# [HELP]My guppies are dying



## cross7fu (Dec 9, 2012)

I have a guppy tank set up for months now, the tank is 20 gal with 10 guppies (now only 7, about to be 6...), a small pleco, a golden snail and some assistant snails, with a PowerHouse sponge filter (with bio media, very efficient filter). 

The guppies gave birth to around 50 fries so far so I thought they are in good conditions, but from time to time they keep dying, and it's getting worse, I had one died yesterday, one died today, and one is floating on the water right now. I found the dead guppies' fins were kinda dissolved, and the female once went very thin when they died. 

Also all my indoor taps are connected to a soft water machine, the water is basically 0GH. I have garden gravel as substrate, which boost up the hardness but still lower than average, would that be a cause of their death? I've been trying to solve this problem so I took some water from the backyard's tap, which I believe does not go through the soft water machine, I changed about 50% of the tank water with it and not sure if that kills them quicker. Does anyone have ideas about it?


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## cross7fu (Dec 9, 2012)

I just did 50% water change with tap water, and here is a pic of the dying one. You can see its gills turn very red, the fins are dissolved and some kind of red spikes came out from the bottom.


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## darkangel66n (May 15, 2013)

It looks like a parasitic infestation of some type. Your water is not helping either. You need water that does not go through your softener. I am wondering if these are imported guppies as well. Did you get them at Big Al's?


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## cross7fu (Dec 9, 2012)

darkangel66n said:


> It looks like a parasitic infestation of some type. Your water is not helping either. You need water that does not go through your softener. I am wondering if these are imported guppies as well. Did you get them at Big Al's?


They are from Big Al's and Aquatic Kingdom. I got both new and old fish died (new fish are from Big Al's), they go from healthy and active to completely dead or not able to swim in a day, what kind if parasite can do that and how do I treat it?


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## Mykuhl (Apr 8, 2013)

Those red spikes coming out of the anus really appear to be callamanus worms. These worms are deadly parasites, highly contagious and WILL eventually kill every fish that it infects, and it will infect every fish. You need to get yourself some levamisole and and treat every tank you have with the medication or it will likely reappear. If your fish are eating also f st some food with levamisole and feed them that. You can get both products online from Angelfins. 

It looks like they are suffering from other issues as well...the dissolves fins and red gills show that it is not just the worms. Perhaps a bacterial infection took a hold as well. Those worms will not kill fish within one day of appearing. I wish I could tell you for.sure.what else is going on but I am no expert.


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## Mykuhl (Apr 8, 2013)

You could try treating the tank with PolyGuard made by Seachem first, before you treat them with the levimasole since whatever else is affecting them will kill them faster than the worms, then treat them for the worms. PolyGuard is a good broad spectrum medication meant to treat several different bacterial and parasitic infections, but will not kill callamanus worms.


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## cross7fu (Dec 9, 2012)

Mykuhl said:


> You could try treating the tank with PolyGuard made by Seachem first, before you treat them with the levimasole since whatever else is affecting them will kill them faster than the worms, then treat them for the worms. PolyGuard is a good broad spectrum medication meant to treat several different bacterial and parasitic infections, but will not kill callamanus worms.


Alright, I'll ask Big Al's about it tomorrow as well, thanks for the help!


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## darkangel66n (May 15, 2013)

Big Al's is the worst place to go for advice. You likely got the damn problem from their cheap imported guppies. Are there no smaller shops around you where you could get help? Honestly though any cure is likely to cost more then the fish.


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## cross7fu (Dec 9, 2012)

darkangel66n said:


> Big Al's is the worst place to go for advice. You likely got the damn problem from their cheap imported guppies. Are there no smaller shops around you where you could get help? Honestly though any cure is likely to cost more then the fish.


Except Big Al's there are Aquatic Kingdom, Petsmart and another aquarium store, but I don't trust any of them 100%...that's why I'm asking here as well, I guess I'll put all the advices together and see what seems to be the best thing to do


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## woopderson (Feb 12, 2014)

Perhaps Finatics? They are in Mississauga as well.


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## cross7fu (Dec 9, 2012)

woopderson said:


> Perhaps Finatics? They are in Mississauga as well.


Yes that too, but I'm not interested into cichlids so I don't go there. Are they more knowledgeable?


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## woopderson (Feb 12, 2014)

They specialize in Cichlids, but carry a good selection of other FW stuff. They might be able to help. Perhaps give them a call? They are pretty honest and straightforward.


