# Filter Technology



## redclove (Feb 26, 2008)

I know this is a minor detail tangeant but it bugs me that in this day and age where technology is abundant and application is cheap, we still are using sponges and divertion to lessen circulation in our tanks in instances were the outputs are overkill, all the while we are still running the same amount of power into these motors..

Its time these companies develop true variable speed intakes, so turning your pumps' setting towards the (-) will acutally slow the motor down and thus use less electricity, less noise, etc.

Everything else we use daily is being developed and re-developed with efficiency in mind, why not these? Our tanks filters are being run 24/7, it adds up..


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## Harry Muscle (Mar 21, 2007)

You can buy devices that will change the voltage of AC current while maintaining a true sine wave (needed to run these motors correctly) ... however, I believe they are quite expensive. I'm not sure if it's expensive because of lack of demand or because of the actual parts cost, etc. But assuming it's a parts cost thing, then they don't include these with the filters because very few people would be willing to spend an extra $50 to $100 dollars on their filter just to be able to change the speed of the motor. Just my 2 cents 

Harry

P.S. If you completely redesigned the motor to be a DC motor instead of AC, then you wouldn't need such a fancy device to lower the voltage while maintaining a sine wave ... 2 more cents


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

redclove said:


> I know this is a minor detail tangeant but it bugs me that in this day and age where technology is abundant and application is cheap, we still are using sponges and divertion to lessen circulation in our tanks in instances were the outputs are overkill, all the while we are still running the same amount of power into these motors..
> 
> Its time these companies develop true variable speed intakes, so turning your pumps' setting towards the (-) will acutally slow the motor down and thus use less electricity, less noise, etc.
> 
> Everything else we use daily is being developed and re-developed with efficiency in mind, why not these? Our tanks filters are being run 24/7, it adds up..


What you suggest is actually a bad idea. Filters are designed (the good ones anyways, ie, everything by EHEIM) to move water past the filter media at the correct speed and usually under X pressure and with X centrifugal motion. Decreasing through flow not only hinders all of these, thus reducing the efficiency of biofiltration, but also reduces the turnover rate in your tank

Having a sponge on the output to diffuse flow but maintaining a high turnover rate is a hundred times better for your tank than having a low speed motor and thus reducing flow rate.

Technology shecknology. Its not that its not possible- its not a good idea.


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## redclove (Feb 26, 2008)

Pablo said:


> What you suggest is actually a bad idea. Filters are designed (the good ones anyways, ie, everything by EHEIM) to move water past the filter media at the correct speed and usually under X pressure and with X centrifugal motion. Decreasing through flow not only hinders all of these, thus reducing the efficiency of biofiltration, but also reduces the turnover rate in your tank
> 
> Having a sponge on the output to diffuse flow but maintaining a high turnover rate is a hundred times better for your tank than having a low speed motor and thus reducing flow rate.
> 
> Technology shecknology. Its not that its not possible- its not a good idea.


I still think its a good idea, but you raise a good point that this would not be for professionals. You are right, the current filters are designed to move water with one speed, one pressure through the media, etc, and ideally one would purchase the correct and ideal size for their tank.

My point comes comes from when I see smaller more simple pumps that have their power ratings generalized, IE a small aquaflow that is rated for "between 5G and 20G" tanks. Does one really want/need to run 150GPH in a 5G tank? Hardly. It would be simple to redesign the chambers to keep pressure up if the impellar is slowed.


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## Chris S (Dec 19, 2007)

You are talking about like a 20 dollar filter though - so I highly doubt it is worth implementing such changes from a monetary point of view.


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

Chris S said:


> You are talking about like a 20 dollar filter though - so I highly doubt it is worth implementing such changes from a monetary point of view.


Exactly. Nobody cares about the rinkydink stuff.


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## redclove (Feb 26, 2008)

Chris S said:


> You are talking about like a 20 dollar filter though - so I highly doubt it is worth implementing such changes from a monetary point of view.


These companies budget hundreds of thousands of $ to develop this stuff. The market is worth it to them, these sell in huge volumes of units. It's a given the 'pros' don't care, but there are more of these in peoples homes than there are the higher end stuff..


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## Harry Muscle (Mar 21, 2007)

Ya, but if you added these features, these low end filters would now become the high end filters with a price tag to match ... if all we had were filters that allowed such adjustments but also had a price tag to match people would complain about it and want cheaper filters without the adjustments. Sounds funny, but it's true 

If you really want that feature though, you could get a votage adjuster (can't remember the technical term for them) that keeps a true sine wave ... should work no problem on filters (don't guarantee it though  ), a good one will probably cost you at least $100 bucks if not more though ... so as long as you are willing to pay for it you can have this feature now.

Harry


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

OR just use the sponge to diffuse flow and have a healthier tank anyways....


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## t2lieu (Feb 26, 2008)

I'm with you on that one buddy
especially if you got a tank that's smaller than the size matching the filter. you should have some control over rpm the motor is running at. 

*edit... on another the note the hobby itself
The amount of freshwater that is used in this hobby, to do water changes :O lol. I feel guilty (but i still do it anyways). Although i try to feed the other plants in the house with the water i take out lol


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

t2lieu said:


> I'm with you on that one buddy
> especially if you got a tank that's smaller than the size matching the filter. you should have some control over rpm the motor is running at. The amount of freshwater that is used in this hobby :O lol. I feel guilty (but i still do it anyways). Although i try to feed the other plants in the house with the water i take out lol


what does the speed of the filter have to do with the amount of water you use?


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## t2lieu (Feb 26, 2008)

sorry that was a seperate thought i didn't seperate really seperate :S
i was just referrrin to the hobby in general lol


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## redclove (Feb 26, 2008)

t2lieu said:


> Although i try to feed the other plants in the house with the water i take out lol


We do that here too, the plants love it. My ficus started sprouting new growth a couple of months ago, wayy earlier than usual. I'm only using like half of it up for houseplants right now weekly, but will take the rest to the outdoor plants come spring.


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## DarthFishtank (May 8, 2008)

If you really want to reduce the flow rate, you could could try trimming the impeller to increase the gap between the impeller and the housing. There'll be an efficiency hit and it may take a few tries to get it right so don't do it with your only impeller - buy a spare. It works for 1000hp pumps, it should work for .001 hp pumps. It's a lot cheaper that a variable frequency drive (VFD) and a vfd is designed for applications where you need variable speed. You really should start with the correct size pump/filter combo though.


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## redclove (Feb 26, 2008)

again the point was to trim electricity usage..


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## DarthFishtank (May 8, 2008)

repeats 'I *must* not type things on the interwebs before I have my coffee. '

Trimming the impeller will reduce energy use if it's done right. Energy consumed = efficiency * flow rate * pressure rise (generally speaking). 

Pressure rise is a combination of the how far up you want to pump the water plus all the friction losses and inefficiencies in the system. The sum of these items is known in pump circles as the system head. A funny thing happens as you pump more water through the same size tube, the friction increases and you need a greater pressure rise over the pump for the same flowrate (this leads to a worse system efficiency). 

Reducing line frequency (not voltage) will reduce the pump's speed and therefore the flow rate at a given pressure rise. You cannot reduce it too much or the pump won't be able to overcome the system head and will only circulate water in the impeller housing, get hot and break. 

Trimming the impeller will similarly reduce the flow rate, but it will decrease the system efficiency. As long as the reduction in flow rate outweighs the loss of efficiency, you'll use less power. Note that as you reduce the flow rate you also reduce the friction losses so you win twice.


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