was just there. BA's scarboro has PERFECT silver angels. They're so perfect I bought four and set a tank up for them tonight cloned off my big tank.. I wasn't even looking for angels they were too perfect to pass up. Run, don't walk, and buy some. $6/ea
> 
> They also have some totally perfect laetacara curviceps, absolute 10/10 quality. You could easily get a group of those and wait for a pair or harem just like the bolivian rams. The curviceps and angels are top quality. Just make sure you don't buy any angels with bent or oversize dorsal fins.
> 
> If you have a car and you can give me a ride I'm happy to cherry pick fish for you that will turn out good.


I'd be heading there tomorrow if I didn't have a 20g in the way and an empty 30 sitting in my basement. The cherry picking fish though at a later date isn't a bad idea.


----------



## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> I'd be heading there tomorrow if I didn't have a 20g in the way and an empty 30 sitting in my basement. The cherry picking fish though at a later date isn't a bad idea.


You have to go tommorow. Good angels wait for no one.
You're probably looking at about a six month gap until perfect silvers come up again. Menagerie has near perfect blacks and maps but perfect silvers are a rare GTA find.
I already took the four best ones . How many more of me are gonna beat ya to it?

I took about 20 minutes to pick my four out. I wrote "anal retentive" as my name on my order form though so the guy saw it coming.


----------



## trailblazer295

It will have to wait still alot of prep work to do, have no substrate, main filter or bulb. I know the bulb just have to measure out size and buy it. The substrate and decor is my biggest hurdle. Any other places to get driftwood and rocks other than BA?


----------



## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> It will have to wait still alot of prep work to do, have no substrate, main filter or bulb. I know the bulb just have to measure out size and buy it. The substrate and decor is my biggest hurdle. Any other places to get driftwood and rocks other than BA?


You want to raise juvi angels without a light. You get better fin shape. Same goes for Bolivian Rams. I've been raising both in dim to no light to about 1/2 adult size for years. You get way better results. These angels will be lightless for two months. The filter you can buy while you get the angels. Substrate ditto. Sand. A nice log. Two rocks. Done. Angels are open water fish.


----------



## trailblazer295

AquariAM said:


> You want to raise juvi angels without a light. You get better fin shape. Same goes for Bolivian Rams. I've been raising both in dim to no light to about 1/2 adult size for years. You get way better results. These angels will be lightless for two months. The filter you can buy while you get the angels. Substrate ditto. Sand. A nice log. Two rocks. Done. Angels are open water fish.


What is it about the lack of light affects there development? What would a lit aquarium do to them?


----------



## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> What is it about the lack of light affects there development? What would a lit aquarium do to them?


No idea what the light does. I've never had the same quality of color and straightness of fins develop under bright lighting with angels. Bolivian Rams will develop a better body shape under dim light.

They both come from dim lit areas in the wild. What the light does to them I don't know. Once they reach about 2 inches or so it doesn't matter much.

If you spawn bolivian rams and raise the young in bright light and acidic water you will get something more akin to Oscar the grouch than a fish though.

The right water conditions make a difference. I had some leleupi in tap water. Looked fine. Added some malawi buffer and trace elements to get the pH to about 8 and have the correct traces for that kind of fish. Eyes turned form yellow to fluorescent blue and growth increased.


----------



## trailblazer295

Is this type of driftwood any good for angels?

http://www.bigalsonline.ca/StoreCat...-CAD-17364##0##c&queryType=0&hits=12&offset=0


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## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> Is this type of driftwood any good for angels?
> 
> http://www.bigalsonline.ca/StoreCat...-CAD-17364##0##c&queryType=0&hits=12&offset=0


That's ideal.
They have lots of it there. Even more ideal, Menagerie has Manzanita. it's 12.99/lb but if you cut it up into pieces the length of your tank, go for a sand bottom , and arrange the wood sort of like roots-- while leaving lots of open space, add a couple sword plants, that's pretty close to the wild environment.


----------



## trailblazer295

Wouldn't that setup A require lighting? B would it work for some kind of ram?


----------



## AquariAM

Plants need light. Rams work with anything that isnt going to bother them or mind being chased a short distance from their territory. Only get one bottom dwelling cichlid and you'll be fine.


----------



## trailblazer295

I meant will the aquascape be ok for rams or do they prefer a different setup? As you mentioned once before wood and plant on one side and rocks on the other.


