# aro comm



## aeri (Sep 9, 2007)

i like fish.


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## Brian (Mar 14, 2006)

Is that a silver and a jardini? I heard jardinis were hard to make a comm. as they are the most aggressive aro. What size tank is it and what is that pleco you have?

Pretty cool tank. I have 2 greens right now and I am trying to sell my smaller one but if it doesn't work out I might throw him in with the other aro... although I don't think they will get a long.


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## aeri (Sep 9, 2007)

They are both pretty tame. I babied the silver since it was about 2" until the 22" he's at right now, I guess he's pretty proud so he doesn't care much as long as he gets food.

The jardini I also raised when it was about 3", and always kept it with a bunch of larger catfish. It was damaged really badly once when I put a 13" giant gourami with it, so it was pretty scared of tank mates for a few weeks.

When I put the jardini into the tank, I isolated the silver and the clown knife for a week in another tank, so that the jardini could get comfortable in the tank with the tin foils. So when I added the silver and ck they wouldn't be too territorial (their memory isn't that great). I knew the jardini was supposed to be aggressive, so I hoped that the size difference would help balance out the aggression, as well as the whole territory establishing period.

It's been a month or so now and everythings going ok. The arowanas are more aggressively chasing for food because of each other, which is actually making them grow noticeably faster.

The silver is 22"
ck is 16"
jardini is 10"
albino pleco (not sure what species) is about 10"

Tank is 135G, 72" x 18" x 24", with a ghetto homemade sump behind the wall.

I find the tin foils also act as a good aggression disperser. Because they always swim around, school, and stay in the middle. So it distracts the ck from going to the top, and distracts the silver from looking at the ck.



If you do try to combine the two, make sure the size difference isn't too great. Monitoring aggression won't be too hard then. You don't want your arowana to eat the other arowana whole before you can even intervene.


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## Brian (Mar 14, 2006)

The size difference isn't that big. Probably about 2-3 inch difference. My tank isn't big enough for a comm. though which is why I would rather sell the smaller one opposed to putting them together.


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

aeri said:


> i like fish.


I like fish too. I sometimes give them the odd rock or plant.
Sometimes I give them a reasonable amount of space and don't cram them all together.


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## aeri (Sep 9, 2007)

Pablo said:


> I like fish too. I sometimes give them the odd rock or plant.
> Sometimes I give them a reasonable amount of space and don't cram them all together.


That's nice.


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## Brian (Mar 14, 2006)

Lol Pablo, be nice.



Pablo said:


> I like fish too. I sometimes give them the odd rock or plant.
> Sometimes I give them a reasonable amount of space and don't cram them all together.


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

Brian said:


> Lol Pablo, be nice.


No it was my bad.

He has _a_ rock










sorry about that.


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## aeri (Sep 9, 2007)

No there's 3 rocks.


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## Brian (Mar 14, 2006)

Lol and a few pebbles


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## aeri (Sep 9, 2007)

And some marbles


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## Tabatha (Dec 29, 2007)

The other night I spent the entire evening at the Monster Fishkeeper forum. From what I observed, it's not unusual to have huge fish (or many huge fish) in a tank with absolutely no aquascaping and not a lot of excessive room to swim. 

I, myself, don't understand the concept/theory/idea behind it and have no intention of keeping monster fish.

Personally, I can't imagine the fish being happy in that type of environment (not that I can read fishy minds). I'd go mental if I had to spend my entire life in a small room with very little stimulation.

I saw very few appropriate sized aquariums with aquascaping. I can understand big fish ripping up live plants but silk would be better than nothing?

Just MHO. Perhaps someone could shed light on this phenomenon?


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## aeri (Sep 9, 2007)

Very few in Ontario can afford to even closely imitate the natural environment in which fish live in. There's alot that can be argued.

Luckily, you're not a fish. 

The tank used to have gravel on the bottom, with a cave design made out of stacked rocks and some plants. However, the pleco became extremely territorial with the cave, and killed a catfish and severely injured the ck almost double its size. Also, live plants were always eaten by the pleco. As for fake plants, I had a giant gourami in there that would actually eat the plastic/silk leaves, which I'd imagine is not too healthy. Gravel was also occasionally eaten by the ck trying to eat sinking pellets or other dead foods. Plus, none of my fish actually require gravel or sand to burrow in, such as rays or some eels.

