# Do i need CO2 injection to grow a carpet?



## Patrick K (Sep 10, 2013)

im wondering if i need pressurized co2 system to grow carpet plants... currently looking into growing dwarf baby tears. i have a 30" tho ligthing fixture with one 24w 6000k bulb and one 24w roseate bulb setup over a 29 gal tank. what could be some alternate ways of dosing co2? liquid, yeast, pressurized. i am aware pressurized is the best but does cost a lot. what do you guys think?


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## TorontoPlantMan (Aug 16, 2013)

i have a tank simaliar to yours and also have a 30" t5ho fixture and have a hard time growing carpet plants, even in my 10 gallon which has high light and DIY co2 my DHG never grew fast enough. If you want a lush carpet like you see some guys have on here, you'll notice one thing in common with all of them, their all using pressurized CO2. I'm sure you might be able to get away with some excel dosing but remind you that can become costly overtime.


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## lovevc (Nov 24, 2010)

no u dont need co2 to make hc cuba carpet, just give it enough light, it will eventually grow, but take at least twice amount of time without co2

u should invest for a good light fixture first. light > co2


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## TorontoPlantMan (Aug 16, 2013)

lovevc said:


> no u dont need co2 to make hc cuba carpet, just give it enough light, it will eventually grow, but take at least twice amount of time without co2
> 
> u should invest for a good light fixture first. light > co2


Gonna have to disagree with you, in order to make a full on carpet you're going to need CO2. It's not going to grow fast enough regardless of what kind of light you use. High light + no CO2 = algae. Like I said, if you want a dense lush carpet. You need CO2.

Check out "FlyingHellFish" and their ADA 60p. It has a beautiful HC carpet, grown with CO2 and high light (23 watt 6500k CFL's). If that's the kind of carpet you're going for, definitely going to need CO2.

http://www.gtaaquaria.com/forum/showthread.php?t=46873


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## Patrick K (Sep 10, 2013)

TorontoPlantMan said:


> Gonna have to disagree with you, in order to make a full on carpet you're going to need CO2. It's not going to grow fast enough regardless of what kind of light you use. High light + no CO2 = algae. Like I said, if you want a dense lush carpet. You need CO2.
> 
> Check out "FlyingHellFish" and their ADA 60p. It has a beautiful HC carpet, grown with CO2 and high light (23 watt 6500k CFL's). If that's the kind of carpet you're going for, definitely going to need CO2.
> 
> http://www.gtaaquaria.com/forum/showthread.php?t=46873


so what would be the cheapest way to does with co2 that would give a nice carpet?


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## TorontoPlantMan (Aug 16, 2013)

Patrick K said:


> so what would be the cheapest way to does with co2 that would give a nice carpet?


To be honest there is really no cheap way with going about it. I'm in the same dilemma now because I as well want to run pressurized CO2 but don't have $300 for all new equipment. It's much better to just save your money and get a full setup rather then some paintball setup or DIY. Just keep your eyes open on the for sale threads and start saving. You'll be much happier with a 5lb or 10lb and good regulator and equipment rather than a paintball can you need to get refilled often.


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## coldmantis (Apr 5, 2010)

Nothing wrong with going paintball co2 for a 29g, should last you around 3-4 months between refills. If you decide to go full size pressurized that would be more ideal, however If you have a full time job and work 9-5 how are you going to refill the tank? Almost all places that refill full size co2 only open from 9-5 Monday to Friday. Paintball arenas open 7 days a week and don't close until midnight. I have built over 10+ paintball co2, since I decided to go pressurized, but have now gone to only three co2 setup, two consisting of 2 20lb, one split to three tanks and other other to two tanks. The final setup is paintball to only one tank.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4


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## Patrick K (Sep 10, 2013)

coldmantis said:


> Nothing wrong with going paintball co2 for a 29g, should last you around 3-4 months between refills. If you decide to go full size pressurized that would be more ideal, however If you have a full time job and work 9-5 how are you going to refill the tank? Almost all places that refill full size co2 only open from 9-5 Monday to Friday. Paintball arenas open 7 days a week and don't close until midnight. I have built over 10+ paintball co2, since I decided to go pressurized, but have now gone to only three co2 setup, two consisting of 2 20lb, one split to three tanks and other other to two tanks. The final setup is paintball to only one tank.
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4


okay sounds good. i might go with the paintball setup for now cause of my budget. what regulator do you use for the paintball tank? how are your paintball co2 systems set up? would really appreciate if you let me know because im most likely going to set one up


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## coldmantis (Apr 5, 2010)

here are two good threads you should read that I took part in years ago.

http://gtaaquaria.com/forum/showthread.php?t=19445&highlight=jacpac

http://gtaaquaria.com/forum/showthread.php?t=31166&highlight=jacpac


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## Patrick K (Sep 10, 2013)

would this work as part of my setup? i posted a pick below


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## coldmantis (Apr 5, 2010)

Patrick K said:


> would this work as part of my setup? i posted a pick below


Perfect, you just have to remove the plastic casing, the quick disconnect. What fittings you need next will depend on your needle valve size. I believe ai sells dici needle vavles that already 1/4" which is what the thread is on the jacpac but I'm not sure if the needle vavle is male or female thread so you have to hit up home depot and figure out what fittings to buy. If you plan on adding a solenoid that's more fitting conversions to think about. The jacpac is actually a really good regulator, very well built and has a bleed hole built in so you won't get end if tank dump


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## Patrick K (Sep 10, 2013)

why is pressurized so much better then yeast? cant i just run a diy yeast setup in my 30 gal?