----------



## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> I meant will the aquascape be ok for rams or do they prefer a different setup? As you mentioned once before wood and plant on one side and rocks on the other.


Ya work that in. The blues prefer denser planting. Don't get them not a good starter fish. Branchy wood, rocks one side swords the other you're good.


----------



## trailblazer295

With the difficulty finding bolivians whats an acceptable subsitute?


----------



## AquariAM

Curviceps (perfect adults @ Ba's scarb) *minor dirt bag attitude potential towards angels*









Kribensis (Menagerie) ~EAT SHRIMP~

There are about 50 more I can suggest but they're all fragile and not good beginner fish. I wouldn't keep them. Even now.

Also there are some perfect bleeding heart tetras @ menagerie. They're about as nice as they get. There's only like five though. You'd need to get more elsewhere.


----------



## trailblazer295

Are the above two ok for beginners?


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## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> Are the above two ok for beginners?


The Kribensis especially. It eliminates shrimp and many snails from your future plans though.








Here's a female. Shorter, no pointed fin, larger red area on stomach, occasionally more yellow coloration, less or no ocelaris (circular tail markings). These fish require a cave. Doesn't have to be complicated. You can cut a large coconut in half and make a door with a dremmel or just get four pieces of sandstone or slate and make a little hut. Or buy a prefab one. Ideally have 2 or 3 caves incase they aren't getting along at some point.


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## trailblazer295

Are the caves you see for reptiles aquarium safe? I might make some of my own as well as having a prefab one.


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## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> Are the caves you see for reptiles aquarium safe? I might make some of my own as well as having a prefab one.


Don't use reptile stuff. They make them for fish. Just go to Big Als. 
You're making this way too complicated man. Just slap it together and start putting some fish in there .

Get a 2500W heater and your goldfish will be fine outside


----------



## trailblazer295

AquariAM said:


> Don't use reptile stuff. They make them for fish. Just go to Big Als.
> You're making this way too complicated man. Just slap it together and start putting some fish in there .
> 
> Get a 2500W heater and your goldfish will be fine outside


 it's all well and good until you see the hyrdo bill


----------



## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> it's all well and good until you see the hyrdo bill


I never said to plug it in at YOUR house  
 My friend's neighbor when I was a teenager was so cheap, he used to sneak into the neighbors yard at night, take her hose and use her water to water his plants. Save a dollar a month or so. Why not.


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## trailblazer295

Wow to save a dollar a month he was stealing water. I'm amazed he bought the plants in the first place.


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## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> Wow to save a dollar a month he was stealing water. I'm amazed he bought the plants in the first place.


You really think he'd buy plants?


----------



## trailblazer295

That's what happened to my garden I thought it was racoons


----------



## AquariAM

Ya I've been there.


----------



## trailblazer295

Ya it took year 3 of the pond for them to get interested and it's of course when I put a plant in the waterfall to add colour they have to rip it out every night


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## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> Ya it took year 3 of the pond for them to get interested and it's of course when I put a plant in the waterfall to add colour they have to rip it out every night


If I had a pond I'd just put a 3 foot + common snapper in it. The first raccoon to get too curious is going to have a bad night.


----------



## trailblazer295

Most annoying part was the only took one bite out of the plant but left it on the side so it dried up. They kept doing that trying to catch my fish even in a shallow pond they couldn't do it.


----------



## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> Most annoying part was the only took one bite out of the plant but left it on the side so it dried up. They kept doing that trying to catch my fish even in a shallow pond they couldn't do it.


They learn. Someone I used to know had very large goldfish eaten, a turtle's foot eaten, etc.

I'd just make a little electrified fence on a timer. Nothing too strong. Just a couple hundred volts. Enough to remind raccoons not to cross the line.


----------



## trailblazer295

I'm not worried my fish are small and because they are worth nothing they don't get caught. Mostly feeder fish so I don't really care if one gets caught. thought if the 3 goldies in my tank get caught I'll be a little ticked off.


----------



## trailblazer295

Found some good driftwood for my angel's today at BA. Intricate roots with space for them to pass through without being to big for my tank.


----------



## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> Found some good driftwood for my angel's today at BA. Intricate roots with space for them to pass through without being to big for my tank.


Did you see the angels downstairs?