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## cross7fu (Dec 9, 2012)

woopderson said:


> They specialize in Cichlids, but carry a good selection of other FW stuff. They might be able to help. Perhaps give them a call? They are pretty honest and straightforward.


Sure I'll ask them as well, thanks!


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## woopderson (Feb 12, 2014)

No problem!

Let us know how things pan out. Rooting for you!


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## cross7fu (Dec 9, 2012)

Ok I'm back from Big Al's and Aquatic Kingdom, I think I've made a simple mistake. The water from my backyard's tap might not be hooked up with the soft water machine but probably still chlorinated, so the chlorine killed the guppies, which explains the dissolved fins, but AK don't think the red spikes are parasites. So I just came home, I changed the water with another tank's water, and see if the guppies are fine, also I'll check if any of them have signs of parasites.


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## darkangel66n (May 15, 2013)

Chlorine will not kill your fish. You would need to put them into a pool for that to happen. Your house water is far more of an issue for you. If it is an RO type unit it strips out to much of the mineral content and if it is a salt system it works via ion exchange and is ot suitable for fish.


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## cross7fu (Dec 9, 2012)

Damnit......alright, I'm looking up to the red spike thing now, I found two fish have it and isolated them, will get back to you guys if I found out any possible causes.


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## KeyLime (May 4, 2014)

cross7fu said:


> Ok I'm back from Big Al's and Aquatic Kingdom, I think I've made a simple mistake. The water from my backyard's tap might not be hooked up with the soft water machine but probably still chlorinated, so the chlorine killed the guppies, which explains the dissolved fins, but AK don't think the red spikes are parasites. So I just came home, I changed the water with another tank's water, and see if the guppies are fine, also I'll check if any of them have signs of parasites.


It doesn't really explain the dissolved fins, and those are worms sticking out.


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## KeyLime (May 4, 2014)

cross7fu said:


> Damnit......alright, I'm looking up to the red spike thing now, I found two fish have it and isolated them, will get back to you guys if I found out any possible causes.


Hardly any use isolating them. The whole tank needs to be treated as soon as you get a grip on water treatment. Splitting them up just makes things harder for you to do.


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## KeyLime (May 4, 2014)

Mykuhl said:


> Those red spikes coming out of the anus really appear to be callamanus worms.


Check



> These worms are deadly parasites, highly contagious and WILL eventually kill every fish that it infects, and it will infect every fish. You need to get yourself some levamisole and and treat every tank you have with the medication or it will likely reappear. If your fish are eating also f st some food with levamisole and feed them that. You can get both products online from Angelfins.
> 
> It looks like they are suffering from other issues as well...the dissolves fins and red gills show that it is not just the worms. Perhaps a bacterial infection took a hold as well. Those worms will not kill fish within one day of appearing. I wish I could tell you for.sure.what else is going on but I am no expert.


They probably were there a long while.



> will get back to you guys if I found out any possible causes.


 Mykuhl identified them.

https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/...xetvmbXUBWY1uvUzzHAoisjr-1Giii_2iNNTFfm2xd6aj
This medicine is very good: flubendazole http://angelfins.ca/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=47 Too bad it's only 5%. I've been trying to order the 10% myself because it's so great almost all purpose stuff and no bad effects. Watch out for massive snail die off if you have lots of snails, though. That could cause a problem in the water.
Levamisole is the traditional treatment for these worms, but flubendazole is great stuff. Gets flukes and lots of different kinds of worms and other pests. This is a medicine I would give every time I get new fish.

Anglefins is not shipping till next week. Holidays I guess. 
This is the same med but looks like a better deal. I'll check for the %. http://www.ebay.ca/sch/i.html?_trks...RC0.H0&_nkw=Kusuri+Fluke+M&_sacat=0&_from=R40


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## Mykuhl (Apr 8, 2013)

I tried the flubendazole Kusuri wormer plus product from Angelfins on the rams that had those worms and it did nothing. I would have bought the levimasole but it was not available at the time. 

If you are able to find so me of the 10% stuff let me know. I would to.buy some as well to have on hand.


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## KeyLime (May 4, 2014)

Mykuhl said:


> I tried the flubendazole Kusuri wormer plus product from Angelfins on the rams that had those worms and it did nothing. I would have bought the levimasole but it was not available at the time.
> 
> If you are able to find so me of the 10% stuff let me know. I would to.buy some as well to have on hand.


Thanks. I was just checking and saw that response stated from some others too. I never used it for callamanus. And it was used at 15 % before.