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## GAT (Oct 8, 2011)

CO2 is not very consistent with yeast setup. With pressurized setupyou have more control over the the amount of CO2 you can add. I run DIY CO2 and see that first two weeks i get constant bubbles and then it goes down. Its not really ideal if you have big tank but DIY CO2 is okay for 30 gallon or small. I would go for real setup for bigger tank, cost is around @200 -250 bucks.


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## Patrick K (Sep 10, 2013)

GAT said:


> CO2 is not very consistent with yeast setup.


what if i got something like this http://www.ebay.com/itm/Latest-Version-Complete-DIY-CO2-System-Kit-Planted-Marine-Aquarium-Check-Valve-/151103715427 it has a control needle and i would get a bubble counter...


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## coldmantis (Apr 5, 2010)

Patrick K said:


> what if i got something like this http://www.ebay.com/itm/Latest-Version-Complete-DIY-CO2-System-Kit-Planted-Marine-Aquarium-Check-Valve-/151103715427 it has a control needle and i would get a bubble counter...


that's just a fancy looking diy yeast+sugar and I won't trust restricting bubble rate on a plastic coke bottle, what if the pressure builts up so much it explodes. It will scare you, your gf, your wife, your kids, your dog, your cat, your neighbours and also the fish. Then there is the cleanup part... if that happens

Do you really want to do dirt cheap I mean cheap. DON'T FORGET YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR.

20oz co2 $30
ebay for asa adapter try to find one with 2 holes and one of them already has a pressure guage on it $8
watts a41 needle valve home depot $3?
tubing from Home depot the one that says not for ice makers $3?
bubble counter made from a drink bottle $free?
Diffuser, Jammed a cigarette filter in the end of the tube $free?

so about $44

I built this one long ago


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## Patrick K (Sep 10, 2013)

coldmantis said:


> that's just a fancy looking diy yeast+sugar and I won't trust restricting bubble rate on a plastic coke bottle, what if the pressure builts up so much it explodes. It will scare you, your gf, your wife, your kids, your dog, your cat, your neighbours and also the fish. Then there is the cleanup part... if that happens
> 
> Do you really want to do dirt cheap I mean cheap. DON'T FORGET YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR.
> 
> ...


is the gauge necessary? i found this http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Low-profile-CO2-ASA-Adapter-Fill-Station-Remote-On-Off-/111177905574


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## coldmantis (Apr 5, 2010)

Patrick K said:


> is the gauge necessary? i found this http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Low-profile-CO2-ASA-Adapter-Fill-Station-Remote-On-Off-/111177905574


Well no but the price difference from one hole no gauge to two holes with gauge is about $1 is your budget that low? And the purpose of the gauge is so you know when your co2

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4


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## Patrick K (Sep 10, 2013)

coldmantis said:


> Well no but the price difference from one hole no gauge to two holes with gauge is about $1 is your budget that low? And the purpose of the gauge is so you know when your co2
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4


i cant find one for a good price with gauge and 2 hole... found one that 15$ plus 15$ shipping. do you need a 2 hole tho? i found one with a gauge but only one hole


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## coldmantis (Apr 5, 2010)

What are you ebaying? EBay for asa adapter look for the 8 dollar one with a gauge

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4


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## Patrick K (Sep 10, 2013)

coldmantis said:


> What are you ebaying? EBay for asa adapter look for the 8 dollar one with a gauge
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4


okay thanks!


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## Patrick K (Sep 10, 2013)

if i buy a cheap needle valve for 5 bucks will that be good enough? heard that i need one for 800 psi plus to not get any air leaks ...


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## coldmantis (Apr 5, 2010)

Patrick K said:


> if i buy a cheap needle valve for 5 bucks will that be good enough? heard that i need one for 800 psi plus to not get any air leaks ...


of course it won't be good enough, it's not that air leaks.It's the rated psi of the needle valve vs. the 850psi of the tank. for example watts a41 is rated for about 450psi. It might be inconsistant as in today you set it for 1bps but tomorrow it might be 2bps or 1 bubble every 2 seconds etc... There is no really any way to get what you want for the price you want to pay. a decent regulator with needle valve solenoid etc.. should cost you at least $100 not including the tank.

why dont' you get this, I don't hear great things about it though but it's in your budget
http://www.aquainspiration.com/nproductdetail.asp?PIN=CO&PNAME=DC&PSIZE=XSB&PTYPE=Regulator%20Cylinder you would just need a paintball thread adapter so you can use it on a paintball tank, which is usually about 25 bucks. Like I said you get what you pay for so it's up to you if you want the headache or be a little broke but headache free.


