# Thinking of starting a nano, super noob-need help!!!



## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

*iBetta's first marine nano:custom-made 8g*

Hey fellow members,

It's been on my mind for a while and i really want to try getting my hands on the marine hobby .

With that said, I have ABSOLUTELY NO experience whatsoever in this area, so i thought maybe i could start a small nano and test things out first to see if i would really like it. i have done some research here and there and ive looked at the thread "So you want to keep a Nano tank?" by ameekplec. (great stuff!) and other various sites

I have the necessary light and equipment (ie. HOB filter, heater, power heads, R/O water etc), except for the parameter testers and refractometer. i dont think im ready for a big tank yet with a skimmer etc because i want to try things small and see if i would like to pursue this in the long run 

Im thinking of use a 1.5-2.5g tank.

Now i know this might sound stupid, but i have a lot of beginner BEGINNER questions, i hope anyone out would be kind enough to help me out and give me some pointers, i will greatly appreciate it!  
here are some of my questions for now:

1. so far, im thinking of only trying out low-light and low-demanding corals like zoas and various polyps (are these the correct ones?). i wont be dwelling into any fish for now. just an experiment...hopefully a cheap one. any suggestions for any low-demanding, hardy corals?i think soft corals are way easier to manage than hard ones, right? any recommendations thats cheap for a starter project?

2.my first stupid question, do you need to feed the corals, since they are filter feeders? is there like a powder or solution of some sort of food? or is it enough to just have lights and nutrients, like freshwater? could i potentially get away without feeding them for example, if i were to keep some Green star polyps?

but where would they come from? from the live rock/sand and dosing? since I dose in fresh, i'm assuming there are similar procedures to dose certain "macros" and "micros"? am i right on this?

3. what salt do you use to mix in your water? would sea salt (like for food, but without iodine) work?

4.for a tank as small as this with no livestock, is it possible not to use R/O water and just use tap water when mixing with the salt? what is there in tap water that is detrimental to the corals?

I don't want to bombard everyone with a longer list of questions but i am sure that i will ask many along the way if any of you would be so great to help me out! 

thanks a lot!

ibetta


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

LOL I remember the learning curve way back when I first got wet. 

1. zoos, xenia, and GSP (green star polyp). Just get some frags from Alex (Explor3r/FragCave) or from me. Very easy to care for, and hardy. Don't try hard corals in such a tiny tank.

2. No. Just keep the water parameters good and have a good light. they will be fine and grow. Soft corals like the ones I mentioned do not need food, just the regular nutrients found in good quality reef crystals (or mineral supplement if you use regular marine salt). When you get a bigger aquarium with more diverse corals, you may want to dose some plankton or additional calcium, but usually you don't really need to feed your corals until you go for some real tricky ones.

3. No. You need to buy marine aquarium salt. Avoid Coralife, it's crap. Instant Ocean is good value, I've used it with good results, also Kent Marine and Tropic Marin make great reef salts; Anything a good SW store (NOT Big Als) will sell you should be fine, you won't need a big bag for a tiny tank like that. Remember, there are 2 kinds: marine salt (for fish-only tanks) and reef crystals (for aquariums with lots of corals). You could use marine salt for your tank, the corals will not suffer, just they won't grow very quickly without the extra minerals found in reef crystals.

4. You can, just treat your water with Prime to remove Chlorine, etc. What is in your water that you have to be careful of? TDS (Total Dissolved Solids) and phosphates can trigger algae growth and harm corals, or suspended metals that are detrimental to invertebrates. But many people DO use Prime treated tap water.

Have fun!


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

wow thank you very much! your reply gave me more confidence and motivation! 

if i were to use softwater, would those reef crystals be enough to raise my alkalinity or would i have to manually raise it first with another compound? the reason im asking is because my household uses softwater (but the water down the basement is hardwater so i can always use that and prime). just curious .

thank you very much for having read my previous long post and for your answers!  i really appreciate it!


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## royy (Jan 4, 2010)

50seven said:


> LOL I remember the learning curve way back when I first got wet.
> 
> 1. zoos, xenia, and GSP (green star polyp). Just get some frags from Alex (Explor3r/FragCave) or from me. Very easy to care for, and hardy. Don't try hard corals in such a tiny tank.
> 
> ...


