# Barebottom disadvantages? and cheap sand



## MichaelAngelo (Jul 6, 2009)

I'm attracted to the extreme cleanliness of a bare bottom set-up. Especially with large messy fish I almost think it's essential... or sand...

Gravel: I'm definitely finished with gravel and am totally refusing to put it in any more tanks, that stuff is nasty!!!

Sand: much better, doesn't trap crud like gravel does. Also looks a lot more professional. *Any sources for a nice, cheap sand? (not boring playsand, right?)*

What are the disadvantages of bare-bottom. I heard the reflection off the bottom is bad for fish (arowana droop eye and orientation) but there actually isn't a reflection from the fish's view within the water.


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## Riceburner (Mar 14, 2008)

Does painting the bottom help? The most common sand I seem to read about is pool filter sand....after playsand.


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## Hitch (Apr 26, 2009)

Cant comment about sand, since all I have used is super fine sand. Which looks nice, but it takes constant cleaning to keep it looking clean.

As for barebottom, Just put someing under the tank or paint of the bottom of the tank and it would fine. I am not too worried about the reflection, but Its to solve the "Im hanging in mid air feeling" for the fish.

If you have bottom feeders, one possible problem is that the fish would need to constantly chase the food to eat it, since there is nothing for the food to get stuck on. But personally dont think its a problem unless you have super high current in the tank. 

But for most people, the problem for barebottom tanks are its aesthetics, personally I cant stand the look of a barebottom, but I think you got this problem solved.


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## MichaelAngelo (Jul 6, 2009)

Riceburner said:


> Does painting the bottom help? The most common sand I seem to read about is pool filter sand....after playsand.


ooooo pool filter sand... great tip! does this change the ph?


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## Sunstar (Jul 29, 2008)

bare bottoms and sand never mix... kinda rough....


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## moon (Mar 11, 2006)

MichaelAngelo said:


> ooooo pool filter sand... great tip! does this change the ph?


I've had mine for a couple of years and no effect on ph.


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## Hitch (Apr 26, 2009)

Sunstar said:


> bare bottoms and sand never mix... kinda rough....


not if its fine sand XD...feels good.


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## Sunstar (Jul 29, 2008)

Hitch said:


> not if its fine sand XD...feels good.


feels good until you start walking. then there is grit in spots there should be no grit.


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## bigfishy (Jun 19, 2009)

pool filter sand have these black dots (charcoal), it looks bad over an area

>.>

or stick tiles to the bottom, it looks WAY better than painted!!!

^^


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## charles (Mar 7, 2008)

I used all types of sand. pool filter, silica, and now 3M quatz s-grade. I highly recommand the 3M if you can find them. Not cheap, retail at around $50 a bag 50lb. They are heavy, uniform size, and won't change ph.

In planetcatfish, there was a discussion (a few people including myself) about having pleco fry getting bloat in barebottom tank. I have experienced the same. Ever since I change to all sand, I don't have any problem.


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## KnaveTO (May 13, 2007)

I prefer using products that are specifically designed for aquatic tanks. Is why I have black flourite sand in my primary pleco tanks. However if you are not willing to pay the prices for such then I have heard that the 3M product is probably about the best out there. I do notice a big difference in the colouration of the plecos in the darker substrates. I think 3M has a black sand line in the S-grade.


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## Jackson (Jan 30, 2009)

You also have to make sure toxic gasses don't get trapped under the sand. If they are disturbed they can kill off your whole tank. That is why people use MTS to stir the sand around.

Personally I hate sand and would only use it if needed. Fine gavel is better.


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## charles (Mar 7, 2008)

sand under 2" won't trap anything. I use a layer about 3/4" thick and haven't had any problem since...


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## Jackson (Jan 30, 2009)

charles said:


> sand under 2" won't trap anything. I use a layer about 3/4" thick and haven't had any problem since...


I dont know about that I have read that even 1'' can trap these gasses and kill off the fish. I would not take the any chances. Hey to each his own


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## charles (Mar 7, 2008)

That is why I play it safe for 3/4"  I don't usually need that deep anyway.


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## MichaelAngelo (Jul 6, 2009)

Thanks for the help so far, for me I need the cheapest option.

Fine gravel would be good too, probably cheaper right? Where could I find fine gravel???


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## Jackson (Jan 30, 2009)

MichaelAngelo said:


> Thanks for the help so far, for me I need the cheapest option.
> 
> Fine gravel would be good too, probably cheaper right? Where could I find fine gravel???