Changing to bare bottom was an annoying process without removing the fish. Especially with the silver arowana, which jumped several times a day and even jumped out of the tank when I left the glass lid slightly open to stick the water vacuum in.

After switching to bare bottom, the silver has stopped jumping, I barely have a support to keep the lid down now, and the fish have become less territorial as they are now sharing a big open space. Maintenance is much easier, only having to change the water once every two weeks with a 30G sump and a powerhead with a sponge. The waste that isn't taken in by the sump and the sponge are pushed and hidden under those rocks where the deadspots are. With gravel, and other factors aside, I had a fluval 404, eheim 2217, the sponge filter, and the 30G sump, yet waste accumulated so often to the point I had to change the water twice a week just to avoid cloudiness. The tank is the show tank of the house and looks better bare to match the rest of the room. But that's personal preference.

Or, I could just sell all my fish to someone with a potentially shorter tank because I feel so guilty and buy a bunch of plants and neon tetras, and of course, gravel.

JMHO.


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## Tabatha (Dec 29, 2007)

aeri said:


> Very few in Ontario can afford to even closely imitate the natural environment in which fish live in. There's alot that can be argued.
> 
> Luckily, you're not a fish.
> 
> ...


I hope you're saying this with tongue in cheek and not trying to be an a-hole. I'm at least trying to make an effort to understand your (and many other's) point of view even though I may not agree with it.

It's my personal opinion that large animals such as elephants, big cats, whales, etc... should not be kept in confined spaces. There's nothing sadder to me, than watching a lion pacing in a tiny cage or any animal at Canada's Marine Land, which I believe should be shut down. But, there are many people who enjoy them.

It's no wonder animals turn on their keepers.


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

Tabatha said:


> I hope you're saying this with tongue in cheek and not trying to be an a-hole. I'm at least trying to make an effort to understand your (and many other's) point of view even though I may not agree with it.
> 
> It's my personal opinion that large animals such as elephants, big cats, whales, etc... should not be kept in confined spaces. There's nothing sadder to me, than watching a lion pacing in a tiny cage or any animal at Canada's Marine Land, which I believe should be shut down. But, there are many people who enjoy them.
> 
> It's no wonder animals turn on their keepers.


Sad thing is, no. That wasn't tongue in cheek.

I think you've arrived at the point in your journey through fishkeeping where you will realise there are three kinds of people:

Scape centric, fish centric, and bleh.

Now, I frequently get in trouble for what I say, and I've been kicked off a few forums, and that's a shame, but I speak my mind.

There are people who really care about the setup- and the fish are secondary. These people will kink out the dorsal fin on a fish by putting too much nitrate into the tank at once, knowingly, because a certain stem plant is unhappy in their tank.

Then you have the fishcentric people, who will go to any length to keep a fish as happy and healthy as possible and make any needed changes to its environment and upkeep

Then you have the monster fish keepers... To me, most of these seem to be 'it has food and water its ok' people. They seem to think an Arrowana swimming aimlessly back and forth in a tank with absolutely no stimuli for the rest of its life is a good idea...

There are also monster keepers, who will have a two foot fish, but also have a ten foot by four foot tank, with a 250lb branch in there etc and the fish are happy, because its basically being kept like a dwarf cichlid- but to scale.

What can I tell you...?

Is it a lack of respect for the animal, or a different way of seeing things? I don't know. I disagree with this method and have absolutely zero respect for it.


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## Tabatha (Dec 29, 2007)

Is there no fourth group Pablo? Those who enjoy aquascaping and feel it enriches the lives of their fish?

PM will be sent shortly...


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

Tabatha said:


> Is there no fourth group Pablo? Those who enjoy aquascaping and feel it enriches the lives of their fish?
> 
> PM will be sent shortly...