I currently use INstant Ocean marine salt mix, but i put corals in it and it seems to be doing fine (new heads coming out). But i was curious if i wanted to switch over to reef crystals, can i mix both of them together?


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

I would personally never use softened water. Even though the TDS is marginally less without being softened (mine is 220 TDS after the softener, 210 before) there is stuff in the salts and resin that could mess with your water chemistry.

If you use a good brand of salt, and your water source is good, you should never have to add any buffers to change the pH or alkalinity.

Also remember with a marine tank, you are not doing water changes as large or as frequently as with FW. Which seems ironic as your water chemistry quality is more important. Consistency is WAY more important than quantity. Read up on people who have killed their tank by excessive/ incorrect WC's (me included ). It's the #1 mistake for noobs, especially those coming from the heavily planted side. Personally I would not do more than 10% once per week. You should only do more if your tank is in the process of crashing, or if you are a very advanced reefer with an NPS tank. Which means that a 4 litre jug of RO water from the grocery store will last you a while.


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

royy said:


> I currently use INstant Ocean marine salt mix, but i put corals in it and it seems to be doing fine (new heads coming out). But i was curious if i wanted to switch over to reef crystals, can i mix both of them together?


Absolutely. Some people do it that way on purpose, myself included.

I used IO marine salt on its own for over a year. Things were fine until around 6-9 months in, I decided to dose some Kent Marine Essential Reef Minerals; that's when I noticed a huge increase in the growth and overall health of my corals. I've been using it ever since, even though I now mix my salt 50-50 with Kent reef crystals.


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

Ah i see! thank you thank you!


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## royy (Jan 4, 2010)

Im gna try dosing it with that than. 
Thank you! 

And sorry for taking your thread LOL


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

royy said:


> Im gna try dosing it with that than.
> Thank you!
> 
> And sorry for taking your thread LOL


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

royy said:


> Im gna try dosing it with that than.
> Thank you!
> 
> And sorry for taking your thread LOL


lol no problem man, everyone's welcomed for questions, answers etc . im learning tons lol


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## Tim (Dec 11, 2011)

I just have some zoas, GSP and kenya tree, all beginner corals, all cheap frags. 


I haven't killed them yet and even have had some nice growth , all using instant ocean without additives.


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

Tim said:


> I just have some zoas, GSP and kenya tree, all beginner corals, all cheap frags.
> 
> I haven't killed them yet and even have had some nice growth , all using instant ocean without additives.


where are you located? if you're not too far from york region, i might come by for a visit after i set up my tank ! ill be looking for some zoas and a frag of xenia to start


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## Tim (Dec 11, 2011)

Im not selling, I just started with cheap little frags as I was afraid of killing them. I got mine from JulieFish who is in Brampton.


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

ooops my bad! thank you!


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## altcharacter (Jan 10, 2011)

I'll have a frag of xenia and possibly something else when you're ready to start.


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

How often should i do water changes? since im not having any livestock and im not feeding at all, should i aim for less frequent water changes? i used to do it once a week with my freshwater tank on EI, and one a month for my shrimp tanks, but with this i have no idea 

would the corals in the tank use up the minerals in the water column really fast? (ie. the water mixed from reef crystals etc). im only planning for zoos and soft corals
thanks!


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## Tim (Dec 11, 2011)

10% 1x a week will probably do. 

Are you going to run carbon? I don't have a lot of experience with corals but I see it mentioned by a lot of people as lots of corals spew all sorts of crap out lol. I only have a few but started using it a while ago.

Edit: It looks like I may have a small piece of a kenya tree fall off soon so I may try and frag it. If it survives you can have it. Apparently it is like the canary in a coal mine, and closes up when your water isn't up to snuff.


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

altcharacter said:


> I'll have a frag of xenia and possibly something else when you're ready to start.


where are you located as well? i go to utsc so i might be able to get some frags!


