# Substrate - what's your favourite for planted tanks?



## Bayinaung

I'm getting back into the hobby after a few years' hiatus. I am looking for substrate ideas for a high tech planted tank. Key here being easily available, i.e. no shipping from the US. I've used peat bricks in the past with success. I've heard of mineralized soil being very effective though hard to do unless it's summer. I've spent over $$$ on laterite in the past, it was decent results but found peat bricks under gravel gave more vibrant plants. Then there's the kitty litter - the simple type. Some have used this to great success - walmart cheap kitty litter? What are your experiences with different types of substrate?
http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/substrate/55280-have-kitty-litter-substrate-i-do.html


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## FlyingHellFish

I have both Flourite Red and Flourite Black and they are great! Some people do the MTS with a cap but I heard that is messy if you're replanting, rescaping. 

Eco-complete is another great option, thought not all the grain size is the same. I seen bags with bigger ones and bags with smaller sizes with a ton of water.

You can't go wrong with Flourite Black, that stuff looks gorgeous and it won't turn into mush or compact either.


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## df001

I have netlea brown, im really happy with it, its not as light as the eco complete, the particle size is fairly uniform unlike the eco complete. I cant remember the price per bag but it wasnt too bad.

It required frequent waterchanges for the first two weeks as the ammonia leeched out, but not sure it would be an issue if you didn't have livestock, ie a clean start rather than adding to an existing tank...

It holds slopes nicely, is easy to plant in. It did drop the ph about half a point.

I think it looks great. So I'd recommend it.


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## Bayinaung

FlyingHellFish said:


> I have both Flourite Red and Flourite Black and they are great! Some people do the MTS with a cap but I heard that is messy if you're replanting, rescaping.


Yeah I bought tons of bags of this stuff before, ordered from an online shop in london I think. It worked good and as I recall they didn't have it in black back then so this is an interesting option.



df001 said:


> I have netlea brown, im really happy with it, its not as light as the eco complete, the particle size is fairly uniform unlike the eco complete..


 Where can I get netlea brown in GTA?


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## df001

I am pretty sure AI has it, (90%) and 100% that aquatic kingdom in mississauga on dundas sells it (where i got mine).


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## mrobson

FlyingHellFish said:


> I have both Flourite Red and Flourite Black and they are great! Some people do the MTS with a cap but I heard that is messy if you're replanting, rescaping.
> 
> Eco-complete is another great option, thought not all the grain size is the same. I seen bags with bigger ones and bags with smaller sizes with a ton of water.
> 
> You can't go wrong with Flourite Black, that stuff looks gorgeous and it won't turn into mush or compact either.


ive used both in my tanks and i would agree the black looks awesome, i would recommend it to anyone the red isnt bad either just doesnt look as sexy. I use the black in my cherry tanks and the contrast makes the red really pop and helps to makes them darker.


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## Bayinaung

mrobson said:


> ive used both in my tanks and i would agree the black looks awesome, i would recommend it to anyone the red isnt bad either just doesnt look as sexy. I use the black in my cherry tanks and the contrast makes the red really pop and helps to makes them darker.


Yeah bet they do. I would have used them for my rummy nose, cardinal tetra tank or even for the discus tank when I kept them back then. I can see how amazing that would be.


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## Bayinaung

df001 said:


> I am pretty sure AI has it, (90%) and 100% that aquatic kingdom in mississauga on dundas sells it (where i got mine).


Thanks I'll have to look into that. Glad we have it locally.


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## Greg_o

here's another vote for netlea - awesome stuff.


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## solarz

I'm currently setting up a new tank with Mineralized Top Soil topped by a thick layer of Tahitian Moon Sand. I love the look of the moon sand, and sand gives a more uniform and natural looking texture.


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## Fishyfishyfishy

I like potting soil and gravel. Kept fish for many years and found this is the cheapest and effective way. But do lots of research before you use soil


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## Kan

For those who used both Flourite black and eco-complete which would you recommend? From my reading they are pretty even in terms of ability to absorb nutrition to make it available for plant root. The difference is eco-complete you don't need to spend hours cleaning it. Is that pretty much the difference? Trying to find if spending 10 dollars more on eco-complete is really worth it. How do they compare in terms of looks? I see people usually mention ugliness of flourite black as downside, do they really look bad compared to eco-complete?