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## Patrick K (Sep 10, 2013)

what do you guys think about this regulator? will it give me steady bubble count and will it be good for a 30 gal? http://www.ebay.ca/itm/NEW-AQUATEK-CO2-Regulator-Mini-with-Integrated-COOL-TOUCH-Solenoid-/230840227751?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35bf2657a7&_uhb=1


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## coldmantis (Apr 5, 2010)

Patrick K said:


> what do you guys think about this regulator? will it give me steady bubble count and will it be good for a 30 gal? http://www.ebay.ca/itm/NEW-AQUATEK-...LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35bf2657a7&_uhb=1


Aquatek is quite popular, lots of people like it. I have their regulator for full size tank. I personally think is absolute garbage and I can build a better one with princess auto parts for about the same price but that's my opinion only, even the Milwaukee regulator that a lot of people hate and bash is better then this unit and you can get the milwalkee locally or order it from jlaquatics for lower price then what you will pay at bigals

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4


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## Patrick K (Sep 10, 2013)

coldmantis said:


> Aquatek is quite popular, lots of people like it. I have their regulator for full size tank. I personally think is absolute garbage and I can build a better one with princess auto parts for about the same price but that's my opinion only, even the Milwaukee regulator that a lot of people hate and bash is better then this unit and you can get the milwalkee locally or order it from jlaquatics for lower price then what you will pay at bigals
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4


im so confused... i have no clue what to go with now... i want to get the aquatech but dont want to run into troubles but also dont want to spend a lot of money on a expensive reg


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## coldmantis (Apr 5, 2010)

You can still try the aquatek, maybe I got a defective one and you will be more lucky. I will explain my issue with my unit, the right gauge delivery pressure? The one that controls how much psi is going to your needle valve constantly jumps all the time every time. So its very time consuming to find the right psi to run it at so that when the pressure goes down my bubble rate is not effected. Its harder for me because I need it to be constant to the 10miliseconds. I spoke to aquatek and they offered to replaced the unit but I have to eat the cost of shipping it to California which is around $30 which I won't do. The regulator does work its just no where near perfect to my standards. Don't get confused though I'm not adjusting the regulator or the needle valve constantly every day. As soon as I find the one settings I can leave it alone and never touch it again until I have to take the regulator off for refills.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4


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## Patrick K (Sep 10, 2013)

coldmantis said:


> You can still try the aquatek, maybe I got a defective one and you will be more lucky. I will explain my issue with my unit, the right gauge delivery pressure? The one that controls how much psi is going to your needle valve constantly jumps all the time every time. So its very time consuming to find the right psi to run it at so that when the pressure goes down my bubble rate is not effected. Its harder for me because I need it to be constant to the 10miliseconds. I spoke to aquatek and they offered to replaced the unit but I have to eat the cost of shipping it to California which is around $30 which I won't do. The regulator does work its just no where near perfect to my standards. Don't get confused though I'm not adjusting the regulator or the needle valve constantly every day. As soon as I find the one settings I can leave it alone and never touch it again until I have to take the regulator off for refills.
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4


i want to go with the aquatech... so there arnt any major problems? this is my first co2 reg so im not expecting something really high tech but do want something that will give me decent results


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## coldmantis (Apr 5, 2010)

Patrick K said:


> i want to go with the aquatech... so there arnt any major problems? this is my first co2 reg so im not expecting something really high tech but do want something that will give me decent results


If you heart is settled for aquatek then go for it

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## Sameer (Sep 30, 2007)

Ive grown HC with my eyes closed with DIY co2. I had med to high light (T8s), I dosed those bottled nutrients and 2 bottles of ciy co2 at all times. They perled like crazy in my 45 gal. Do note though, diy is very very very annoying and will cost you more than a proper co2 setup overtime.


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## cape (Jun 18, 2010)

Can't you do DYI CO2 until the carpet fills in then stop using co2? Or will the plants be used to it that when you stop, they melt?


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## Kimchi24 (Mar 22, 2013)

they will melt once there is no more co2 given to them


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## coldmantis (Apr 5, 2010)

cape said:


> Can't you do DYI CO2 until the carpet fills in then stop using co2? Or will the plants be used to it that when you stop, they melt?


those are perfect conditions for algae to take over.


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## cape (Jun 18, 2010)

So once you start CO2 there is really no way to stop unless you don't mind algae bloom or plant melt? Also, how come it would cause an algae takeover? Sorry for all the questions but am trying to learn as much as I can to try and avoid any major mistakes.


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## coldmantis (Apr 5, 2010)

when plants grow fast it sucks up all the nurtrients in the water so that algae has nothing to use to bloom. So when adding co2 it makes plants grow fast so that there is no chance for algae to grow. However when it comes to HC cuba, it grows slow even with co2 so the chances of you getting algae eventually on your cuba is most likely unavoidable.


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