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

Tim said:


> 10% 1x a week will probably do.
> 
> Are you going to run carbon? I don't have a lot of experience with corals but I see it mentioned by a lot of people as lots of corals spew all sorts of crap out lol. I only have a few but started using it a while ago.
> 
> Edit: It looks like I may have a small piece of a kenya tree fall off soon so I may try and frag it. If it survives you can have it. Apparently it is like the canary in a coal mine, and closes up when your water isn't up to snuff.


i dont have carbon yet because im using a very small filter, however im beginning to consider it . does it have to be activated carbon? can it be those ceramic cynlinder-looking things? O: i also have activated carbon though 

when do you know your carbon needs changing as well?

and where are you located? i would gladly take it if its not too far from me! 

many thanks for all the advice everyone!


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## JulieFish (Apr 8, 2011)

just thought I'd chime in here... from what I've read, yes, it should be activated carbon. Activated carbon is an extremely porous material that "soaks up" most impurities. In the reef aquarium, your corals (especially soft corals) will produce toxins with the intent of killing each other, because they are too close and want the space to grow for themselves. If you use activated carbon, it will remove these toxins, so you can cram in more corals 

As for changing it, I've seen lots of recommendations for having two bags going all the time, and then rotating the replacement schedule so that each is replaced every four weeks, but with two weeks in between the two bags... that way, when one is fresh, the other is 2 weeks old, then when the new one is two weeks old, you replace the other (now 4 weeks old) one. Hope that makes sense. 

I don't change mine quite that often, because my corals all look really happy, and I certainly don't think you would need to change them quite that often if you didn't have a lot of soft corals, and in the beginning, you can just place the corals at opposite ends of the tank, and the activated carbon could last as long as 2-3 months.

Also, don't get any fancy ideas about trying to recharge your activated carbon. It can't be done by household means.

Hope that helps!


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

thank you very much for the advice!  now i just need a bigger filter to put some carbons in it......lol


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## Tim (Dec 11, 2011)

I use 1 cup of carbon for a 65g tank with a 20g sump, total water volume of probably 50-ish gallons and it seems to work fine. You have a 2.5 gallon tank if I remember so a teaspoon or two will probably do lol.


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

hahahha thank you! duly noted!  
i would still have to slightly modify my filter since its so small lol....

i can't wait to get more frags!  
i'm still waiting for my refractometer to come, my hydrometer (that thing is so confusing) broke but my very last reading was 1.024 . my gsp is still opening and healthy so right now that's my indicator lol......
after checking everything's good, im going to go shop for polyps >


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

I have no advice to give- I haven't used carbon much at all. I do however have a 120 gallon refugium...


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

50seven said:


> I have no advice to give- I haven't used carbon much at all. I do however have a 120 gallon refugium...


i just read through your 90g build....omg...*.*.


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

iBetta said:


> i just read through your 90g build....omg...*.*.


Thanks...it's nothing like Peter/Nineball's reef but it's mine and I love it. I'm thankful to be able to have a piece of God's ocean right in my dining room. And that the mighty Aphrodite gives me her approval as well


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

im starting to see some brown hair algae sticking on my rocks. how do you get rid of it and how did it get there? sorry i dont have a camera at my disposal for the time being 

thanks!


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## Tim (Dec 11, 2011)

It just happens. Test your water, as something is feeding it. Pick it off with your fingers, and suction out anything that floats away (or use a net, whatever)

You will probably get some diatoms and other fun things as well, just part of the tank going through the stages of development.

What you could do is put a little piece of chaeto in there and let it compete with the algae for the nutrients. I use that, fern calurpa and some type of codium.


edit: and make sure it is algae on not little legs from micro brittle stars  They like hiding in the cracks and letting their legs hang out.


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

thank you! i've been trying to find chaeto in york region for a week and still no answers! 
so i'm guessing when it is fully cycled the algae will decrease right?
are there any vertebrates small enough for a 2.5g pico that feeds on these algae without touching soft corals and only eat algae?

Thanks for the help as always!


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## altcharacter (Jan 10, 2011)

Tim is somewhat right, just get snails and they'll eat it. Snails love algae. 

Lighting is more of the concern when it comes to algae. No light...no algae.
Algae will always find something to feed off of in your tank so if you don't have anything to eat it then it will grow.


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

ok thank you everyone! next trip ill invest in one snail since my pico is so small....lol. man marine is tough!