----------



## trailblazer295

Didn't think of it but didn't have time either got there just before they closed. Grabbed my driftwood, 2 bags of flourite black sand and got out.


----------



## trailblazer295

It looks like I'll be heading back to BA tomorrow anyway, my air pump for my 20g doesn't seem to want to make bubbles. I can feel a small amount of air but won't pump into the tank.


----------



## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> It looks like I'll be heading back to BA tomorrow anyway, my air pump for my 20g doesn't seem to want to make bubbles. I can feel a small amount of air but won't pump into the tank.


You have a leak somewhere in the air line. Snug a short airline into it put the other end in a plastic bag and seal. If the bag inflates the pump is fine.


----------



## trailblazer295

Would a check valve make a difference? It worked before I just unplugged it for awhile and plugged it back so the air line shouldn't have holes it wasn't coiled up.


----------



## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> Would a check valve make a difference? It worked before I just unplugged it for awhile and plugged it back so the air line shouldn't have holes it wasn't coiled up.


Check valve backwards? The cheap cheap ones can jam. 
Make sure you don't just have a really loose over worked piece of airline, kinks, etc. I've never gotten a DOA airpump. They're not well made any more but nonetheless it's such a simple mechanism..

You only need a check valve if the airpump is placed below the aquarium by the by.


----------



## trailblazer295

I did have a check valve and took that line off used a brand new length of line and put it in the tank not a single bubble. I'm taking it back to BA tomorrow I don't really need an airpump anymore anyway so hopefully I can get a credit for an Aquaclear 70.


----------



## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> I did have a check valve and took that line off used a brand new length of line and put it in the tank not a single bubble. I'm taking it back to BA tomorrow I don't really need an airpump anymore anyway so hopefully I can get a credit for an Aquaclear 70.


Hmm. Does it "BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR" at least?

That IS the technical term. If you call for support, they will ask you if it is BRRing.



AC70's are my favourite HOB filter. Not ginormous, not so small they don't do a whole lot. Flexible. Overpriced now-- but if you look past that, good filter.


----------



## trailblazer295

Yes it does sound on just as it did before but not much air pressure at all. Supposed to be a 25g rated pump but its not working. Its a rena pump and the box says 2yr guarentee so we will see.


----------



## AquariAM

That guarantee is through RENA. If you have a BA's points account with that particular store and you are within one year, unless they've changed their policy they will exchange it. I'm not sure if they will give you credit though.


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## trailblazer295

I've got nothing to loose I need more supplies for my 30g tank anyway filter, some rocks and check out some of the livestock.


----------



## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> I've got nothing to loose I need more supplies for my 30g tank anyway filter, some rocks and check out some of the livestock.


You want to buy rocks up the street at Betz cut stone, just south of steeles on kennedy. $6 for a bag of granite you need two people to carry. I bought 100lbs of silica sandstone- enough to make huge cave structures 10" high across two 3' tanks for fifty bucks all in. 
This is one reason a mbuna tank is so cheap to do. You get some silica sand for twenty bucks or pool filter sand for even less, go throw maybe twenty five bucks at some rocks and you're done and the fish are happy.

Take a moment to familiarize yourself with igneous metamorphic and sedimentary rocks and namely how to spot acidic intermediate and basic rocks. Aim for acidic rocks. Intermediate if you must but try to avoid it. You're doing south american stuff so you don't want rocks that will raise your pH. Rocks like Quartz, silica, granite are what you want. Betz sells 'river rocks'. They are grey and pink river washed (round) granite in various sizes. Perfect for spawning by rams. If you're looking to do kribs you're better getting silica sandstone (they call it credit valley flag or something). It comes in giant tiles. Get a hammer and hit it like it owes you money to make smaller pieces to make caves with.


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## trailblazer295

Wow I didn't even know that was an option, I always like what those type of fish looked like and there behaviour. Looks like I'm returning more stuff to BA tomorrow.


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## Tropicana

Remember to wear safety glasses!

"Get a hammer and hit it like it owes you money to make smaller pieces to make caves with."


----------



## trailblazer295

Why would an air pump blow bubbles for seconds then start siphoning water?


----------



## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> Why would an air pump blow bubbles for seconds then start siphoning water?


Shoddy, rushed chinese construction.


