# Quarantine time/mandarins/feeding



## carmenh

What's everyone's opinion on minimum quarantine time? I got a 6 line wrasse and a psychedelic mandarin on Saturday at Big Al's. Both are fat and happy but I worry about feeding the mandarin for an extended period in the q tank. I put in a chunk of pod-filled LR from my main tank but I think it's been decimated already...
Also, I chose these 2 types hoping they would be red-flatworm eaters. Would siphoning some flatworms and adding just those to the q tank help "train" them to eat flatworms? Or should I try to harvest more pods? Anywhere one can buy pods in the gta?


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## conix67

carmenh said:


> What's everyone's opinion on minimum quarantine time? I got a 6 line wrasse and a psychedelic mandarin on Saturday at Big Al's. Both are fat and happy but I worry about feeding the mandarin for an extended period in the q tank. I put in a chunk of pod-filled LR from my main tank but I think it's been decimated already...
> Also, I chose these 2 types hoping they would be red-flatworm eaters. Would siphoning some flatworms and adding just those to the q tank help "train" them to eat flatworms? Or should I try to harvest more pods? Anywhere one can buy pods in the gta?


If you have sixline, even if he's not bullying mandarin, it will decimate of pods quickly, so Mandarin will not get its chance to consume pods.

Before QT'ing, I'd decide if you want to keep both fishes together.


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## ChefMark

+10
You are going to run into probs trying to keep that Mandarin IMHO.
They are both going to eat pods but the sixline will out compete the Mandarin.
Some mandarins might not eat Worms as a buddy of mine has one and it only eats pods. 
I would do what above said and pick one of the two. If you are going to QT the mandarin Now is the time to try and train it on prepared food.
Their is a thread on here about it lemme look.
http://gtaaquaria.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17709
Read the hole post as there is alot of good info .


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## caker_chris

usually sea-u-marine has pods for sale, and i believe that oakville reef gallery has them as well.


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## marblerye

congrats on the new purchase! any pictures of the new additions? now comes the difficult part..

I'm all for training any type of dragonet because it's a great supplement to their diet. mandarins who accept prepared foods such as frozen or pellet all still have a natural instinct to hunt for pods and eat all day during lights on. the goal is to fatten them up as much as you can and keep them that way. Even a large tank (75g+) with tons of live rock can be wiped clean of pods by a single mandarin on a pod only diet so it's best to be well prepared. a refugium is almost a must in this case as it's a pod factory with closed doors.

you can contact hubert over at reefaquatica.com as he regularly stocks reefpods which is excellent to seed your refugium with. I find that keeping a stable population of copepods and amphipods in the refugium is key to replenishing the display tank as pod eaters will clean the tank out on a daily basis. Feeding your refugium phytoplankton after you establish a good population of pods is highly recommended as well as you will litereally see an explosion of pods within weeks doing so. SUM also has DT copepods from time to time but haven't heard any DT shipment announcements as of late.

as for the sixline; i've kept one for a friend in a QT and later my display tank briefly and he really does devour all pods in the tank faster than anything I've ever seen. However, these fish can (hopefully) accept prepared foods so if you try and keep it well fed like I did it would slow down the pod diet a bit. I had to keep it for 8 weeks and within that time it was really a hassle to keep it well fed so that it wouldn't go hungry without pods so that method isn't the best idea considering overfeeding would ruin your tank water as well...

here's a crappy photo of my two giants. they hang out all the time without incident which is awesome because i was worried they wouldn't get along in the beginning.. and i've got a lawnmower blenny too, who also hangs with the dragons often too


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## marblerye

i've read a few scientific journals at the ROM's library on mandarins and their diet isn't 100% copepods or other pods in the wild. what amazed me was they found after dissecting nearly two dozen mandarins and analyzing their stomachs was that they all differed which led the researchers to believe they basically eat anything live they can fit in their mouths but they have to find it tasty to them. flat worms i have no experience with as i do not have any, but i wouldn't be surprized if yours did eat them or tried to eat them. i noticed recently that my dragonets would eat mini-brittle starfish and different types of worms so long as they do not have bristles. now from time to time i'd grab a few mini starfish from my refugium and throw them in and watch them hunt; it's really quite amusing!

as for the quarantine period, i've read mixed comments about it due to their thick slimy skin that parasites and bacteria such as ich have trouble sticking to them. that is.. unless you have a heavily stressed mandarin who sheds that slime like there is no tomorrow. i've gotten away with a brief quarantine period of 1 week and 2 days and within that time was when i got the mandarin trained on some formula 1 pellets and after that it went straight into my smaller refugium for a day to fatten up a bit on pods and pellets before it hit the display. i felt mine was stressed as it kept swimming around so i rushed things along...