Luckys has it the stuff is great


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## BillD (Jun 5, 2006)

I'm using 20 grade black blasting sand. It's $7.50 for 50 lb , or $9.98 for 88lbs. Silica sand is cheaper, but is mostly white. My preference would be for a 12 grit, but they rarely get it in. A 50 lb bag of aquarium gravel is around $6.00, but it is mostly white, what was called natural when sold as aquarium gravel.


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## bigfishy (Jun 19, 2009)

BillD said:


> I'm using 20 grade black blasting sand. It's $7.50 for 50 lb , or $9.98 for 88lbs. Silica sand is cheaper, but is mostly white. My preference would be for a 12 grit, but they rarely get it in. A 50 lb bag of aquarium gravel is around $6.00, but it is mostly white, what was called natural when sold as aquarium gravel.


Where did you get the sand and gravels???

the store address??? telephone number???

thanks


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## BillD (Jun 5, 2006)

I bought my sand at Bathe and McClellen, on Thortons Rd S. in Oshawa. They are a building supply that deals mostly with cemnet and roofing, as well as landscaping supplies. A similar business should offer similar products.


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## redclove (Feb 26, 2008)

barebottom disadvantage = unnatural for the fish. feels more like a cage.


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## MichaelAngelo (Jul 6, 2009)

BillD said:


> I'm using 20 grade black blasting sand. It's $7.50 for 50 lb , or $9.98 for 88lbs. Silica sand is cheaper, but is mostly white. My preference would be for a 12 grit, but they rarely get it in. A 50 lb bag of aquarium gravel is around $6.00, but it is mostly white, what was called natural when sold as aquarium gravel.


Great! I'll look for building supply stores =D


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## matti2uude (Jan 10, 2009)

BillD said:


> I'm using 20 grade black blasting sand. It's $7.50 for 50 lb , or $9.98 for 88lbs. Silica sand is cheaper, but is mostly white. My preference would be for a 12 grit, but they rarely get it in. A 50 lb bag of aquarium gravel is around $6.00, but it is mostly white, what was called natural when sold as aquarium gravel.


The 20 grade black blasting sand(black beauty) is made from iron slag and has sharp edges which can be harmful to some fish. Here's an article on sand.

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/sand.php


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## BillD (Jun 5, 2006)

Black Beauty is not iron slag, but rather coal slag. The stuff I have is nickel slag. it is difficult to say how sharp it actually is. Most aquarium sands and gravels are from sources that are crushed, and have sharp edges. If you can get river sand, or sand from a lakeshore, the grains are smooth. I have used sand and gravel from Lake Ontario, and it is made up of totally smooth particles.


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## js97 (Jun 11, 2008)

Use pool filter sand. it's pretty amazing...

just get some MTS in theere to stirr up the sand.


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## killpoint2008 (Sep 3, 2009)

sp what about like... creek sand? cuz thats all i can afford lmao 
and i have haing shit gunged up too. so what about some creek sand cleaned?


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## BillD (Jun 5, 2006)

There is great sand and gravel along the shore of Lake Ontario.


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## killpoint2008 (Sep 3, 2009)

so creek sand yes?


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## MichaelAngelo (Jul 6, 2009)

LOL!!! so where's the the nicest sand in the gta watershed =P


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## Hitch (Apr 26, 2009)

MichaelAngelo said:


> LOL!!! so where's the the nicest sand in the gta watershed =P


just make sure to sanitize the sand before using it into the tank. Boil, bleach....etc, which ever tickles your fancy.


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## BillD (Jun 5, 2006)

The shore of Lake Ontario has great sand and gravel in a variety of grain sizes. You can sieve to get whatever size you want.
I would use bleach rather than boiling as it will burn off all sorts of organic material.


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## knight of ni (Oct 8, 2006)

BillD said:


> The shore of Lake Ontario has great sand and gravel in a variety of grain sizes. You can sieve to get whatever size you want.
> I would use bleach rather than boiling as it will burn off all sorts of organic material.


I had a cleaner tank with a thin spread of pea sized gravel than with BB or sand, as indicated by the amount of poop vacuumed out vs. dissolved in to the water column, and that seemed to be confirmed by ORP meter readings.
the large size gravel traps poop for vacuuming.
sand was not good. It looked fairly clean, as I vacuumed the top ( however, poop seemed to break into micro particles throughout ), but once I stirred deeper to clean it, the water was fouled and caused some fin loss, even though I did several good WC afterward.

I took the sand out then.


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## Platypus (Jun 2, 2009)

I got my sand from the Humber river, but its hard to clean... It looks very natural and hasn't done anything to my tank in a negative way. + to sand from the Lake


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