# is this bad?- air pump question



## PACMAN (Mar 4, 2010)

is it bad to have my two-output pump have both outlets come into a T and then the air goes to the tank from the bottom of the T? I.E. will it be too much strain on the pump? If i have it plumbed like this, the air pump makes much less noise

Air in ---> "T" <-----air in

.............. |
.............. |
.............. |
.............. V
Air to tank airstone


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## Zebrapl3co (Mar 29, 2006)

Probably, why do you have to do it like that? Is one air in not sufficient?

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## PACMAN (Mar 4, 2010)

Zebrapl3co said:


> Probably, why do you have to do it like that? Is one air in not sufficient?


1 air in is definitely sufficient, but i find this pump is loud! (although ive never had an airpump before to compare). If I block the second output altogether, or if i tie them into the same line, it seems that the noise is reduced.

But I guess I'd better not do that. I have to go to BA and get them to start one so I can compare my volume to theirs.


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## Chris S (Dec 19, 2007)

If your airpump is supposed to have 2 outputs, then T'ing them both into one line is not a problem. It just pushes more air through the tubing. I've done the same thing with many air pumps without a problem.


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## PACMAN (Mar 4, 2010)

yeah i just didnt know if it would strain the pump, since the 2 air streams would push into eachother, before finding the top part of the T, thus providing resistance, and possibly making the pump work harder?


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## AquaNekoMobile (Feb 26, 2010)

PACMAN said:


> 1 air in is definitely sufficient, but i find this pump is loud! (although ive never had an airpump before to compare). If I block the second output altogether, or if i tie them into the same line, it seems that the noise is reduced.
> 
> But I guess I'd better not do that. I have to go to BA and get them to start one so I can compare my volume to theirs.


What model pump and make do you have? I suggest you take a piece of paper and write down 3-4 distances from the pump. Use a ruler to measure the distances out. First would be at the pump say 1-2" from the pump, next 1ft, 5ft, and say 10ft.

If you have a dB meter check against those distances and note the dB at your set distances. I have a Hagen Maxima and IIRC it was ~2cm the dB reading was something like 70dB. Yah it hums good. Without the sound tester note the sound and write it down on paper at the distances with a reference sound you know of.

http://www.gcaudio.com/resources/howtos/loudness.html

http://www.sengpielaudio.com/TableOfSoundPressureLevels.htm

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1590/is_12_58/ai_84546930/

http://www.makeitlouder.com/Decibel Level Chart.txt - holy crap -80dB is shrimp chewing @100meters underwater?  Awesome references!

Take the pump with you and go to the Radioshack. Ask them to see the sound meters. IIRC it uses a 9v battery so bring one with you as I find sometimes it is a hassle with the guys at the Ratshack pulling batteries out to test stuff. With having your own batteries it just shows prepareness on your end if they try to shoot you down testing something by saying 'sorry no batteries so you can't test it'. BTW it's fall and a good time to change your smoke alarm batteries so you'll have spare 9v's still in good condition (~8v left instead of the ~9.5v fresh).

Also check out audio shops. Futureshop IIRC has home entertainment rooms which you can (I recommend calling before going) to see if they have a dB sound checker in the store. I know Best Buy has an open concept for thier home entertainment setup but still call them up and check as well. Also check out audiophile stores around the place. Yellow Pages for Hi-Fi shops in your area or check local high shops on google in T.O. If you're in the P.Mall area I know of a few audiophile places around here. There a place at Centre Point Mall (across the street of the mall) and some shop up in Unionville. Call around and ask if they got a dB checker before going to save time/travel/money. I would think most audiophile stores would more likely have the dB meters.

Anyways, just places to get a reading. Make sure you go prepared with everything written down on paper and have a ruler with you or cut out distance references and note the sounds. Then if you're hunting for another air pump later find out thier dB rating and reference against your set of numbers and some numbers in the links provided.

Hope that helps.


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## PACMAN (Mar 4, 2010)

Thanks for the detailed reply!

I have a TetraROAR 60 (TetraWhisper 60) 

I guess I could go the calculate the dB route. I dont mind the volume if that is how loud it should be, but if i try one at BA and its much quieter, then I def want to return the one i have and exchange


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## AquaNekoMobile (Feb 26, 2010)

PACMAN said:


> Thanks for the detailed reply!
> 
> I have a TetraROAR 60 (TetraWhisper 60)
> 
> I guess I could go the calculate the dB route. I dont mind the volume if that is how loud it should be, but if i try one at BA and its much quieter, then I def want to return the one i have and exchange


Any other details you can see on the pump? Like psi rating? Watt, etc?