----------



## trailblazer295

UPDATE: Transfered 5 bloodfins from my 5.5g to the 30g along with the filter. After an hour 4 are moving around as one and the 5th is hiding. The 5.5g will be home to a betta in a few weeks.


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## AquariAM

you didnt just plop them over did you? You have to float tank to tank even in your own house


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## trailblazer295

Float tank to tank? Anyway to late ya they just went straight in, they are all roaming around, hide for a bit then roam again. Water temperature was the same checked before I made the switch.

EDIT all 5 are now together as a shoal swimming around the tank


----------



## AquariAM

of course. You float and mix the water in a bag every time you move fish. No two tanks are totally the same.


----------



## trailblazer295

Update on the tank

Not final aquascape still plan to add some small rock piles for rams and another amazon sword.


----------



## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> Update on the tank
> 
> Not final aquascape still plan to add some small rock piles for rams and another amazon sword.


That is a perfect angelfish tank man. Still think you should move that sword left slightly and put the other sword beside it. I'd move the filter to the right a little bit so the angel area is calmer.

I'd probably add a very low end power head on the right side aimed across the top for better surface movement.

Put a prefilter (take a sponge, hole in middle, slide onto filter) on the filter intake. Prevents food and baby fish from being sucked in. Lets the filter just biofilter and not have to mech, thus negatively affecting your bottom sponge's biofilter capacity.

Don't do rock piles for the rams, just do rocks. One rock here, one rock there,









They prefer having a single large isolated rock with the bottom buried. Sort of like having a castle on a hill. You want to see what's around you and be slightly elevated. They will choose the smoothest rock and prefer rounded rocks to totally flat ones. I would also ditch the slate cave. Looks weird and the only thing on your plan that will use caves is a pleco, and any pleco will take the underside of a log over a slate cave.










TWO! FIFTY TWO! FIFTY TWO! HIKE HIKE!

Where's your AC50? Weren't you gonna run 1xac70+1xac50/30 on there? Cuzz it looks like there's a single 50 or 70 on there and though a single 70 is sufficient, it's ever so slightly meh. Just slightly.

Did you get your wood at BA's?? I recognize the malaysian drift. What's the branchy thing? is it the branch stuff they have thats screwed to the rock base right now? I was considering it but it's expensive..


----------



## trailblazer295

This picture was taken after the amazon sword shift to left. The ac70 is in pic, the ac30 is currently being used on the rubbermaid, there is an ac20 on there right now to the right of the of ac70. The cave has since been shrunk and the wood is from BA. The branch is screwed to slate and I think it was around $20ish forget not the rest is just the malaisan driftwood from BA.


----------



## AquariAM

The fluorescent pink blobs are supposed to be smooth granite...


----------



## trailblazer295

I'll have to run both the ac70 and ac30 because I have the ac70 backed off due to the water landing partly on the canopy. The water surface is pretty calm on the angel side with the two filters running right now. I'll take another picture today after the rocks go in.


----------



## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> I'll have to run both the ac70 and ac30 because I have the ac70 backed off due to the water landing partly on the canopy. The water surface is pretty calm on the angel side with the two filters running right now. I'll take another picture today after the rocks go in.


Why don't you cut or dremmel the canopy down?


----------



## trailblazer295

I'll look into notching the plastic its only a certain spot and not alot of space to work with. Here is an updated pic, I have a tentative deal for another sword with a forum member.


----------



## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> I'll look into notching the plastic its only a certain spot and not alot of space to work with. Here is an updated pic, I have a tentative deal for another sword with a forum member.


excellent 

Even if you cant get the other sword or if you end up not being good with plants you'll be ok. It's a good tank and angels and rams will spawn for you in there with proper care.


----------



## trailblazer295

The tank looks alot darker in person so I may swap the aqua glo bulb with a power glo. It happened to be the same size as my 20g tank so it just used that.


----------



## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> The tank looks alot darker in person so I may swap the aqua glo bulb with a power glo. It happened to be the same size as my 20g tank so it just used that.


Light you can see and light plants can use are not one and the same. 

Again even if it doesnt work out, there are plastic swords, and angels prefer dark tanks anyways


----------



## h_brutus

Nothing to do with chinese construction.. you just need a check valve so that when the air pump is off there is no back flow of water. i had the same problem



AquariAM said:


> Shoddy, rushed chinese construction.