'Then you have the fishcentric people, who will go to any length to keep a fish as happy and healthy as possible and make any needed changes to its environment and upkeep'


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## Tabatha (Dec 29, 2007)

Ah, I guess I'd like to think I fall into that category ;D


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## Brian (Mar 14, 2006)

Well then I guess under the description of your categories, I'm a fish-centric and a bleh kinda guy... which doesn't bother me at all as I guess we do have different ways of seeing things :S


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

Brian said:


> Well then I guess under the description of your categories, I'm a fish-centric and a bleh kinda guy... which doesn't bother me at all as I guess we do have different ways of seeing things :S


Yup I've known that for some time


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## aeri (Sep 9, 2007)

So if I happen to eat the fish after they've gotten big enough, which category would I fit in?


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## Brian (Mar 14, 2006)

Maybe... Asian?


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

aeri said:


> So if I happen to eat the fish after they've gotten big enough, which category would I fit in?


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## Brian (Mar 14, 2006)

aeri... if you looked like that, I'm pretty sure you could get some nice hot blondes, sorta like the ones that worship Gene Simmons


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## aeri (Sep 9, 2007)

the asian version is more suitable.


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## Tabatha (Dec 29, 2007)

aeri said:


> Very few in Ontario can afford to even closely imitate the natural environment in which fish live in. There's alot that can be argued.


Then perhaps "they" should not be keeping monster fish as "they" can not provide an appropriate environment. Where's the rocket science here?



aeri said:


> Luckily, you're not a fish.


I'm lucky I'm not a fish in *YOUR* tank, I wouldn't mind being a fish in **MY** tank.



aeri said:


> The tank used to have gravel on the bottom, with a cave design made out of stacked rocks and some plants. <bla, bla, bla>


As Pablo has demonstrated with You Tube, there are MFK who do keep Aros in planted tanks without ill effects to either fish or plants.



aeri said:


> Changing to bare bottom was an annoying process without removing the fish. Especially with the silver arowana, which jumped several times a day and even jumped out of the tank when I left the glass lid slightly open to stick the water vacuum in.
> 
> After switching to bare bottom, the silver has stopped jumping, I barely have a support to keep the lid down now, and the fish have become less territorial as they are now sharing a big open space.


Are you absolutely certain your tank wasn't (isn't) over stocked? As someone mentioned to me earlier, in a planted tank, you can't keep as many fish as space is occupied by plants.



aeri said:


> Maintenance is much easier, only having to change the water once every two weeks <snip>


There's no excuse for laziness. If you don't want to keep up with your tank's (fish's) demands, don't keep fish. Period. It really is that simple, don't you think? Am I really wrong on this point?



aeri said:


> Or, I could just sell all my fish to someone with a potentially shorter tank because I feel so guilty and buy a bunch of plants and neon tetras, and of course, gravel.


Hey, there's an excellent idea!

You have options;

a) rehome with someone who has more space/bigger tank, less fish with or without money. Yes, you may loose money (waaaa), so what?

b) buy a bigger tank, give you fish a better life!

How selfish are you? Are you keeping monster fish to show off to your friends? You certainly aren't keeping them to better their lives in any way. You don't have to justify anything to me but I do think you owe something to your fish.

Until you post something remotely intelligent, I'm done with you.


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

Its like I'm reading one of my posts- except I didn't post it!

Creepy stuff man...

I especially enjoyed _Then perhaps "they" should not be keeping monster fish as "they" can not provide an appropriate environment. Where's the rocket science here?_

MFK/BFST(big fish, small tank) people we aren't attacking you when we say these things. We're attacking what we feel to be, in certain situations, unfair housing or treatment of certain fish, which we don't think should be happening.

Its not like we can physically come take the fish and put them in a 3000 gallon tank in some refuge somewhere.- we just think it would be nice and we voice that.


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## aeri (Sep 9, 2007)

Would you like to donate me a larger fish tank? You can start a save-the-arowana charity. I'd be more than glad to take it. I'll even come to Ajax to pick it up and save you some trouble. Then everyone can be happy.


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## Pablo (Mar 27, 2006)

aeri said:


> Would you like to donate me a larger fish tank?


That sort of misses the point of what we're saying.


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## aeri (Sep 9, 2007)

Pablo said:


> That sort of misses the point of what we're saying.


What's the point?


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## Ciddian (Mar 15, 2006)

Hmm.. Agree to dissagree?


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