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## vrb th hrb

I just swapped out all the gravel in my 46 gallon for eco-complete. And tonite im going to be topping the eco-complete with tahitian moon sand. 

If you're putting the eco-complete into an already established/cycled tank then drain out all the liquid in the bag and add it in parts, like 1/3 of the bag at a time or you might force the tank to cycle again and will end up with a few hours of cloudy water The bags of eco-complete I wouldnt define as "pretty" hence why im topping with the moon sand. My plants, especially my swords, are taking off like crazy


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## shadow_cruiser

This should help you out a bunch
http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/substrate/153412-substrate-choices-pros-cons.html


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## Kan

Great link. For those who have seen both close up in planted tank how do they compare in terms of looks are they both deep black color? what does the Texture look like? There are also few things I read that are not mentioned in that post. I read Flourite black pieces are sharper so they are kind of dangerous for bottom feeders like cory cat. Also I think eco-complete is suppose to come with some kind of beneficial bacteria and that's why there's some water in the bag? 

Is there any particular reason why dumping eco-complete at once will force it to recycle? Do they release large amount of ammonia?


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## solarz

Kan said:


> Great link. For those who have seen both close up in planted tank how do they compare in terms of looks are they both deep black color? what does the Texture look like? There are also few things I read that are not mentioned in that post. I read Flourite black pieces are sharper so they are kind of dangerous for bottom feeders like cory cat. Also I think eco-complete is suppose to come with some kind of beneficial bacteria and that's why there's some water in the bag?
> 
> Is there any particular reason why dumping eco-complete at once will force it to recycle? Do they release large amount of ammonia?


I don't know why people think you can put living bacteria in a bottle/bag, leave it at room temperature for months, and still expect the bacteria to be alive at the end.

I'd say one of the reasons eco-complete would release ammonia is all the dead bacteria it has in the water.


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## Bayinaung

Helpful link shadow. didn't realize miracle grow organic was usable in an aquarium. Definitely worth trying for outdoor water gardens in the summer. Schultz aquatic soil! I used that once and as I recall it did ok. Anyone else tried this?


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## Kan

I have used Schultz soil for emersed HC growing operation. I used micracle grow and Schultz side by side to compare performance. HC did not grow very well in micracle grow for some reason, it kept turning yellow while HC in Schultz soil did great. The problem though is that I don't think Schultz soil is aquarium safe since it's not "Organic", but it's great soil for growing plant emersed.


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## shadow_cruiser

My next build (75 gallon) is going to be Miracle Grow (bottom layer), Blasting Sand (middle layer), Eco-Complete (top layer).

A lot of people hate soil, including myself but if capped properly, it will be one of the best and most affordable substrates you can use (in my opinion). You just have to do it right from the beginning.

Aquasoil/Netlea is my favourite but it's far too expensive for anything over 20 gallons.

It all depends on what you want to do with the aquarium, what you will be growing and what look you are trying to achieve.


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## ubr0ke

ada aqua soil is by far the best..no comparison is close to equal.

but plants will grow in anything as long as ferts are added.


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## Fish on the Mind

where can you buy eco-complete from?


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## Kan

Eco-complete can be purchased from Big'Al for around $35 a bag. I bought mine last week at Scarborough location.


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## Fish on the Mind

Kan said:


> Eco-complete can be purchased from Big'Al for around $35 a bag. I bought mine last week at Scarborough location.


how many pounds in a bag? 10?


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## Kan

Each bag is 20lb, just enough for 10 gallon.


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## Octavian

Kan said:


> Eco-complete can be purchased from Big'Al for around $35 a bag. I bought mine last week at Scarborough location.


Mops in Hamilton sells it for $26.70 a bag.


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## george

I used eco-complete and netlea. I found netlea to be better.