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## carmenh

Well, I'm in it now...I already have both of them, in the q tank. They both have to go in my reef...they'd be puffer food in my other tank...
The tank they're going into is a well established 90 gallon with a ridiculous amount of LR. It's only other fish inhabitants are 2 sebae clowns. They lived peacefully with a 6 line until he taught me the importance of tank covers :-(
I didn't just jump into this, I've done the research and knew about the difficulties mandarins present, but honestly, it never occurred to me that the 6 line would create an issue. My other one was a hog, happily chowing down on any food I gave...
I did pick the 2 fish out of the same tank at the store. The mandarin was the fattest, bossiest one there. He had everyone else, including the 6 line, cornered  He's not shy in the q tank at all. 
I'll just give it a go and hope. I don't have a fuge but will get the HOB one they have at MOPS if I need to, or section off part of my other tank as a fuge, and I have no issue buying pods (as long as I can get them!) once in a while if re-seeding is neccessary...
Any other input/advice is welcome, though I'm committed to keeping them both...


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## marblerye

carmenh said:


> Well, I'm in it now...I already have both of them, in the q tank. They both have to go in my reef...they'd be puffer food in my other tank...
> The tank they're going into is a well established 90 gallon with a ridiculous amount of LR. It's only other fish inhabitants are 2 sebae clowns. They lived peacefully with a 6 line until he taught me the importance of tank covers :-(
> I didn't just jump into this, I've done the research and knew about the difficulties mandarins present, but honestly, it never occurred to me that the 6 line would create an issue. My other one was a hog, happily chowing down on any food I gave...
> I did pick the 2 fish out of the same tank at the store. The mandarin was the fattest, bossiest one there. He had everyone else, including the 6 line, cornered  He's not shy in the q tank at all.
> I'll just give it a go and hope. I don't have a fuge but will get the HOB one they have at MOPS if I need to, or section off part of my other tank as a fuge, and I have no issue buying pods (as long as I can get them!) once in a while if re-seeding is neccessary...
> Any other input/advice is welcome, though I'm committed to keeping them both...


awesome looking tank! i love how the actinics are on and it washes all the colors out except the orange montis... lol

i feel i must apologize if my comments above implied directly or indirectly that you shouldn't keep them both. I was just trying to offer some input on my experience with each type of fish, and give you some idea of what to expect if you should keep them both which you are and that's great! my train of thought back then when i added a mandarin goby was, "I feel up to the challenge, so I'm gonna do it!"

people on any forum may advise you against it. heck, a few people did so to me when i decided to keep 2 dragonets in a single 65 gallon tank. I heard it all... _'must be 75 gallon or larger...'_ ... _'they will die within months...'_ ... _'ONLY one will survive! Get rid of one while it's still alive!'_ (all of which were not on this forum so don't worry)

It was good, solid, logical advice, don't get me wrong but I went ahead and did it anyway and I'm VERY happy with the result!  It feels even better to prove them wrong, even though the odds weren't that great for me. It's doable, but it might be a bit difficult that's all. They are both beautifully colored fish, and when they are in the display they'll look amazing.

BTW.. woww so many caves! i have a strange feeling as soon as you put him (mandarin) in there he's gonna disappear into the rock work for a while.. lol post pics of him when you can! I love how adorable their tiny little faces are..


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## marblerye

here's my little monster.. isn't he the cutest thing........ lol


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## explor3r

It looks adorable, froggy face


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## gucci17

That's my favourite fish...I can't wait to own one


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## carmenh

It really doesn't looked that washed out, I just don't have a camera that can deal with all the blue and actinic  The eyes on the chalices glow in person, and the frogspawn on the right has bright green tips! I've yet to get a pic that does it justice.
No need to apologize, I'm not that sensitive  You and the others gave me a good eye opener! I try to be responsable and research but I dropped the ball on this one...never thought twice about the 6 line, been there done that, and thought I had all a mandarin would need, but obviously the combo will require extra care, so better I know now then whan a beloved fish wastes away...I adore them already...the mandarin is such a pushy little sh**...just what I like! And the wrasse is a clown!