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

hey guys, i went by BA today and i saw some really neat hermit crabs . i know this might be a stupid question, but what do they eat? they should be scavengers right? do they eat anything? soft corals? pellets/flakes? 

i thought of getting one but i have a trochus snail in my tank for now, would they live well together? i want to make sure before i try on . they are neat!


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## JulieFish (Apr 8, 2011)

I have been keeping a couple of hermits for about a year now and my experience is that some of them love to eat lots and will quickly go hunting for leftovers after I feed the fish and some of them will just roam slowly around, picking at algae on the rocks. 

Most are not too shy, although I got one right at the beginning that stays hidden pretty much all the time (haven't seen it in awhile so maybe it's dead but it's hidden for long periods before and then reappeard so who knows) Make sure that you have a couple of slightly bigger empty shells kickin' around for them otherwise they may kill snails to steal the shell. I haven't blamed mine for any snail deaths but I've got tons of extra shells around. If you don't have lots of filamentous algae on your rocks I'd give them very small regular feedings to make sure they don't get hungry and start to eat other things in your tank, They would rather eat easy food (fish food/minced fresh fish) but if they are hungry, they'll do what they need to to find something to eat.

I like 'em, because I think they are interesting, but all in all they aren't that great at cleaning the way snails are... and some people never put any crabs in their reef tank... but personally I enjoy watching them.

Another bit of mischeif that they tend to get into is that they climb and crawl all over your frags, sometimes knocking them over, which can be annoying.


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## sig (Dec 13, 2010)

you should find out what type of crabs are these and check google

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## Tim (Dec 11, 2011)

My hermits are fun to watch but 1 of my nassarius snails was evicted from his shell


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

thanks everyone for the input! i found out they are Calcinus seurati/white banded hermit crab/Hawaiian Zebra Hermit Crab! 

they look so cool! i may want to buy one now! 

on another note...im not too sure i seem to have aptasia.....its growing on the INSIDE of an old snail shell and so i only see the grayish/red tentacles coming out...the problem is, i also have some polyps on there so i cant torch it...how do i get rid of it?  i dont think using a filefish is possible because my tank is so small.....


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## Tim (Dec 11, 2011)

Pepermint shrimps eat aptasia. According to various people though some do and some don't. 

When I set up my tank I bought one just for this purpose. It also likes eating everything else in the tank so it is a decent part of the CUC. (mine LOVES pellets)

Mine likes hanging upside down and swaying in the water. They do shed so you will see a transluscent shell of the body here and there.


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

Tim said:


> Pepermint shrimps eat aptasia. According to various people though some do and some don't.


will they bother soft corals ?

thanks!


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## Tim (Dec 11, 2011)

They are reef safe. I got mine at SUM and the guys there all told me they would be fine, and they have been. Just make sure that it is a peppermint you get and not a camel shrimp (you don't want one of those) . First thing Dave said when he came to visit was hey is that a camel shrimp 

Some people (including sig) have complained of shrimp digging into the corals they feed like sun corals to get the food out.

I have also seen a few complaints (just on forums) of them going after frogspawn and hammers, but I have no idea 1) if they have accidentally had camel shrimp rather than peppermint shrimps 2) were their shrimps being fed enough? I can see if something isn't being fed it would have to find something to eat to survive.

My peppermint has not gone near any of my corals.

pic of a camel and peppermint:
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...11830425.85792.100000065863016&type=1&theater


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

sweet!  i guess only one is enough for my pico lol 
this marine hobby is seriously starting to get me addicted.....


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## altcharacter (Jan 10, 2011)

Go for a smaller one of course, it will grow fairly fast.


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

I have (had) cleaner shrimp, blood shrimp, peppermint shrimp, and all types of hermit crabs. none have ever gone after any of my corals: softies, LPS, SPS.


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

time for a trip back to BA!  i can see that my hobby will soon be just as expensive as my university courses in the long run LOL!!!!


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## altcharacter (Jan 10, 2011)

If you can, go to Sea U Marine. I tend to like the alot better since they're Marine specific and know what they're doing. Also they're great guys to deal with and have great prices.


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

altcharacter said:


> if you can, go to sea u marine. I tend to like the alot better since they're marine specific and know what they're doing. Also they're great guys to deal with and have great prices.


+1

SUM ftw!