Fenbendazole is said to be the best for these worms, but there are problems involved in water treatment and so the fish need to eat it. I hate treatments that the fish need to eat.

I'll PM you about the flubendazole


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## cross7fu (Dec 9, 2012)

KeyLime said:


> Mykuhl identified them.
> 
> https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/...xetvmbXUBWY1uvUzzHAoisjr-1Giii_2iNNTFfm2xd6aj
> This medicine is very good: flubendazole http://angelfins.ca/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=47 Too bad it's only 5%. I've been trying to order the 10% myself because it's so great almost all purpose stuff and no bad effects. Watch out for massive snail die off if you have lots of snails, though. That could cause a problem in the water.
> ...


I just wanna do some research myself, it's my responsibility, and you guys are right. The meds looks good, but what 5% 10% means?


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## KeyLime (May 4, 2014)

cross7fu said:


> I just wanna do some research myself, it's my responsibility, and you guys are right. The meds looks good, but what 5% 10% means?


The concentration of the active ingredient in the powder. 
Some of the medicines give bad effects if dosed in the water, so be careful and remember some of these will kill snails and other creatures.


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## KeyLime (May 4, 2014)

Try doing several 5-10% water changes instead of 50 % at one time. 
There is chloramine in tapwater, but small water changes are OK. The chloramine gets used up by the dirt in the water.
The other problem is that tapwater comes under pressure and so gases from air are dissolved in it, and they come out once in your tank and can hurt the fish if you do too much at one time.


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## cross7fu (Dec 9, 2012)

KeyLime said:


> Try doing several 5-10% water changes instead of 50 % at one time.
> There is chloramine in tapwater, but small water changes are OK. The chloramine gets used up by the dirt in the water.
> The other problem is that tapwater comes under pressure and so gases from air are dissolved in it, and they come out once in your tank and can hurt the fish if you do too much at one time.


Ok, I'm gonna order this now, gonna update after I used it, thanks guys


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## KeyLime (May 4, 2014)

cross7fu said:


> Ok, I'm gonna order this now, gonna update after I used it, thanks guys


Please note that there are reports that Levamisole and Fenbendazole are better than Flubendazole (Kusuri Wormer Plus) for this worm. It might not be useful for this worm.

Levamisole, it's said, seems to knock them out but then you have to vacuum them out of the tank very well.
Fenbendazole is said to kill them, but it's best to put it in the food by various possible means; use high proof drinking alcohol to mix with the medicine and then spray it on flake food and dry it off, or make a gel food with hot water, ground up fish food and gelatin and the medicine. Or the fish might eat freeze-dried small bloodworms/tubifex soaked in the meds.

I can do a little more research and find some complete warnings and instructions for both Levamisole and Fenbendazole for you by tomorrow.

Are all the fish still eating? What kind of tank set up do you have? Gravel, live plants ?


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## KeyLime (May 4, 2014)

Here's a thread. Not all fish react as badly as Discus to water treatments.

Here's Fenbendazole in flake food. http://www.angelsplus.com/FlakeMedWorm.htm
DeWorm 1

And specifically mentioned for those worms is Levamisole flake food
DeWorm 3

Very reliable seller. It's not very expensive. Might as well get 1 and 3.


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## cross7fu (Dec 9, 2012)

KeyLime said:


> Please note that there are reports that Levamisole and Fenbendazole are better than Flubendazole (Kusuri Wormer Plus) for this worm. It might not be useful for this worm.
> 
> Levamisole, it's said, seems to knock them out but then you have to vacuum them out of the tank very well.
> Fenbendazole is said to kill them, but it's best to put it in the food by various possible means; use high proof drinking alcohol to mix with the medicine and then spray it on flake food and dry it off, or make a gel food with hot water, ground up fish food and gelatin and the medicine. Or the fish might eat freeze-dried small bloodworms/tubifex soaked in the meds.
> ...


Thanks man, my tank is 20gal, I got garden gravel as substrate, some hardy plants, a few assassin snails and a golden snail.
The website for that medicine is not doing doing business until 17th-ish, I'm not sure if the two fish with parasites can wait that long...


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## KeyLime (May 4, 2014)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Fish-De-Wor...514?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a2adf7ee2

Here's one


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## cross7fu (Dec 9, 2012)

KeyLime said:


> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Fish-De-Wor...514?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a2adf7ee2
> 
> Here's one


Ahhh, nice, order placed!
Now I think I'll just wait for the meds...


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