----------



## trailblazer295

I had a check valve when I unplugged it the first time, tried it awhile later and bubbles for a few seconds then start siphoning water while running even when it is above the water line.


----------



## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> I had a check valve when I unplugged it the first time, tried it awhile later and bubbles for a few seconds then start siphoning water while running even when it is above the water line.


Those cheap penn plax check valves have not failed me so far


----------



## trailblazer295

It's not the valve i disconnected it and tried the pump above water with a short piece of line into the water it bubbled for 5seconds max then started sucking water.


----------



## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> It's not the valve i disconnected it and tried the pump above water with a short piece of line into the water it bubbled for 5seconds max then started sucking water.


Sounds like you want a new airpump


----------



## trailblazer295

Not really now have plenty of filters, an air pump isn't really needed in my planted aquarium.


----------



## AquariAM

I always like to run a small underpowered airpump with the airstone suctioned to the wall of the tank just 2 1/2" under the water line. Does not produce additional current but all the bubbles do remove protein slick. If you've never seen protein slick, you're not gonna like it. It looks like a rainbow slick of motor oil. It isn't dangerous, it's just a result of fish food, but it does mildly impair oxygen exchange, looks horrible, and blocks light a little bit. 

Personally I can't stand seeing it.


----------



## trailblazer295

I'll hold off for now but will keep an eye out. What brand of air pump do you use? or have used with good results in the past?


----------



## AquariAM

Apparently they're all crapp diaphragms now. I use the tetra ones that are blue with the suspended motor but they're loud and low output now too.. so... caveat airpumptor.


----------



## Fish_Man

I use the same airpump that is blue from tetra.

Tetra whisper 40 which I would agree it is loud but not as loud as some others I've heard...

After a while.... u just think its part of a normal daily noise...


----------



## AquariAM

I have 2 whisper 20s. They are much louder than the ones I had in 2005 same model . Lighter weight lower output too.


----------



## Fish_Man

everything is now made worst at least for air pumps it seems


----------



## AquariAM

Fish_Man said:


> everything is now made worst at least for air pumps it seems


Thankfully Aquaclears have been the same for 10 years... Functional and the same and relatively quiet. As have penguins and emperors- still loud and sucky.


----------



## trailblazer295

lol great to hear im screwed when it comes to the airpump regardless.


----------



## Fish_Man

you're not screwed.... just gonna be annoyed until you get used to it


----------



## trailblazer295

Used to air pumps failing to work not long after purchase?


----------



## Fish_Man

nah they all work fine just remember to get a check valve so water doesn't flow back into the pump.

I would say get a brand new air pump from a fish store so you can always return it if you're not happy with the noise it makes.


----------



## trailblazer295

I had a check valve on my last air pump I unplugged it for awhile because it wasn't needed now it pumps air for short time then siphons. Checked the "warrenty" ya spend $10 to mail a $20 pump and hope the do something. Won't get a rena one again.


----------



## Fish_Man

well I mean an instore warranty.. I know BA's give you a one year warranty if you are a member (free by the way).


----------



## trailblazer295

I am now a member but wasn't when I bought the pump. A lesson oh well, I'll keep an eye out for another brand air pump. What brand do you use?


----------



## Fish_Man

Tetra Whisper Air Pump 40


----------



## trailblazer295

How long have you had a Tetra Whisper?


----------



## Fish_Man

trailblazer295 said:


> How long have you had a Tetra Whisper?


Probably a few months now


----------



## AquariAM

RENA airpumps are garbage. Bought one six years ago and it was awful... cant imagine how bad it'd be now years later.


----------



## AquaNeko

I got some feedback a while ago while looking for air pumps. Some stat data as well as I have a dB meter.

http://gtaaquaria.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10203&highlight=pump


----------



## trailblazer295

AquariAM said:


> RENA airpumps are garbage. Bought one six years ago and it was awful... cant imagine how bad it'd be now years later.


They are still garbage for sure, it wasn't even 6 months old as wasn't running that whole time.



AquaNeko said:


> I got some feedback a while ago while looking for air pumps. Some stat data as well as I have a dB meter.
> 
> http://gtaaquaria.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10203&highlight=pump


I'm not to concerned with dB levels as it isn't in a sleeping area. Reliability is more important.


----------



## Fish_Man

I don't like the RENA heater either.. not very reliable at least for me.