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

yes i love SUM!  thats where i got my trochus snail! you think i can ask them for some free shells . thats it, im making a trip today! lol


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## altcharacter (Jan 10, 2011)

They're usually pretty good about that, especially if you wink at Chris ;P


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

altcharacter said:


> They're usually pretty good about that, especially if you wink at Chris ;P


is he the asian guy or the caucasian one?


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

a little bit of update with pics 

just got these 2 days ago from BA (talked to the manager to sell them to me for 2$ each since they are so small lol) 

i find that more and more of them are opening as the days go by and some are finally fully opened ! i'm thinking of getting/DIY-ing some blue leds sometimes

ps. my refractometer is still on its way so i lucked out that they are doing well!  (last time i tested before my hydrometer broke was at 1.024)


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## Tim (Dec 11, 2011)

what are they?


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

Tim said:


> what are they?


to be honest i have no idea lol. because they were just bits and pieces that were left by themselves in tanks lol. all i know from looking at then is that they are zoas . one thats purple with a pink center, one is purple with a neon center 

buts its ok since im just starting out !


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## Tim (Dec 11, 2011)

I am going to visit the $10.00 frag tank at NAFB this Friday or over the weekend. Last time I was there they had a few "I don't knows" that I thought looked kind of neat.

For $2.00 yo can't go wrong, one frag down the road and you have made money LOL.


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## 50seven (Feb 14, 2010)

Tim said:


> I am going to visit the $10.00 frag tank at NAFB this Friday or over the weekend. Last time I was there they had a few "I don't knows" that I thought looked kind of neat.
> 
> For $2.00 yo can't go wrong, one frag down the road and you have made money LOL.


LOL Reefing is awesome. We chop our pets into little bits and then sell them for money to buy more pets.


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

I just came back from SUM, they had live rocks with some mixed corals on it (polyps and mostly mushrooms on them) for $10/each so i got two! 

When i took them out and put into another bucket, a lot of little microorganisms swam out :O! i saw some red shrimplets and some gray ones that are more fat/bulky and that didn't look like shrimps. I decided to put the shrimplets in (seems like peppermint shrimplets) but i dont know about the gray ones. i decided to finally dump everything in since its only a pico and it's part of the diversity . im just open that they aren't bad for the corals 

I also saw some green bubble algae things, what are those? oh and some tube worms/feather dusters?


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## Tim (Dec 11, 2011)

There was some nasties on those rocks if I think you bought what I saw. There was something on those rocks that made me shy away.

You sure got diversity LOL.

Edit, it was Valonia (bubble algae). Since I already had algae problems I decided not to add to it.


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

oh no.....now im nervous....XD.....well im planning to use a bigger tank soon (the marine hobby DOES make you keep wanting to increase tank size) so ill take them out then O:.
and yes, i googled and it is valonia O:!


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## Tim (Dec 11, 2011)

emerald crabs eat valonia, so there is some more diversity for you


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

i saw some really cool gobies and firefish, would they syphon the sand/eat those invertebrate hitchhikers?


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## brapbrapboom (Sep 2, 2009)

Been tagging along with this thread , sorry for hopping on your post lol, but what do you guys think of Dymax iq3? Will it make a suitable pico marine tank as well?


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

FTS after the change from 2.5g to 8g . its pretty bare but im going slow, still trying to make sure there are no more dead spots and because of my budget..its practically coral-free . im also going to get some new leds with moonlight later 

Ive used both live rocks (there actually 3 in there) and some dead coral skeletons to make the scape, and so far so good . no casualties, im getting a some algae but my CUC is doing a wonderful job . seems like im starting to find my equilibrium . I also have some halimeda at the back, but i might take those out later (found out they suck out a lot of Ca)

i also would like apologize to have bothered many members here about cheap $5 zoo frags.  ultimately, i would like to make it into a zoo tank and being tight on budget, thats what i have to rely on....sorry...