I will def post pics down the line...thanks again!



marblerye said:


> awesome looking tank! i love how the actinics are on and it washes all the colors out except the orange montis... lol
> 
> i feel i must apologize if my comments above implied directly or indirectly that you shouldn't keep them both. I was just trying to offer some input on my experience with each type of fish, and give you some idea of what to expect if you should keep them both which you are and that's great! my train of thought back then when i added a mandarin goby was, "I feel up to the challenge, so I'm gonna do it!"
> 
> people on any forum may advise you against it. heck, a few people did so to me when i decided to keep 2 dragonets in a single 65 gallon tank. I heard it all... _'must be 75 gallon or larger...'_ ... _'they will die within months...'_ ... _'ONLY one will survive! Get rid of one while it's still alive!'_ (all of which were not on this forum so don't worry)
> 
> It was good, solid, logical advice, don't get me wrong but I went ahead and did it anyway and I'm VERY happy with the result!  It feels even better to prove them wrong, even though the odds weren't that great for me. It's doable, but it might be a bit difficult that's all. They are both beautifully colored fish, and when they are in the display they'll look amazing.
> 
> BTW.. woww so many caves! i have a strange feeling as soon as you put him (mandarin) in there he's gonna disappear into the rock work for a while.. lol post pics of him when you can! I love how adorable their tiny little faces are..


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## carmenh

Awesome 



marblerye said:


> here's my little monster.. isn't he the cutest thing........ lol


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## 50seven

Love it! I'm gonna get one from Kumar when he gets back in 2 weeks. He's got some for $15 which have been there for at least 3 weeks, but it will be 5 weeks when he gets back. Which means they will have probably adapted well to eating frozen food... so one of those guys will probably be my next addition.


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## marblerye

ummm... just curious but who's kumar?

hopefully i'm not the only one lost here..


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## 50seven

marblerye said:


> ummm... just curious but who's kumar?
> 
> hopefully i'm not the only one lost here..


Marine fish importer + wholesaler in Pickering. Recently started selling to the public out of his basement. (Is also on this forum with the same user name) I don't think he has site retailer status, so PM me for more details.


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## carmenh

Aw frig 
Both fish are doing beautifully, but I found out this morning what caulerpa "going sexual" looks like. Guess the crappy lights and different sched triggered it. I woke up and the quarantine tank was pea soup! Had a heart attack , did a 50% water change, threw some purigen in the filter and ran off to work (late).
Will do another big one tonight...
Also getting some DT's pods at ORG tonight...


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## marblerye

ohhh no! that's terrible!

hope everything's fine now though. i'm curious what the lighting schedule was that can cause caulerpa to do this.. as I'm trying to phase out my caulerpa and keep only chaeto but it's really stuck onto the rock in my refugium..


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## carmenh

Sorry. missed this...don't really know anyhow but didn't mean to ignore you  A lot of folks on another forum say they light their caulerpa 24/7 and trim regularly to prevent it going sexual but I'd still be cautious and keep it VERY trimmed so that if it happens, it won't pollute your tank too much!

Anyhow, the madarin's doing awesome. I discovered last week that he (and the 6line) go KOO KOO BANANAS INSANE over frozen Cyclopeze. It's a little pricey but goes a very long way...

Here's a pic...that's not ich, btw, it's his markings and a bit of salt on the glass!












marblerye said:


> ohhh no! that's terrible!
> hope everything's fine now though. i'm curious what the lighting schedule was that can cause caulerpa to do this.. as I'm trying to phase out my caulerpa and keep only chaeto but it's really stuck onto the rock in my refugium..


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## Cypher

If this is the same Kumar from PN, he's actually been selling fish for a long time now. He started out with Discus from Southeast Asia IIRC. Selling marine livestock is relatively new to him in comparison to his experience with freshwater livestock.



50seven said:


> Marine fish importer + wholesaler in Pickering. Recently started selling to the public out of his basement. (Is also on this forum with the same user name) I don't think he has site retailer status, so PM me for more details.


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## 50seven

Cypher said:


> If this is the same Kumar from PN, he's actually been selling fish for a long time now. He started out with Discus from Southeast Asia IIRC. Selling marine livestock is relatively new to him in comparison to his experience with freshwater livestock.


I know he's been in the business for quite a few years. I just recently discovered him and he told me that he had just started advertising to the general public for his marine stuff.

Sorry, not meaning to hijack the thread...


