# Rain water filtered for fish tank?



## Questionz (Sep 13, 2010)

I'm very interested in starting a fish tank system that is self-sustaining, and have been interested for a while now. i don't want to miss anything, so at the moment i'm making sure i have everything and that it works before i try it out.

the first step is that i want to use rainwater to eventually be the source for the fish tank. Granted, rain water is not good for fish tank due to its toxicity (being more acidic due to the atmosphere, etc), and i was thinking of using that rain water to water plants. from there, the water would pass through the soil, through a layer of sand/rocks/both, and run through a tube into a buffer (basically a container to store the filtered water) where it will (maybe go through another plant filtration process), enter another buffer(same thing) and then enter the fish tank.

the problem is, i don't know how long that water needs to be in the soil before it is conditioned to be good water for the fish (normally when i pour water into the soil, it would take less than a minute before it reaches the bottom and seep out. i'm planning on using that water..
i also don't know if those enhanced soil will be a factor for fish water, since the rainwater will be running through the "enhanced soil"
i also don't know what soil is fine (should i just dig up the soil in the back yard and use that? then the plants might not get enough nutrients


my first fish will be guppies, and i'll move on from there. right now i want to make sure this works.


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## TBemba (Jan 11, 2010)

You can just dump rain water straight into your tank nothing else is required.

I collect it in rain barrels from my eve troughs and put it directly into my tank.


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## Questionz (Sep 13, 2010)

but isn't the acidity of the water bad for the guppies? i mean i read somewhere where fish are tolerable between 6.6-7pH, but if the rainwater is around 4-6pH, isn't that bad?

would this also be bad for baby guppies? although i will most likely use distilled water instead of rain water for baby guppies, i'd like to know if rain water is ok. thanks!


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

Apparently God uses untreated rain water to do the water changes for his fish, and it seems to have been working pretty good for the last few millennia...

I like your natural filter idea though... using natural media for filtration- you could just make it a complete cycle, where an overflow on the tank feeds the garden (don't know if you plan to have it indoor or outdoor), and then the filtered water through the soil is pumped back into the tank, and topped up using collected rainwater? Sounds cool. I bet somebody's tried it already, just look around on Google and that...


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## Questionz (Sep 13, 2010)

thanks! well since i live downtown toronto, its kind of hard to have a backyard dedicated to this (although that is my ultimate goal). 

Right now, im planning on having it indoors, so i can make sure everything works before i convert it to outdoors (my ultimate goal is to have this self-sustaining system outside, but due to the winter effects, i'm not so sure). 

I don't think i can make the system "overflow" because then the guppies may flow out as well lol. I have considered a process where i extract the water from the tank and filter it through the plants, but the idea is still premature and is forming in my head . my plan is to use solar power to rotate a waterwheel that would transfer the water up, run through a trough filled with tiny rocks to act as a filter and then into the plants. but again, its still a premature thought


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

Why bother filtering the water before it goes from the aquarium to the plants? All that crap is yummy treats for the plants, om nom nom...

BTW, if you need solar panels and related equipment, go see Phil and Sean at BatteryExperts in Pickering. Best prices I've seen anywhere, even on the internetz.


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## Questionz (Sep 13, 2010)

50seven said:


> Why bother filtering the water before it goes from the aquarium to the plants? All that crap is yummy treats for the plants, om nom nom...
> 
> BTW, if you need solar panels and related equipment, go see Phil and Sean at BatteryExperts in Pickering. Best prices I've seen anywhere, even on the internetz.


i'm just worried about the acidity level of the rain water.. if its between 4-6 pH, its definitely bad for the fishes, not to mention the plants :S


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## TBemba (Jan 11, 2010)

Questionz said:


> i'm just worried about the acidity level of the rain water.. if its between 4-6 pH, its definitely bad for the fishes, not to mention the plants :S


Do you know what the PH is in the wild for guppies?

I would sooner put a fish in rainwater than straight from the tap water. I would bet my money on the rainwater one surviving the night. 

Rainwater triggers most SA cichlids into breeding.