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## Mlevi

Hi,

Just a quick question for those that have experience using organic potting soil as a substrate. Does it have any effect on Ph? other water parameters? I've seen clips on youtube where some mix organic potting soil with red potter's clay (for the iron content, I suppose). Just curious to know if it needs extra monitoring for livestock in the tank.

Thank you kindly....


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## coldmantis

Mlevi said:


> Hi,
> 
> Just a quick question for those that have experience using organic potting soil as a substrate. Does it have any effect on Ph? other water parameters? I've seen clips on youtube where some mix organic potting soil with red potter's clay (for the iron content, I suppose). Just curious to know if it needs extra monitoring for livestock in the tank.
> 
> Thank you kindly....


This tank has a base of organic potting soil, if you thinking about it prepare to wait a while for it to completely cycle, it takes longer because the water will turn yellow for about a month. So many water changes are needed, try not to dose any extra fertz while your using the soil base because of algae issues. But once it's finished cycling about 4-6months then your good to go with any livestock you wish. If you want to lower the PH you can put peat moss on the bottom before you put in the organic soil. Peat will probably lower your Ph to around 7 or so.

http://www.gtaaquaria.com/forum/showthread.php?t=32742


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## Mlevi

Thanks for your speedy response, mantis.


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## Fish on the Mind

You could also add in some limestone rock to lower the ph right?


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## coldmantis

Fish on the Mind said:


> You could also add in some limestone rock to lower the ph right?


"Limestone is calcareous, and is known for its ability to both harden the water and increase the pH"


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## Fish on the Mind

Ah that's right. I had the ph scale backwards in my head lol you are correct


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## itsmesiva

*aquatic soil as substrate*

i do have an out door pond (3000gal.) and i have many potted water lillies in it and a mid section with aqua soil base. I have both comet and fancy gold fish it and thrives well. Wonderring if i could use the same soil as substrate for a planted tank i am about to start? do i have to cap it with gravel or any other substrate? Tank is 55Gal and will cost me a fortune if i go with commonly used planted aquarium substrates. I guess if i use the aqua soil only it will be impossible to vaccume while doing water cahnge. Any advise will be appreciated.

thanks


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## Bayinaung

*Using mineralized soil in a planted tank*

I wanted to update you guys on my little experiment.

So it's almost 9 months since I posted this thead. I decided to go with Flourite as the main substrate for a 35 gallon "growing tank" with a plan to build a show tank at some point.

It's a 35 gallon tank, with a minimal of plant matter: varigated amazons, Anubias nana, and nymphea rubras. I did want to experiment with the mineralized top soil. What I realized was I had this - I had a waterplant container pot with water garden soil that's been without a plant for a few years now, which was topped up by flourite to keep the soil from kicking up. I went to check it out, and sure enough it was mineralized - completely dried out and crumbly like no soil I'd ever seen. I put a layer of it in half of my tank covered by more flourite. I planted the amazons in there.

Next: the rubras I planted them directly in an aquarium soil mixed with clay in a pot and sat it in the the tank. I then put a T5 system I had for this tank as the lighting on it, and put the tank in a sunny window, as I did not care about algae and I wanted these plants to have as much sunlight as possible in the winter.

The Anubias Nana. I also put it into a pot with soil and put the whole pot in the tank.

The tank was set up in the fall. It's been a plant only tank, no fish. I didn't use any CO2 injection, though I had bought all the equipment for it. Reason: I was going to be travelling for a few months. I put the lid on, put the timers on (12 hours, 8am to 8 pm to max out and suppliment sunlight). I went away, came back, and to my amazement, the plants are flourishing. Algae growth was minimal, and quite tolerable in fact. Rubras had some surface leaves emerge while I was away and that may have had some impact in containing algae, though by not much. It's amazing when you have the right plant load, even in bright sun, what it does or doesn't do for algae.

When filling the tank I pour the water directly into the tank. Sometimes it would hit the soil portions and dirt would get kicked up but it soon settles down quite fast and the water is quite clear again. So use mineralized soil without fear guys! start up a batch this spring for use in the fall! You'll love the results.


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