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## marblerye

woww he looks pretty cool! You're right about the awesome part; he looks like he's doing absolutely fine in your tank. 
Didn't know it was a spotted mandarin goby but I guess psychedelic mandarin is often a common name for those guys too. Was totally expecting a green/red/blue mandarin goby like mine. My mistake. 

I wouldn't think it was ich because mandarins are known to have that thick slime coat and are less susceptible to ich. 

Great to see everything is fine and crisis averted!


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## carmenh

Yea, yours looks more "psychedelic" for sure! But I love my little guy  Thanks for the support!



marblerye said:


> woww he looks pretty cool! You're right about the awesome part; he looks like he's doing absolutely fine in your tank.
> Didn't know it was a spotted mandarin goby but I guess psychedelic mandarin is often a common name for those guys too. Was totally expecting a green/red/blue mandarin goby like mine. My mistake.
> 
> I wouldn't think it was ich because mandarins are known to have that thick slime coat and are less susceptible to ich.
> 
> Great to see everything is fine and crisis averted!


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## KeMo

marblerye said:


> woww he looks pretty cool! You're right about the awesome part; he looks like he's doing absolutely fine in your tank.
> Didn't know it was a spotted mandarin goby but I guess psychedelic mandarin is often a common name for those guys too. Was totally expecting a green/red/blue mandarin goby like mine. My mistake.
> 
> I wouldn't think it was ich because mandarins are known to have that thick slime coat and are less susceptible to ich.
> 
> Great to see everything is fine and crisis averted!


Yea he looks good. Not to skinny or to fat.


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## Sunstar

carmenh said:


> Aw frig
> Both fish are doing beautifully, but I found out this morning what caulerpa "going sexual" looks like. Guess the crappy lights and different sched triggered it. I woke up and the quarantine tank was pea soup! Had a heart attack , did a 50% water change, threw some purigen in the filter and ran off to work (late).
> Will do another big one tonight...
> Also getting some DT's pods at ORG tonight...


Very Freaky isn't it? I think I mentioned it to you the other day, tank goes murky. I had it a couple times and it cleared up on its own,


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## UnderTheSea

50seven said:


> Love it! I'm gonna get one from Kumar when he gets back in 2 weeks. He's got some for $15 which have been there for at least 3 weeks, but it will be 5 weeks when he gets back. Which means they will have probably adapted well to eating frozen food... so one of those guys will probably be my next addition.


Don't assume that because a dragonett has been in an LFS for 5 weeks it will survive in your setup. Many shops (including Kumar) large systems that have sandbeds and rock within them..... THERE ARE PODS in these setups. Train your Mandarin to eat frozen\dry food.

Mandarins will accept a variety of frozen\dry foods, but it does take time to get them on this. If they are unhealthy from the start or stressed in a new setup with limited food source they are not going to start to experiment on new foods.

We currently have 10 pairs of Mandarins ( Synchiropus Splendidus ) and all accept frozen but it did take about a month to get them on the frozen.


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## 50seven

UnderTheSea said:


> Don't assume that because a dragonett has been in an LFS for 5 weeks it will survive in your setup. Many shops (including Kumar) large systems that have sandbeds and rock within them..... THERE ARE PODS in these setups. Train your Mandarin to eat frozen\dry food.
> 
> Mandarins will accept a variety of frozen\dry foods, but it does take time to get them on this. If they are unhealthy from the start or stressed in a new setup with limited food source they are not going to start to experiment on new foods.
> 
> We currently have 10 pairs of Mandarins ( Synchiropus Splendidus ) and all accept frozen but it did take about a month to get them on the frozen.


Practically, how would you go about "training" a mandarin to eat prepared foods? Is this basically putting it in front of him with a turkey baster? or something else?


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## marblerye

50seven said:


> Practically, how would you go about "training" a mandarin to eat prepared foods? Is this basically putting it in front of him with a turkey baster? or something else?


There was a discussion about this topic. You might wanna have a read here as there was a lot of good info in regards to training dragonets - http://www.gtaaquaria.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17709

As I said before, training a dragonet to take prepared foods is a good way to supplement their diet because they will still have a natural instinct to feed on pods all day everyday while the lights are on. If they don't have that steady supply of pods in the tank their health will diminish slowly.

And yes I agree with what UnderTheSea mentioned a few posts back it is good to have a large tank that is established with a live sand bed and live rock which has been setup for a year or more in order for the system to mature and pod populations to grow plentiful.


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