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## Questionz (Sep 13, 2010)

TBemba said:


> Do you know what the PH is in the wild for guppies?
> 
> I would sooner put a fish in rainwater than straight from the tap water. I would bet my money on the rainwater one surviving the night.
> 
> Rainwater triggers most SA cichlids into breeding.


i agree with you that straight from tap water IS BAD. but what i have done in the past is sit tap water for 24 hours before adding it into the tank, and this way the guppies are fine.
I actually don't know the pH of water for wild guppies. is it around 4-6pH?

i'm fairly new to the aquaria society, so if there are specific words that for sure i won't know, please elaborate. thanks


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## Darkblade48 (Jan 28, 2008)

TBemba said:


> Do you know what the PH is in the wild for guppies?


I think this question is moot. Guppies have been so carefully selected bred in captivity now, that they are likely adjusted to a wide range of pH.



Questionz said:


> I actually don't know the pH of water for wild guppies. is it around 4-6pH?


I do not think it is possible to achieve a pH of 4 "naturally" in an aquarium without using any kind of additives. In nature, I do not think you will find a body of water that has such a low pH (with fish in it) either.


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## BillD (Jun 5, 2006)

Has anyone tested the pH of rainwater lately? The last time I did, was when one of the kids was doing a project for school. Using my pool pH kit, the pH was in excess of 7, around 7.4 if I remember. I recall being rather surprised and checking it several times.


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## Questionz (Sep 13, 2010)

BillD said:


> Has anyone tested the pH of rainwater lately? The last time I did, was when one of the kids was doing a project for school. Using my pool pH kit, the pH was in excess of 7, around 7.4 if I remember. I recall being rather surprised and checking it several times.


awesome to hear. ill have to buy a pH kit as well to test it when i start to use rain water. thanks


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## BillD (Jun 5, 2006)

If it rains today I may try to check it.


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## bob123 (Dec 31, 2009)

The ph for my rain water today as it is raining now is 7.1 guppies can stand a ph of 6 to 7.8. Do not use soil from the backyard for a filter or any thing else related to an aquarium as there is more contaminents in that soil. If you want to use soil as a filter buy a sterilized potting soil from a nursery but make sure there is no fertilizer added. Guppies are more sensitive to poor quality of water I find that I need to change water (30%) once or twice a week. Distilled water is not such a good thing as the minerals have been removed I just use 50% water from the adult tank and 50% Ro water in my fry tanks.
Good luck.


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## bae (May 11, 2007)

Straight rainwater is like straight RO -- absence of minerals is bad for fish and plants, too. Rainwater, like RO, has no stability -- the pH will vary all over the map, which is far worse for the fish than even a constant but unsuitable pH. Your idea of filtering the water through soil is a recipe for a swamp -- foul smelling, anaerobic and toxic. You can't simulate the whole hydrologic cycle in a few gallons of water, or even in a few thousand.

Use Toronto tap water, which comes from Lake Ontario, which supports fish well. Use a dechlorinator to neutralize the chloramine. This is more ecological and cost-effective than melting snow. Having collected snow in downtown Toronto, melted it and poured it through a coffee filter, I can tell you that there's all kinds of particulate crud in it. I'd guess that the black bits are powdered car tires. It takes a surprising amount of fuel to melt an awful lot of snow to get a few gallons of water.

Most livebearers prefer water on the hard side. If they come from Florida (as many do) they have been raised in the very hard water found there.

You have some interesting ideas, but a lot of natural processes don't scale down very well. Better to learn to maintain the tiny ecosystem of an aquarium by more conventional methods first, then adapt your new knowledge to simulating a natural ecosystem.


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## BillD (Jun 5, 2006)

I just checked the ph of todays rain,and found it to be acidic although I can't tell exactly what. It may be below the range of my kit.


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## Chris S (Dec 19, 2007)

Rainwater today where I am is 6.83, using a hanna digital pH monitor. Using good ol' chemical vials, it showed neutral (7).

As for these specifics in pH levels for guppies - I really don't think it applies. Keep them in anything from 6-8, do water changes, filter your water properly and they will be fine.

Rainwater is fine - I just imagine winter time will suck.

Also, using RO water for your tank isn't really bad, as there is so much biological gunk in an established tank that pH swings and crashes are not really a concern if you are just doing regular 20-50% water changes weekly.

I've been battling the rise of conductivity in my tanks, as I have been trying to keep it <30 for a few breeders and have been doing 20% water changes daily with unconstituted RO water. pH has stayed a constant 6.5 (lower in some cases where necessary) or so (with a kH of nearly 0!) and of course, the mS is ever growing....

@Darkblade: Some SA fish have been collected in various biotopes with > 5 pH. Other types have only been successfully bred in extremely acid conditions, 4.5-4.8.


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