# Smoke like clouds in my new aquarium? Killing oxygen?



## Asterix (Feb 5, 2011)

Hi,

I added a Cylcle solution (SuperBac Aquarium: Nitrifying Bacteria) two days ago to my new aquarium. I then added plants today and a few small fishes. Did not go well at the start....

No oxygen....the cycle solution must have killed of all of the oxygen. The fishes were all at the top of the tank trying to get air. I quickly changed 50% of the water and they are fine now.....

Question:

1. The water cleared out after the big water change 3 hours ago, but now its starting again with these "smoke" like clouds going from the bottom to the top. Is this more bacteria from the cycle that is reproducing extremely quickly?

Must I change more water tonight to make sure that the fishes survive?

Thank you,


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## qwerty (Dec 15, 2009)

Bacterial boosters wont instantly cycle your tank. Some people feel they might speed up the process by a bit, others feel they do absolutely nothing.

Either way, I'd get a test kit for ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate and treat this as an uncycled tank that's cycling.

If the bacteria was alive, it would have needed oxygen in that bottle to stay alive. Even if the bacteria somehow didn't use up all the oxygen in the bottle and die by the time you bought it, then it wouldn't be using up all the oxygen in your aquarium in a matter of hours.

So ammonia toxicity... Maybe nitrite if the bacterial booster worked at all.

As for the white clouds, can't tell you. Bacterial blooms tend to cloud up the water but emitting smokey clouds from the substrate/surfaces of things doesn't sound like a bacterial bloom. I'm not saying that it couldn't be, just that it doesn't sound like any bacterial bloom I've seen. Mind you I've never used a bacterial booster product, so there.

Important thing is to keep on top of the water changes and get those test kits. Seed your filter media if you can get a hold of some older media or substrate from an established and cycled tank.


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## Zebrapl3co (Mar 29, 2006)

Please read all of the sticky in this forum first and understand how they work. I am afraid you've doomed your fish already.
What you need to understand:
1) How to cycle a fish tank.
2) How to perform water changes (using dechlorinators)

Basically, you need to cycle your fish tank first before you add fish. Cycling a fish tank propertly required almost a month or even longer.
Read this:
http://gtaaquaria.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8458

Here's what's happening to your fish right now. The tank is probably going throught a cycle. You are geting either a large amount of chloramine if you didn't dechlor your water or ammonia or nitrite poisoning. These chemicals burns out your fish's gills. As a result your fish can't breath. It's basically like a person having an ashma attack. You breath like crazy but your lungs is not taking in any oxygen. So as a result the fish have to breath pure air just to survive. They will sufer like this for several days until they finally die. There is a very small chance that they will recover.
The other possiblity is that their gills get burned when they tried to breath the water. The smarter fish would surface and breath air instead of water. This scenario is a bit more favourable as a water change will take out some of the toxic chemical from the water. But unfortunately, this will stall your tank's cycling process.

So moving forward, as long as you have fish in there. You need to make frequent water changes every day to curb the toxic build up. This will prolonge your cycling process and will save the fish.

Also, it's a good idea for a beginner to buy an ammonia, nitrite and nitrate test kit. It will help you find you what is wrong with your water.

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## Asterix (Feb 5, 2011)

Hi,

Thanks for the tips. I thought that adding the Cycle product would permit me to add fish the next day. I have also always used Stress-Free products in the tap water that I add to the tank.

I bought the Cycle product at Big Al's and the guy told me that I could actually add fish a few hours after. My tank is 80 gallons and I poured the whole bottle as indicated. Might have been too much....

I have been having PH problems but I have been changing the water regularly + the filter adds a few bubles. The PH is presently fine and all of the fishes are swimming and seem ok. They play in the current, chase each other, swim in a group and are all eating.

I will do the other tests tonight after work to see if there are other problems.

There is still a little "bacteria cloud" moving upwards in the tank. I guess that its a good thing and it means that the cycle is still going.

Question:
Your last post indicated that the fishes will probably die, that they are doomed. Is this still the case?

Cheers,


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## qwerty (Dec 15, 2009)

I wouldn't necessarily say doomed because I have no idea what fish you have or how many fish.

I mean people do use fish to cycle, though it's really not recommended at all.



> I bought the Cycle product at Big Al's and the guy told me that I could actually add fish a few hours after


It's a shitty thing that happens a lot in this hobby. It's their job to sell you stuff, and the more difficulty you have keeping fish alive, the more likely you are to spend more money at the store on replacement fish, medications, pH adjusters, air stones, carbon media, etc. All stuff you probably don't need. A good example is filter sponges which tell you to replace them frequently, but few people ever replace them at all and nobody has problems arise because of it.