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

brapbrapboom said:


> Been tagging along with this thread , sorry for hopping on your post lol, but what do you guys think of Dymax iq3? Will it make a suitable pico marine tank as well?


i forgot to tell you dude, iq3s have always been sold at BA scarb! but iq5 is nowhere to be found :'(. i initially wanted to use one like that for my nano. then i opted for a 2.5g....and now i transferred everything into 8g.....honestly for me, it wasnt because of the water parameters stability (i dont feed, and i just have a CUC). it was because i wanted to put more corals in there.....

lets take my tank for example. i initially put some neon pink zooanthids, then i thought "hey, its not that bad having just a nano/pico with a single type of zooanthid as its centre piece".......but then overtime....i thought "wouldn't it be cool to have different species of zooanthids and different colours? maybe adding a blue mushroom would be nice...hm...and some shrimps....maybe 2 species..." and the list goes on!O: there is so much variety in corals and in livestock in marine that no doubt in the far away future i would have like a 90g for myself! DX


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

*Hitchhiker found!*

i just found this on an live rock i bought today (from BA madness! )!

I believe its a hairy crab and after some research, i decided to remove it. definitely gave me a scare when i saw some hairy legs crawl out from the rock....


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

not too sure, but i think this is budding right??! the head closed off for a day and then i saw this tonight! a small mini mouth?  however, the entire colony closed, not just the bigger/parental head its attached to....

man i love asexual reproduction!  im finally doing something right! oh and got new lights 50/50


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## darthvictor (Aug 16, 2011)

Tim said:


> There was some nasties on those rocks if I think you bought what I saw. There was something on those rocks that made me shy away.
> 
> You sure got diversity LOL.
> 
> Edit, it was Valonia (bubble algae). Since I already had algae problems I decided not to add to it.


Yup, I would look closely at those rock at night to make sure, some of those come with worms and stuff that you don't want to have. Manually remove those bubble algae first


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## Tim (Dec 11, 2011)

I put any rocks I get in quarantine. I have eggcrate on some plastic tube stilts so if a critter comes out of the rock it falls onto the bottom of the tank, then next it spends a little while in my sump where I can keep an eye on it. I wish I had picked up one of those freebie tanks from big als so I could have a second q tank. Next time (if it ever happens again)


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

hey guys, i just found a mini star in my tank. has 5 limbs, white, with a brown centre and the limbs are very fluid and move like tentacles. reef-safe? do these guys just graze on algae/detritus or do they eat corals (soft corals) too? Thanks!


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## Tim (Dec 11, 2011)

I have all sorts of colouras and they seem to just hide in a rock and let their limbs hang out in the water. I have never seen them do anything else but.


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

i found out that it's "Amphipholis squamata". just wanted it to be reef safe thats all, since im so new at this . im doing more research for now and some say its beneficial, so i think ill keep it!  it's really fun to just see new things (the good anyways) just popping up !


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

found a bristleworm hitchhiker! :O i cant believe it's been a month and i missed this little guy! from research.....should be reef safe right? I'm just wondering how long it could get XD


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## Tim (Dec 11, 2011)

They can get huge LOL. But don't worry they are fine. I breed them in my fuge 

They eat left over food in the tank.


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

oh my, but my tank is only an 8g O:! im sure ill see it stick out if it gets huge enough? lol i hear htey can sting some zoos though. maybe i should take it out?


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## JulieFish (Apr 8, 2011)

I'd leave it in, just make sure that you don't overfeed... I notice that my bristleworms all get fat even if I'm just a little heavy-handed with feeding. Then they slim down again when I restrain myself. besides, if you've got one then you've got many, they are just good hiders so you don't see them. The one in the photo you uploaded should be quite reef-safe, the ones that get REALLY big look different.

mine seem to max out around 4 inches when stretched out...

The bristles can irritate your skin if touched though, so take caution when handling stuff in your tank, or wear gloves to be extra-safe. I find that they always hide under LPS corals that are on the sandbed... probably cause I feed the coral so there is always a little leftover food there, not to mention it's good cover for a place to hide.

Enjoy your hitch-hikers!


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

thank you! right now, it's hiding under my GSP mat that I attached on a coral skeleton (there are some crevices in there).  i didn't want to take it out since it looked so cool and colourful, and now the more reason not too !

I'm thinking of adding some livestock now (i think my tank is pretty much stable, i'm starting to have copepods on my glass lol ). 

and i've started feeding (i know i said i wouldnt) my yellow polyps (since these guys do need feeding) and what a difference i've seen! :O their stalk are always so "puffy" now and they look more healthy!