Give the tetra whisper air pump a try and see if you like it.. I think its reliable so far.


----------



## trailblazer295

A small LFS has everything on sale so it might be a good time to get one.


----------



## Fish_Man

trailblazer295 said:


> A small LFS has everything on sale so it might be a good time to get one.


really? where is that.. I might need to get some stuff too


----------



## trailblazer295

Franks Aquarium in markham, was in there the other day for Prime picked up some food while I was there.


----------



## Fish_Man

trailblazer295 said:


> Franks Aquarium in markham, was in there the other day for Prime picked up some food while I was there.


I might have to visit them today. I need a heater anyways

Do you know what time they open till on friday?


----------



## trailblazer295

He has heaters, I'll be going by today myself pick up an air pump.


----------



## trailblazer295

Picked up a tetra whisper 10 today see how well it works. Have it hooked up on my tempoary pond for my goldies until the outdoor one is ready to go. I don't think my check valve is working to well and on the 30g I won't be able to mount it above the water line. Where do you buy check valves? This is my second one the first wouldn't let ANY air through with me blowing on it.


----------



## AquariAM

Where are you getting these defective air products? Air pumps are the most fool proof thing in the world. Pump> airline > checkvalve > airline > airstone.

It's never failed me once.








(I have a blue one AND a green one ) these cheap penn plax valves work. They have them at ever aquarium store ever everywhere. It isn't actually a valve per say it's a little plastic disc that gets pushed one way with positive pressure and pressed back up against the wall of the 'valve' by opposite pressure... but it's design is so [email protected] that it's hard to say it's actually a valve, know what I mean? The little door just flops around in the air. Regardless it works. I'm just saying it'd be nice to see a slightly higher quality tier of air pump product again they all seem to be so low quality now compared with what you could get even five years ago.


----------



## trailblazer295

The rena pump was from BA and both valves were from petsmart topfin was the first one that didn't work. Don't remember the second one now we will see how well it works. For the time being I have the pump above the waterline in the rubbermaid.


----------



## Fish_Man

it doesnt necessarily have to be above the waterline. Mine is beside the bottom of my tank, just make sure to make a drip loop on the air tube so water doesn't get into the pump.


----------



## trailblazer295

Good to know I don't have much faith in the check valve these days it will be good to know when I hook it up on the 30g.


----------



## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> Good to know I don't have much faith in the check valve these days it will be good to know when I hook it up on the 30g.


15 airpumps later never a problem except loudness


----------



## trailblazer295

Ya I won't likely use the check valve now, I had my pump hooked up to a length of tubing+valve+tube+air stone not a bubble. I take the long tubing and valve off and use the short length of tubing and airstone and bubbles. I'll settle the rest later but so far it seems ok.


----------



## AquariAM

trailblazer295 said:


> Ya I won't likely use the check valve now, I had my pump hooked up to a length of tubing+valve+tube+air stone not a bubble. I take the long tubing and valve off and use the short length of tubing and airstone and bubbles. I'll settle the rest later but so far it seems ok.


Your pump has a weak diaphragm its defective


----------



## trailblazer295

Maybe the valve isn't great or there is a whole in the tubing. Or I just have such terrible luck I can't purchase one piece of functioning air products :S


----------



## Fish_Man

trailblazer295 said:


> Picked up a tetra whisper 10 today see how well it works. Have it hooked up on my tempoary pond for my goldies until the outdoor one is ready to go. I don't think my check valve is working to well and on the 30g I won't be able to mount it above the water line. Where do you buy check valves? This is my second one the first wouldn't let ANY air through with me blowing on it.


Hey Trailblazer, how much did the tetra whisper 10 cost you?


----------



## trailblazer295

I think it was normally $17 something but everything is 50% off for the month of april.


----------



## Fish_Man

trailblazer295 said:


> I think it was normally $17 something but everything is 50% off for the month of april.


nice so you got it for 8.50?

how's it doing so far?


----------



## trailblazer295

So far so good I have it running on temp pond for my goldies. Pretty quiet over all, haven't hookup a check valve yet just a short length of tubing and an airstone.


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## Fish_Man

trailblazer295 said:


> So far so good I have it running on temp pond for my goldies. Pretty quiet over all, haven't hookup a check valve yet just a short length of tubing and an airstone.


Good stuff, I still have to goto Frank's forgot to stop by the other day I was there.


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