Check the Rena 200 out.

http://www.planetrena.com/aquarium-air-pumps.html

http://www.bigalsonline.ca/Fish_Aeration-Equipment_Air-Pumps_Air-Pump_10127361_102.html?tc=fish

Rated 50gal but at less then 30dB claim that is good. I would expect the larger the pump it'll be louder but if thier claim of less then 30dB is still on thier largest model hot diggity damn.  I see your Tetra 60 is ~$21 @ BA and the Rena 200 is ~$32 so a $11 price difference but from all I've read Rena's are the best in terms of sound and they do post thier dB claim ratings unlike the others which you practically have to get a hold of thier R&D dept. to even see if they'll know.


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## PACMAN (Mar 4, 2010)

hmm, maybe ill spend the extra 11. I'm at work, but will check the dBa ratings when i get in. I'm stupid. I totally forgot to read the device for information. You are right, there's no info on the box!


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## Zebrapl3co (Mar 29, 2006)

PACMAN said:


> yeah i just didnt know if it would strain the pump, since the 2 air streams would push into eachother, before finding the top part of the T, thus providing resistance, and possibly making the pump work harder?


You are correct. That would cause the diaphram to work twice as hard and therefore wear it down alot faster than it's expected life time. The other common scenario is that the back pressure will cause the diaphram to blow a leak and the efficiency will go down to working as if it was a single pump instead of two separate pump.
Don't know if you have any experience with a tire pump but it's basically the same concept.

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## matti2uude (Jan 10, 2009)

Why don't you just have two airlines running two airstones in your tank? Or have one running a sponge filter, you can never have too much filtration IMO. Or an even better idea, get a second tank for the other airline.


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## PACMAN (Mar 4, 2010)

matti2uude said:


> Why don't you just have two airlines running two airstones in your tank? Or have one running a sponge filter, you can never have too much filtration IMO. Or an even better idea, get a second tank for the other airline.


i will have to choose from these options at big als tonight lol.


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## AquaNekoMobile (Feb 26, 2010)

Or to followup on Mattitude's idea why not take some spare gravel and a 'T' and roll out some airline to a window or light over head and make a mini hydroponic garden. You got the airpump already. A couple sport drink or 2L bottles, knife/scissors, and an air stone and you're good to go. Like basil? Tomatos? Romaine lettuce? 

Hehe....


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## pat3612 (Jan 29, 2008)

Is this a new pump or used.


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## PACMAN (Mar 4, 2010)

lol Neko, not sure if those I live with would appreciate hydroponics in the house.



It is a brand new pump I purchased.

I went to BA 'sauga yesterday and was told it was normal to hear the pump, so I guess i'll just put up with it


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## Riceburner (Mar 14, 2008)

It will probably do nothing to the pump. We're not talking precision or high pressure here, it's an air pump. You could run 2 lines for an air stone and filter or 2 air stones, etc. Realistically what back pressure does an air stone give? It's not like they are calibrated, etc. I have an adjuster on one of my pumps, which basically is a valve that limits the amount of air going to the stone. Therefore it restricts the air after coming from the pump, creating more back pressure. Doesn't affect the pump. If you T it though, do it with 2 equal lengths. Probably won't make a difference, but just in case.


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## Zebrapl3co (Mar 29, 2006)

This is pulled from one of the manual from Hagen Elite pump model:
Pg 5:
INSTALLATION TIPS:
...
Air control valves with multiple outlets may also be used to
power additional apparatus in the aquarium. When using
multiple air valves, it is recommended to have one more
outlet than required by the accessories; this will be used to
bleed overproduction of air due to back pressure build up.
For more information about back pressure see (BACK
PRESSURE).
...
AIR FLOW ADJUSTMENT
In order to achieve correct airflow, a balance between the
valve setting and the pump output is necessary. The ideal
setting is obtained by minimum back pressure or nonrestriction
of flow of air. Never physically restrict the output of the pump.
Restriction causes damage to the diaphragm. (SEE BACK
PRESSURE). Adjust air valve output as required.
...
BACK PRESSURE
Back pressure is the buildup of pressure on the diaphragm due
to restricted air flow. This occurs when excess air is produced
by the air pump, or when the air channels are inadvertantly
blocked. Back pressure over time resulting from clogged air
stones or other air system blockages and restrictions will cause
the diaphragm to expand or rupture. An expanded diaphragm
leads to a loss of air volume while a rupture results in the total
loss of air.

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## Riceburner (Mar 14, 2008)

Yeah, a complete block would destroy the pump, but we talking about 2 into 1. At most this is a restriction, and probably not much of one.


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