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## Tim (Dec 11, 2011)

I feed everything in my tank.

Something happened in my tank and the water went green with algae. It recently cleared but my corals must have been in heaven. My green tree coral is all puffy now, my sun coral that I thought was dead had 5 baby polyps open and I now have lots of small feather dusters. 

Now I am wondering if greenish water wasn't so bad.


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## JulieFish (Apr 8, 2011)

Tim: glad to hear the green tree is doing well!


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

btw, does anyone know where I could get some cheap DIY moonlight/blue LEds? My tank is 16" long.
Thank you!

oh and here's little update . its still very bare and im still on the hunt for zoanthid/softy frags and some livestock .

Would a pistol, small goby (i'm looking for the smallest species), a damsel and a chromis be overstocking? Would the chromis and damsel feel lonely (ie. do they school and need conspecifics?). 

I want to start things off with a pistol and a goby (probably yellow watchman) but ultimately i would like some small fish that would swim in the middle of the water column as well (not looking for clownfish at the moment).and the pistol wouldnt break my glass right? only mantis shrimps i believe? But ultimately, a paired goby/pistol and two small mid-swimmers is my goal, overstocking issue? 

I'm able to do water changes weekly and this is an 8g.

Thanks for reading!

EDIT: i think ive managed to ID my zoas: the biggest colony should be cherry blossom and the small frag should be aussie pink (reference from liveaquaria). please correct me if im wrong because i would like to know what kind of zoas i have!


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## Tim (Dec 11, 2011)

Damsels are pretty aggressive. There is a funny thread in the sales section where someone offered $10.00 to catch their damsel and take it lol.

Chromis need to school. I have always heard that odd numbers are best. I keep three and they seem fine. They are all over the tank.

There are some very nice small gobies. I like the

yellow clown 1 1/2"
http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=15+2124+1441&pcatid=1441

Black clown 1 1/2"
http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=15+2124+1857&pcatid=1857

Have a look at live aquarias nano fish to give you a good idea of some of the varieties:
http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/aquarium-fish-supplies.cfm?c=15+2124

If I remember it is the pistol and yellow watchman goby who buddy up? I am not sure if you need to buy them already together or if you can buy them separately and then hook them up together. If you know let me know because it is something I have been thinking about.

Yeah mantis shrimp is the nasty but the idea of having one sounds like fun.


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

i also checked out the yellow clown and also the green clown before !
but by logic, i would think they wouldn't pair with pistols because they usually stay on polyps on on the water column, and not the substrate O:.

from other forums and research, people say that you just have to introduce them one after the other (pistol first to make the burrow, then the goby) and they will still have a chance to pair. i cant wait to try it out!


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## JulieFish (Apr 8, 2011)

Yeah I agree with Tim that you should go through the nano fish section of LiveAquaria to get ideas for good fishes... chromis and damsels need at least 30 gallons to roam because they like to swim around fast and I think they will not thrive in a small tank. It's time to upgrade if you want to have fish that need a 30 gallon home!

I've got a court jester goby and he likes to hang out in the open, just hovering mostly pecking at the rockwork all day long. Hector's gobies are similar but with different colours. Neon gobies and clown gobies also stay small and are very bright and cute. The yellow watchman should be fine. 
A pistol shrimp is probably fine and won't break glass as far as I know. 

If you feel like taking a drive out to Brampton, I've got some softies for sale! Lots of kenya trees and some mushrooms and one green tree.

Just keep reading!


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

JulieFish said:


> If you feel like taking a drive out to Brampton, I've got some softies for sale! Lots of kenya trees and some mushrooms and one green tree.
> 
> Just keep reading!


Thanks for your input JulieFish! I've been eyeing your posts for a while, but I love way too far!  I can probably meet somewhere on Weston/highway 7 on normal days, but to go to Brampton, I would need a designated day for a trip kind of thing! 

My question is, would the clown gobies pair up with pistols? They don't seem to stay on the substrates/burrows a lot....


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## JulieFish (Apr 8, 2011)

I've never had pistols but from what I've read it is just a select group of "prawn gobies" that pair up with shrimps, one of these is yellow watchman. If you type "prawn goby" into the search bar at LiveAquaria you will see more of them but I don't know if the relationships are species-specific or not.