Familiarize yourself with the different products in this hobby so you know what you need to buy, when it's useful, and why it's useful.



> I have also always used Stress-Free products in the tap water that I add to the tank.


I'm not sure what you mean by this exactly, but I will say that the only product you really need to use is water dechlorinator. I recommend Seachem Prime, which will also help to lessen the amount of toxic ammonia in your water (it doesn't disappear it just turns to NH4 which wont harm your fish).

Anything else like pH adjusters, etc tend to result in pH swings that are, in _most_ cases, more harmful to your fish than it would be to just have them adjust to a less than ideal pH that's kept stable.

If you happen to know anyone who owns an aquarium that's been properly cycled, ask them if you can take a handful of their substrate, or perhaps some of their media. Transport it wet in dechlorinated water (preferably from their tank) and put it in your filter in contact with your own media.

This will introduce live bacteria to your filter so it will reproduce and establish itself quickly, and is probably the ideal solution. It might also be worth asking the store if they can spare some old media they were going to throw out.

As far as the smokey clouds, I'm pretty sure that's just a sign that you have some product settled in your substrate that's being pulled out by the water circulation or that's slowly diffusing into the water column and it's smoking up your water. What I just mentioned above though will actually introduce live bacteria and WILL actually make your tank habitable in relatively short time.


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## Zebrapl3co (Mar 29, 2006)

Asterix said:


> ...I bought the Cycle product at Big Al's and the guy told me that I could actually add fish a few hours after. My tank is 80 gallons and I poured the whole bottle as indicated. Might have been too much....


*sigh* Big Al's kids. Usually the only person worth paying attention to is the fish room manager. The rest of the other kids are probably just reading it off the lable. Once in a while, they do have some kids who knows what they are talking about, but the good kids don't stay long as the pay is minimal.
I am not saying he's entirely wrong, but his advice is outdated and missleading. If you use cycle products, you shouldn't add fish to the tank. 
You need to understand what is in the cycle product. They are all various forms of locked up ammonia type chemical (if the company have any sense of decency to lock it up so they don't kill the fish.) There shouldn't be any bacteria in there as the bacteria would not survive as mentioned by qwerty. And beside, if they some how miraculously survived, they would probably use up the entire bottle while is was sitting in the store shelve for months. So I don't think the company is really that stupid to add bacteria into the bottle.
(There are some cycle products that actually have bacteria, but they are not sold in Canada. But you can tell as they required to be refrigerated and expires in a week.)
Anyway, ammonia itself is toxic to fish, but this will also grow your first line of bacteria in your cycling process. The ammonia eating bacteria will produce nitrite as a by product. Nitrite is less toxic than ammonia but still toxic to your fish. This is the stage where the fish will get hit the most from the use of cycling products. Most cycle products is a form of "locked up" ammonia, it won't hurt the fish and also benefit the bacteria. This is good, but there is no way they can control the nitrite produced by the bacteria. Your fish will have nitrite poisoning. That is what alot of beginners and some intermediate hobbiest don't get. It doesn't look like that guy from BA understands this either if he tells you to add fish.
Anyway, too long a post and probably too much information. Long story short:
- nitrite will feed the nitrite eating bacteria (your second line of bacteria), which produce nitrate.
- nitrate is usually the final product because we have not reach the technology stage where we can quickly process nitrate fast enough. (... well ... mechanically anyway)
- And that is why we must do frequent water changes.

Without repeating, qwerty post good advice.

The only thing I want to add is that take a dirty media sponge over gravel any day. Unless the person is running an undergravel filter, there is not much bacteria in the gravels. I remember reading some where that there is less than 15% or 20% (can't remember) of the bacteria in the entire tank wall and top 2" of the gravel. Everything is in the filter, hence why your tank cycles and your fish dies if your filter stop running for more than a few days. If you go the route of geting a seeded media from some one. Most people usually have snails. Not sure what your take on that it. But some people really don't like it and find them selves cycling their tank again 6 months later.

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## Asterix (Feb 5, 2011)

Hi,

That is a godd idea!! I do know someone at work who has a long running tank.

I wish that I had never poured the "Cycle" product a few days ago. I had no intention of harming the fish and I'm upset that the store did not warn me adequatly. The good thing is that the fish look heathly at the present time (eating, playing in current etc..)

**** I bought 9 Pencil fish and 4 small White fin Tetras****
**** By Stress-Free I mean I'm using a dechloring product****

I'm also checking PH levels often and I raised my filter outake to make sure that lots of bubbles are formed as it rushed inside of the water.

I took pretty much all of the initial water out in the past 2 days with all of the different water changes. The "Cycle" product had killed most of the oxygen. Cant believe the store I bought it in did not warn me.......


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