As far as I know, clown gobies do not pair up with shrimps, as they have their own commensal relationship buddies: acropora corals.

I'm going to send you a pm re: corals for sale.


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

i replied your pm!  im loving this liveaquaria website lol.....


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

so after about 2 months, i am getting A LOT of copepods, amphipods, whatever-pods on my glass. it almost looks like a fuge! i only have a goby in there and he doesnt eat them. 

Do my corals (got some polyps) eat them? i seem to be getting more and more and im hoping they could be served as coral food but none of them seem to be decreasing their population much. would my polyps eat them? they are literally ALL OVER the place! sand bed, glass, crawling on snails shells lol. would getting a damsel or a clown goby help?

thanks!


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## altcharacter (Jan 10, 2011)

Pods are a good thing to have in a tank. Mine usually only come out at night and rarely come out during the day anymore. I had the same situation as you did and bought a mandarin. After about a month the mandarin devoured the whole colony of pods in the tank and then I sold him off. 

Now I think the pods that are in the tank are too afraid to come out but there are still a ton of them.

I wouldn't worry about them at all. They're part of a very healthy system and I know alot of people who would love to be in your position. I also don't know how many corals would eat them.


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

would they serve as a good treat to any fish like damsels/chromis other than gobies? my orange spot doesnt seem to eat them at all but it eats pellets, brine shrimps lol.

also, to any moderator, is it possible to change my thread title to: Ibetta's custom-made marine 8g nano?  i don't feel so noobish anymore now that my tank seems stable


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

*Can palys/button polyps be put beside zoas?*

The reason I'm asking is that I have my green button polyps beside some zoas. There is space between them but sometimes longer tentacles of the button polyps would brush over them (the zoas) causing them to "semi-retract". there's not melting nor bleaching or anything on the zoas, just some of its tentacles that's been brushed retracting

I just wanted to know whether they can be put side by side (in contact). I know you can do that with different species of zoanthids but what about palys with zoanthids? likewise i have some yellow polyps by themselves, but what would happen with i put a colony of zoanthids right beside it, or if they start to grow on each other?

Thanks for reading my long post!


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## altcharacter (Jan 10, 2011)

iBetta said:


> The reason I'm asking is that I have my green button polyps beside some zoas. There is space between them but sometimes longer tentacles of the button polyps would brush over them (the zoas) causing them to "semi-retract". there's not melting nor bleaching or anything on the zoas, just some of its tentacles that's been brushed retracting
> 
> I just wanted to know whether they can be put side by side (in contact). I know you can do that with different species of zoanthids but what about palys with zoanthids? likewise i have some yellow polyps by themselves, but what would happen with i put a colony of zoanthids right beside it, or if they start to grow on each other?
> 
> Thanks for reading my long post!


The best way to fix this is to get a larger tank 

If you want to change the title of the thread just go back to the first post you made and Edit it. You can edit the title of the thread at the same time.


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

altcharacter said:


> The best way to fix this is to get a larger tank
> 
> If you want to change the title of the thread just go back to the first post you made and Edit it. You can edit the title of the thread at the same time.


i didn't you could do that! O: thanks!
i'm already thinking about it...but arg...its gonna be more money lol. 
so would palys sting zoas if put right beside each other? 

edit: actually didn't work


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

*recommendations for high flow nano fish?*

anyone have any recommendations for nano fish that can tolerate high flow? im even thinking of decreasing my flow because its making my clown goby uncomfortable so he stays on the corner or on a heater since there's little flow there (might trade him for something else with you guys if the flow is bothering him to much). but i would also like to know/try if there are any small nano fish that can withstand/like high flow. any suggestions would be greatly appreciated !


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

hey guys, i found another worm, couldn't take a picture but its VERY small (for now), transparent whitish with two black eyes and burrows under the sand, good or bad? thanks!


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## altcharacter (Jan 10, 2011)

probably a bristleworm but wouldn't know until we see a pic.


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

i took a pic but its still too small to see -_-
EDIT: i took it and it seems to be a bristleworm


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## iBetta (Jun 19, 2011)

*May Update*

May update . pretty what i had planned in mind. just looking for some different types of zoanthids  and waiting for them to grow


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